Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Quote:NO! NO! NO!! It's WAY more important to be your child's friend!! They might not think you're cool if you try to actually teach them anything!

 

TMD lives!!!

Quote:The two they took into custody yesterday are not the shooters.  He's still on the loose.  if the presser that's going on now is any indication, the two who were taken into custody were the two on the bus who were the target of the shooter.  They made some disrespectful comment about a friend of the shooter who was killed in a hit and run accident last year.

 

Edgar Robles is the shooter.  16 year old Hispanic male.  His mother said he doesn't spend a lot of time at home, and spends most of his time "flittering around the west side" going from the home of one friend to the next.  I'd say that there's pretty much no parenting happening in this kid's life based on what his own mother told JSO. 

 

I have little doubt a poor home life led to this kid's behavior, but it could be just as likely due to too much corporal punishment as too little, or improperly dispensed.

Quote:I have little doubt a poor home life led to this kid's behavior, but it could be just as likely due to too much corporal punishment as too little, or improperly dispensed.

 

 

I'd go with too little. Kids today if you hit them immediately call CPS and have the law on your tail....

Quote:I have little doubt a poor home life led to this kid's behavior, but it could be just as likely due to too much corporal punishment as too little, or improperly dispensed.

 

Sounds like the exact opposite based on what the mother told JSO. 

Quote:I'd go with too little. Kids today if you hit them immediately call CPS and have the law on your tail....

 

Define "hit"

Quote:Define "hit"

 

 

Spank, swat, slap.....

Quote:Spank, swat, slap.....

 

Plenty of kids do get "hit" by their parents and child protective services are rightfully called.

 

Lack of hitting is not a reason for juvenile crime like this.

Quote:Plenty of kids do get "hit" by their parents and child protective services are rightfully called.

 

Lack of hitting is not a reason for juvenile crime like this.

 

Exactly.  Involved parenting is far more effective than spanking. 

Quote:Exactly. Involved parenting is far more effective than spanking.

So 'involved parenting' can't include spanking?

Quote:So 'involved parenting' can't include spanking?

 

Of course it can, but immediately presuming the shooter(s) went bad because they weren't spanked is over simplifying the situation.

 

I'm not saying you did that, but some here did.

Quote:So 'involved parenting' can't include spanking?

When absolutely necessary, but that would be a last resort type of situation.  In most instances, an open dialogue between parents and kids and involvement in every aspect of their lives will do far more to prevent this kind of situation from occurring than using a heavy hand to dispense discipline. 

 

You don't have to spank to have the respect of your children, and you don't need to raise them in an environment of fear.

Quote:Some of you are jumping to conclusions. We don't even know who the shooters are, yet you are already sure it was due to bad parenting.

Not a conclusion. A general statement that the country would be in a much better place with more parenting being done. No one knows this particular kids background. 

Quote:Not a conclusion. A general statement that the country would be in a much better place with more parenting being done. No one knows this particular kids background. 

I think we're starting to get a much clearer picture of the kid's background now, and the conclusion jumpers seem to be on the right track.

Quote:Listening to the JSO press conference, and they have identified the shooter in this incident.  They also explained the motive.  Apparently, two kids on the bus had a disagreement with two kids NOT on the bus earlier.  The disagreement was over disrespectful things one of the kids said about another student who was killed in a car accident last year.  They agreed to fight over this disrespectful talk.  When the shooter and his buddy approached the bus, words were exchanged, and one of the kids who was the intended target on the bus spit on the shooter from a window on the bus.  At this point, the shooter pulled out his .380 and fired 5 shots into the bus.  They're saying no gang affiliation was associated with this shooting.  The shooter is a 16 year old male. 

 

So this 16 yr old kid shoots into a school bus full of alternative school students because he felt he was "disrespected"?

 

So he could have seriously injured, or even killed, anybody on the bus, just because he felt someone "disrespected " him?

 

So he thinks he can just shoot into a school bus, where 2 people who he felt "disrespected' him are, and just drive off and doesn't think there will be consequences, or just doesn't care?

 

With this kind of thinking, or lack thereof, from some teenagers/young adults, it's no wonder we are seeing what we are seeing from them. It's just so sad to see that complete lack of thought about any consequences for their actions.

Quote: 

With this kind of thinking, or lack thereof, from some teenagers/young adults, it's no wonder we are seeing what we are seeing from them. It's just so sad to see that complete lack of thought about any consequences for their actions.

Sadly kids are being raised where they're taught that they aren't responsible for anything. Accountability is not something society in general feels is important- unless it's the other person's fault- then by God something better be done about it.


It's disturbing and frightening that these people will one day run this country.

Quote:Sadly kids are being raised where they're taught that they aren't responsible for anything. Accountability is not something society in general feels is important- unless it's the other person's fault- then by God something better be done about it.

It's disturbing and frightening that these people will one day run this country.

Every generation says that about the next one in line.

 

Just because there are a preponderance of punks running around shooting without regard for human life, the overwhelming majority of kids are still being raised properly.  The future leadership of this country relatively speaking is secure. 

 

Quote:So this 16 yr old kid shoots into a school bus full of alternative school students because he felt he was "disrespected"?

 

So he could have seriously injured, or even killed, anybody on the bus, just because he felt someone "disrespected " him?

 

So he thinks he can just shoot into a school bus, where 2 people who he felt "disrespected' him are, and just drive off and doesn't think there will be consequences, or just doesn't care?

 

With this kind of thinking, or lack thereof, from some teenagers/young adults, it's no wonder we are seeing what we are seeing from them. It's just so sad to see that complete lack of thought about any consequences for their actions.

 

When you have kids like this who are being raised literally on the streets, this is one possible outcome.  Unfortunately, without proper parental supervision/involvement in their lives, these kids will rarely find their way to a decent path in life.  Some get free of it, but the majority of kids in this situation are destined to repeat the same cycle they were raised in with the next generation, and unfortunately, no amount of tax dollars is going to fix that.  Accountability has to be assumed at their level, or at the very least by their parents, and that's not happening in instances like this. 

Quote:Every generation says that about the next one in line.

 

Just because there are a preponderance of punks running around shooting without regard for human life, the overwhelming majority of kids are still being raised properly.  The future leadership of this country relatively speaking is secure. 

 

 

 

More kids/generations are being raised in homes with no suitable parenting than any other time in this nation's history and it shows with the entitlement attitudes and lack of personal responsibility as well as incidents like this shooting and the rioting in other states (the protesting is fine- rioting not so much). 

 

Sometimes I wonder what the remaining WW2 era folks who are still alive think about the changes that have come about in this country. I don't know any personally anymore as they've all passed away. All the Vietnam era folks talk about is how much the 60's "messed things up big time". 

Quote:Every generation says that about the next one in line.

 

Just because there are a preponderance of punks running around shooting without regard for human life, the overwhelming majority of kids are still being raised properly.  The future leadership of this country relatively speaking is secure. 

 

 

When you have kids like this who are being raised literally on the streets, this is one possible outcome.  Unfortunately, without proper parental supervision/involvement in their lives, these kids will rarely find their way to a decent path in life.  Some get free of it, but the majority of kids in this situation are destined to repeat the same cycle they were raised in with the next generation, and unfortunately, no amount of tax dollars is going to fix that.  Accountability has to be assumed at their level, or at the very least by their parents, and that's not happening in instances like this. 

 

FBT, do you have links to reports about the mother, or the incident in general? The stories I saw showed the apartment complex where she lived, but nothing about her. It didn't look like a particularly bad neighborhood, but looks are deceiving. The reports mentioned the suspect, Edgar Robles, was seldom home, apparently sleeping at friend's homes instead.

 

Supposedly the shooting was in retaliation for an auto accident last year, but I can't find any details about that incident.

 

On a side note, Jacksonville.com sucks. I've never seen a slower loading news site.

Quote:FBT, do you have links to reports about the mother, or the incident in general? The stories I saw showed the apartment complex where she lived, but nothing about her. It didn't look like a particularly bad neighborhood, but looks are deceiving. The reports mentioned the suspect, Edgar Robles, was seldom home, apparently sleeping at friend's homes instead.


Supposedly the shooting was in retaliation for an auto accident last year, but I can't find any details about that incident.


On a side note, Jacksonville.com sucks. I've never seen a slower loading news site.

If you can find any link to the JSO press conference on Friday, that's your best bet. The spokesman outlined all of the details. JSO may post these to their FB page or website. Local media provided an abridged version.


The TU site is terrible.

Quote:Of course it can, but immediately presuming the shooter(s) went bad because they weren't spanked is over simplifying the situation.


I'm not saying you did that, but some here did.

Good post.