Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Quote:So we have a bunch of slackers on our team?

 

 

Well, I think Gus was put it best when he said the team is "in this race to maturity."

Quote:Donovin Darius is on with Dempsey and Garrard on the Jags show on 1010XL, and he's talking about the fact that he's been mentoring for the Jaguars for the past couple of seasons, and specifically working with Cyprien and now Josh Evans.


He was asked about what he thought was the reason for the struggles this defense is having right now, particularly in pass coverage. He talked about the fact that it's not the coaching or the play calling that's really hurting these players. He said it's the fact that you've got so much youth on the team, particularly in the secondary, that these players need to develop a routine where they're working overtime on technique, and understanding the fundamentals of their positions. Right now, he said that the younger players are struggling to understand things like the difference between cover 2 and cover 3, contain, etc. He said that it's a matter of the young guys buckling down and putting the time in, and he's doing his part to mentor these guys to help them to develop a work ethic that will allow them to succeed.


Anyone who knows where Darius is coming from knows that this guy was the king of routine, and nobody was going to outwork him when it came to developing his skills as a player. To hear that he is in there working with the youngsters to help them develop is a great move by Gus. Darius was saying that Cyprien has developed, and it's showing on the field in how he's recognizing things more quickly.


Darius was talking about Bortles, and how he had an opportunity to spend some time with him talking football, and he said that the guy has the mentality and leadership skills to be a great player for the Jaguars for a lot of years.


BTW, Daris is an Emmy Award winning producer now. He's been doing training videos in partnership with the league and ESPN, and evidently these videos landed him an Emmy Award.

I was at the checkout standing behind DD at the Academy Sports on Atlantic blvd last month. Early in the day and no one else around. I'm not one for bringing attention so I just acted like I didn't know any better and no one else seemed to know who he was. I could tell one of his daughters standing next to him seemed upset that he wasn't getting any attention. After he left I said to the guy at the register that he just checked out DD and he had no clue.

Quote:Isn't that the definition of coaching?

That's what I've always understood it to be.  

 

The coach is responsible for teaching the players what to do...............the players are responsible for doing it.

 

If a player steps onto the field not understanding his assignment, that's the coach's fault. 

Quote:Donovin Darius is on with Dempsey and Garrard on the Jags show on 1010XL, and he's talking about the fact that he's been mentoring for the Jaguars for the past couple of seasons, and specifically working with Cyprien and now Josh Evans.

 

He was asked about what he thought was the reason for the struggles this defense is having right now, particularly in pass coverage.  He talked about the fact that it's not the coaching or the play calling that's really hurting these players.  He said it's the fact that you've got so much youth on the team, particularly in the secondary, that these players need to develop a routine where they're working overtime on technique, and understanding the fundamentals of their positions.  Right now, he said that the younger players are struggling to understand things like the difference between cover 2 and cover 3, contain, etc.  He said that it's a matter of the young guys buckling down and putting the time in, and he's doing his part to mentor these guys to help them to develop a work ethic that will allow them to succeed.

 

Anyone who knows where Darius is coming from knows that this guy was the king of routine, and nobody was going to outwork him when it came to developing his skills as a player.  To hear that he is in there working with the youngsters to help them develop is a great move by Gus.  Darius was saying that Cyprien has developed, and it's showing on the field in how he's recognizing things more quickly.

 

Darius was talking about Bortles, and how he had an opportunity to spend some time with him talking football, and he said that the guy has the mentality and leadership skills to be a great player for the Jaguars for a lot of years. 

 

BTW, Daris is an Emmy Award winning producer now.  He's been doing training videos in partnership with the league and ESPN, and evidently these videos landed him an Emmy Award. 

 

That was a terrific interview.  (...once Darius joined... it was a little snicker-inducing listening to Garrard criticize Bortles for things Garrard himself couldn't get right.)

 

Jessica made a very astute observation as well.

 

She recalled (as many of us here did at the time) how Rashean Mathis was getting lambasted for trying to compensate for the ineptitude (my word, not hers or Rashean's) of the youth/inexperience playing around him.

 

Bottom line is everyone gets dragged down when even just one guy isn't playing in position (which is a mental error.)  Poz recently touched on this as well in an interview, where his frustration was clear.

 

It was cute listening to all the "QB solves it all" fans clamor for Bortles... but the truth is, he won't be able to reduce the mental errors of the defense.  Behind the front four, we've stil got a real work in progress and... as the saying goes, help isn't on the way.

 

The defense, regardless of anything the offense is doing, has the job of stopping the opposition.  Shutting them out.  Whether the offense is three and out, or if they are scoring at a rapid pace... BOTH put the defense back on the field quickly.

 

The key is getting three and outs for theselves, no excuses.  Get THEMSELVES off the field.

 

And to do that... like was mentioned a few posts ago, requres a "race to maturity" by those whose heads are spinning on defense.  They'll either "get it", or get gone - whether released or demoted.

 

You're not beating anyone if you continue to spot the other team nearly 40 points.  This is the NFL.  Man up.

Quote:That's what I've always understood it to be.  

 

The coach is responsible for teaching the players what to do...............the players are responsible for doing it.

 

If a player steps onto the field not understanding his assignment, that's the coach's fault. 

 

If you're being taught, and capable of being taught, yet continue to make misake after mistake after being corrected... that's the player.

Quote:If you're being taught, and capable of being taught, yet continue to make misake after mistake after being corrected... that's the player.

 

So basically everyone but Cyprien is completely inept at figuring out how play their position?  This seems wayyyyyy to simplistic and a defense of the coaches.  

 

I wish as a manager I could get that type of free pass after 2 years.... 

 

Sorry, I'm just not buying it whole hog.  Yes, this team is young on D.  But just being young isn't an execuse.  Especially if they are not all rookies.  At some point both the players, coaches, and GM have take a good look in the mirror.

Dang, Pirk just said what I believe the root of the problem is...the players don't trust each other to do their job. You could see in the multiple BCC breakdown of Poz's play, he was trying to overcompensate for not trusting that LaRoy, Telvin, or Dakota would be in their right spots, thus putting himself badly out of position. You can't tell me Poz doesn't know his assignments or is slacking...he just doesn't trust that his teammates will be doing theirs. 

 

The same was shown in a few breakdowns I saw of Gratz against the Colts. It looked clear that he didn't trust the safeties had his back deep at all. There were several screenshots showing two guys on Gratz's side of the field. In those cases he should have passed on the deep receiver to the safety and stuck on the receiver running the cross/out/flat, but he didn't trust the safety and they both trailed the deep WR leaving Hilton/Fleener/Allen/etc wiiiide open to pick up easy first downs and more underneath. Just like with Poz, I don't think it was an issue of simply not knowing his assignment or what the coverage was supposed to be. 

Quote:If you're being taught, and capable of being taught, yet continue to make misake after mistake after being corrected... that's the player.

I don't disagree with logic, but your conclusion is based on a two-part premise:

 

1)  The player is capable of being taught, which is not always the case.  -  Though QB is a vastly more complicated position, Blaine Gabbert is an excellent example.  He simply didn't get it and no amount of coaching was going to make a difference.  

 

2)  The player is actually receiving adequate instruction.   -   If the player is capable, but lazy and simply isn't putting time into learning the playbook, it's the coach's fault for letting him get away with it.  That's when Gus needs to drop the best buddy approach and come down like a hammer.  

 

Unless you believe there are that many on the roster who are incapable, upper management needs to take a look in the mirror. 

Quote:Dang, Pirk just said what I believe the root of the problem is...the players don't trust each other to do their job. You could see in the multiple BCC breakdown of Poz's play, he was trying to overcompensate for not trusting that LaRoy, Telvin, or Dakota would be in their right spots, thus putting himself badly out of position. You can't tell me Poz doesn't know his assignments or is slacking...he just doesn't trust that his teammates will be doing theirs. 

 

The same was shown in a few breakdowns I saw of Gratz against the Colts. It looked clear that he didn't trust the safeties had his back deep at all. There were several screenshots showing two guys on Gratz's side of the field. In those cases he should have passed on the deep receiver to the safety and stuck on the receiver running the cross/out/flat, but he didn't trust the safety and they both trailed the deep WR leaving Hilton/Fleener/Allen/etc wiiiide open to pick up easy first downs and more underneath. Just like with Poz, I don't think it was an issue of simply not knowing his assignment or what the coverage was supposed to be. 

I got the same impression watching those plays.

 

It looked like Poz was more concerned about the other guys finishing the play than maintaining the discipline of his responsibilities.

 

Hopefully that sense of trust will build and the D won't look so sloppy.

Quote:Dang, Pirk just said what I believe the root of the problem is...the players don't trust each other to do their job. You could see in the multiple BCC breakdown of Poz's play, he was trying to overcompensate for not trusting that LaRoy, Telvin, or Dakota would be in their right spots, thus putting himself badly out of position. You can't tell me Poz doesn't know his assignments or is slacking...he just doesn't trust that his teammates will be doing theirs. 

 

The same was shown in a few breakdowns I saw of Gratz against the Colts. It looked clear that he didn't trust the safeties had his back deep at all. There were several screenshots showing two guys on Gratz's side of the field. In those cases he should have passed on the deep receiver to the safety and stuck on the receiver running the cross/out/flat, but he didn't trust the safety and they both trailed the deep WR leaving Hilton/Fleener/Allen/etc wiiiide open to pick up easy first downs and more underneath. Just like with Poz, I don't think it was an issue of simply not knowing his assignment or what the coverage was supposed to be. 

 

When the guys that do know what they are doing are putting themselves out of position, it's hard to make plays even when they call it right.

 

Nobody's ever made a play being out of position.  You have to be in position to make a play, before you can make a play.

Quote:I don't disagree with logic, but your conclusion is based on a two-part premise:

 

1)  The player is capable of being taught, which is not always the case.  -  Though QB is a vastly more complicated position, Blaine Gabbert is an excellent example.  He simply didn't get it and no amount of coaching was going to make a difference.  

 

2)  The player is actually receiving adequate instruction.   -   If the player is capable, but lazy and simply isn't putting time into learning the playbook, it's the coach's fault for letting him get away with it.  That's when Gus needs to drop the best buddy approach and come down like a hammer.  

 

Unless you believe there are that many on the roster who are incapable, upper management needs to take a look in the mirror. 

 

I believe we're seeing precisely that.

 

Guys like Gabbert, Brewster, and Prosinski are now gone.

 

Guys like Henne, Guy, and Reynolds are getting demoted.

 

In my opinion, it would be easier to argue it is/was management's fault if those moves weren't made.

 

To me, it's simply a sign that the talent isn't quite there yet.  Getting there, but not yet arrived.  After next offseason and we're having the same conversations, then I'll be willing to shift more share to management.

 

One thing that kept a guy like Russel Allen in good favor, is that he was reliable.  He wasn't the greatest talent, but he was where he was expected to be even if he couldn't physically stay with his man in coverage, etc.  He still made plays he mabye shouldn't have, because he was in position.  He knew the play and his responsibilitly.  That's what they need right now from all 11 on defense, and I expect them to keep making moves until they do.  Hopefully they're about done as there isn't much else to try from what's on hand.

You know what the problem is? Other than the Dline and Cyp the defense is bad. Poz is bad. Telvin, right now, is bad. any OTTO is bad. Gratz is playing horrible. So is any FS. Ball is doing ok at best. This team needed to pay Byrd this offseason but Dave wanted to wait one more year to go on a spending spree, which i somewhat understand. The team will be more ready next year than this year. But still the defense is very talent deprived. I expect the first round pick to be on defense (maybe the safety from bama, forgot his name). But free safety should be the number one priority this offseason. Its what makes Carrols/Gus's defense tick. 

The main problem I see with the Defense besides from the obvious fact they are on the field too much as a result of the inept offense, is communication. 

 

Too many times the defense has been caught out of position pre-snap, or made their defense audibles too late and the ball was snapped with guys not set.

Quote:Pretty discouraging that Gratz is not improving.  We may need to go CB early next year.

 

I'm not so sure about that.  Looking at what they've done so far, they seem to have a 3rd, 4th (admittedly, bargain shopping due to injury) and 7th round pick in mind for our corners. 

 

Just for comparison, since we appear to be emulating the Seattle scheme, the Seahawks don't have a single corner on their roster that was higher than a 5th round pick. 

 

I think Gus and Dave believe you can get away with some later round guys.  On the other hand, we do need a center fielder / ball hawk at FS.