I've been 'on board' with the idea of gutting the team and going forward with as much youth as possible; in the hope that in time we'll have the foundation players to build on. However, given that the decision was made (right or wrong) to start our rookie 'franchise' quarterback after initially vowing not to do so... I have to be thinking that Dave's hand is going to be forced into more or less having to invest in more veteran offensive line help... or else his rookie quarterback is going to not develop as hoped.
Seriously, we can't ignore the 'elephant in the room' any longer; our offensive line is a joke! Defenders run through it at will too often and that leads to Bortles either making bad ball decisions or getting sacked... a lot. We've been observing way too much of both of those bad things this season. The lions share of responsibility for it is a poor offensive line. It doesn't matter if they are playing to their full potential... the bottom line is that they aren't getting the job done. Too many of these guys just aren't good enough to even give Bortles a chance. I'm becoming a bit skeptical about joeckel too. I'm just not seeing much consistent 'reasonable' performance. I'm starting to think that Joeckel is too small and weak to be a starting NFL tackle.
I remember when Mark Brunell would get hit and sacked, the guys on the offensive line would get angry! I just don't see that kind of emotion from our guys now; it's almost like they just accept getting beat as inevitable.
Where is the heart???
Bortles needs help!
No kidding.
Quote:I've been 'on board' with the idea of gutting the team and going forward with as much youth as possible; in the hope that in time we'll have the foundation players to build on. However, given that the decision was made (right or wrong) to start our rookie 'franchise' quarterback after initially vowing not to do so... I have to be thinking that Dave's hand is going to be forced into more or less having to invest in more veteran offensive line help... or else his rookie quarterback is going to not develop as hoped.
Seriously, we can't ignore the 'elephant in the room' any longer; our offensive line is a joke! Defenders run through it at will too often and that leads to Bortles either making bad ball decisions or getting sacked... a lot. We've been observing way too much of both of those bad things this season. The lions share of responsibility for it is a poor offensive line. It doesn't matter if they are playing to their full potential... the bottom line is that they aren't getting the job done. Too many of these guys just aren't good enough to even give Bortles a chance. I'm becoming a bit skeptical about joeckel too. I'm just not seeing much consistent 'reasonable' performance. I'm starting to think that Joeckel is too small and weak to be a starting NFL tackle.
I remember when Mark Brunell would get hit and sacked, the guys on the offensive line would get angry! I just don't see that kind of emotion from our guys now; it's almost like they just accept getting beat as inevitable.
Where is the heart???
So you're telling me you decided to start a thread about pretty much all we've been talking about all season around here? Brilliant!
He was just bringing it to the forefront in case anyone forgot...
sorry for pointing out the obvious.... I'll try not to do that again.
Quote:sorry for pointing out the obvious.... I'll try not to do that again.
Sometimes, what is obvious to some is NOT obvious to others.
Quote:...
I remember when Mark Brunell would get hit and sacked, the guys on the offensive line would get angry! I just don't see that kind of emotion from our guys now; it's almost like they just accept getting beat as inevitable.
Where is the heart???
Quote:sorry for pointing out the obvious.... I'll try not to do that again.
No need to apologize, lol. Practically everything we're talking about has been discussed over and over again for at least 10 years in one way or another...
I do thing the last part of your OP which I have bolded above is a relatively new point of view that I haven't seen discussed yet this year... So congrats on that...
I think the idea of our O-line not having a fire lit under them is something we could discuss. I'll be honest, I haven't paid attention to it---but do the linemen go to help BB5 up after every sack?
Where's the fire and brimstone regarding how our O-Line is playing?
We already know the paid "journalists" are apologists for this O-Line from last week's defense of how they played...
Is it possible that the O-line knows they are getting a pass this year, so they don't feel that much accountability for how bad they are playing?
Anyone that has worked in management understands if your people know they won't be held accountable, they will not perform thier best. This is because they have no motivation to push themselves to the limit.
I'm not saying it's not happening, but there are some signs that would suggest that the O-line is indeed lacking the proper motivation. If Bradley and the rest of the coaches are just talking about getting better, and not ripping into the team for thier failures, the team is just gonna coast. I wonder if that's the reason why we're not seeing the improvements we are wanting to see from one week to the next...
Just a thought...
#firefisch is a start to helping BB5
Dude gets flamed for starting this thread yet some around here post the same whiny threads every week. smh..
Quote:#firefisch is a start to helping BB5
Sure, when he should be focusing more on his footwork and mechanics this offseason lets have him instead have to learn a completely new playbook. Great plan.
Quote:Sure, when he should be focusing more on his footwork and mechanics this offseason lets have him instead have to learn a completely new playbook. Great plan.
a playbook that would allow him to succeed along with the rest of the offense. Keep running this playbook we have and you will not see any changes even if hes footwork and mechanics are fixed.
If this entire offensive line were our depth players, we would have an Oline that I would consider consistent with what Bortles deserves. In a perfect world, Joeckel and Beadles are the only ones that should be on that line and performing at a high level this season. The fact that Linder is performing above expectations is a bonus. He shouldn't have even had to play this year, and that's part of the problem IMO. We draft players in the 3rd round and expect them to start right away; we've done it for ten years now it seems.
So far, I consider to be Caldwell a pretty good poker player; he pulled the wool over most everybody's eyes (including some of our own staff and players [loud-mouthed, butter-fingered Cecil Shorts, for example]) by selecting Blake Bortles in the draft. I didn't like the pick, in fact I threw my Jaguars hat at my TV immediately after they announced the pick; I wanted Sammy Watkins. If any of you really think he's going to go with the offensive line that John Oesher and those turds from whatever local sports radio station is in Jacksonville these days, then I feel like you don't know much about the GM.
No one knows what Caldwell is going to do in FA or the draft. I would bet that he intends on building as much as he possibly can around his young QB however, while also fixing some key areas on the D. I don't think, with the truck-load of money we are about to spend, that Caldwell is ready to hitch his wagon to the likes of Luke Buwanko and that wookie-looking RT that we started this season. Those guys, I would expect to be almost guaranteed to be replaced. Hell, Caldwell tried to spend 53 million dollars on a C this past offseason in Alex Mack, do you really think he goes in an entire offseason thinking Luke freaking Bowanko is the answer to arguably the most important position on the offensive line? The person who makes key reads and is vital to protecting his 3rd overall pick?
I'll say this much: If Caldwell ignores the offensive line this offseason, I will be on the side of the knee-jerkers and whiners on this MB.
Quote:I've been 'on board' with the idea of gutting the team and going forward with as much youth as possible; in the hope that in time we'll have the foundation players to build on. However, given that the decision was made (right or wrong) to start our rookie 'franchise' quarterback after initially vowing not to do so... I have to be thinking that Dave's hand is going to be forced into more or less having to invest in more veteran offensive line help... or else his rookie quarterback is going to not develop as hoped.
Seriously, we can't ignore the 'elephant in the room' any longer; our offensive line is a joke! Defenders run through it at will too often and that leads to Bortles either making bad ball decisions or getting sacked... a lot. We've been observing way too much of both of those bad things this season. The lions share of responsibility for it is a poor offensive line. It doesn't matter if they are playing to their full potential... the bottom line is that they aren't getting the job done. Too many of these guys just aren't good enough to even give Bortles a chance. I'm becoming a bit skeptical about joeckel too. I'm just not seeing much consistent 'reasonable' performance. I'm starting to think that Joeckel is too small and weak to be a starting NFL tackle.
I remember when Mark Brunell would get hit and sacked, the guys on the offensive line would get angry! I just don't see that kind of emotion from our guys now; it's almost like they just accept getting beat as inevitable.
Where is the heart???
The team should look to hiring Jim Lachey as the Oline coach if not as an asst Oline coach. He was a Chargers, Raiders & Redskins ProBowl offensive tackle and he coached the Columbus Destroyers during their run to the XXI Arena Bowl in 2007. Its a step in the right direction but talent has to come either in Free Agency or thru the draft. This oline has to be the leagues worst. Glimer of hope with Luke Bowanko Center and Linder Guard... Zane Beadles & Luke Joekel had good moments and bad this year... RT has been relvoing due to injuries... Sam Young tried his hardest but from the false start penalty to missing assignments in the 2nd half it showed that he was thrown into the fire.
Quote:I've been 'on board' with the idea of gutting the team and going forward with as much youth as possible; in the hope that in time we'll have the foundation players to build on. However, given that the decision was made (right or wrong) to start our rookie 'franchise' quarterback after initially vowing not to do so... I have to be thinking that Dave's hand is going to be forced into more or less having to invest in more veteran offensive line help... or else his rookie quarterback is going to not develop as hoped.
Seriously, we can't ignore the 'elephant in the room' any longer; our offensive line is a joke! Defenders run through it at will too often and that leads to Bortles either making bad ball decisions or getting sacked... a lot. We've been observing way too much of both of those bad things this season. The lions share of responsibility for it is a poor offensive line. It doesn't matter if they are playing to their full potential... the bottom line is that they aren't getting the job done. Too many of these guys just aren't good enough to even give Bortles a chance. I'm becoming a bit skeptical about joeckel too. I'm just not seeing much consistent 'reasonable' performance. I'm starting to think that Joeckel is too small and weak to be a starting NFL tackle.
I remember when Mark Brunell would get hit and sacked, the guys on the offensive line would get angry! I just don't see that kind of emotion from our guys now; it's almost like they just accept getting beat as inevitable.
Where is the heart???
To be fair some of this blame has to fall on Fisch... i keep hearing Gus blame Blake for holding on the ball to long... but is anyone open or is the play calling for a deep pass???? confused.
Quote:To be fair some of this blame has to fall on Fisch... i keep hearing Gus blame Blake for holding on the ball to long... but is anyone open or is the play calling for a deep pass???? confused.
well it takes WR lets say 3.5 second to get 25 yards down the field. And BB5 has about 1.8 seconds before he is sacked. i dont think hes holding the ball to long ficsh isnt calling plays to slow the pass rush down. I want to see Draws, Screens, And more rollouts from BB5.
Quote:To be fair some of this blame has to fall on Fisch... i keep hearing Gus blame Blake for holding on the ball to long... but is anyone open or is the play calling for a deep pass???? confused.
If Gus really said that, then I'm more worried about Gus than Fisch.
Quote:well it takes WR lets say 3.5 second to get 25 yards down the field. And BB5 has about 1.8 seconds before he is sacked. i dont think hes holding the ball to long ficsh isnt calling plays to slow the pass rush down. I want to see Draws, Screens, And more rollouts from BB5.
There was 1 RB screen called in the 1st half against the Ravens...that's it.
Quote:a playbook that would allow him to succeed along with the rest of the offense. Keep running this playbook we have and you will not see any changes even if hes footwork and mechanics are fixed.
Really? One ball overthown by 1 yard for a would-be TD to Lee, and one horribly dropped ball by Lewis would have been a 14 point swing in our favor in this game, which would have won it for us. If Lewis holds on, then no blocked punt for TD.
For me it goes:
1. FS
2. Impact LB(s)
3. TE
with the caveat that at least 2-3 big veteran big uglies come in to compete on the line. I would not be surprised to see some lineman taken in the draft as well.