09-08-2014, 08:01 PM
As much as it is a joke the league said they didn't see the video before Monday, at least he is done at least for the immediate future in the NFL.
09-08-2014, 08:01 PM
09-08-2014, 08:48 PM
It was funny on MNF to hear Gruden talk about how domestic violence has no place in the NFL. When he was coach in Tampa, they signed a running back named Michael Pittman who had a prior arrest and one game suspension for domestic violence while with Arizona. Pittman was arrested when he was with Tampa after he ran his car into a car driven by his wife. Also in the car was the couple's weeks old baby. He plead guilty and was welcomed back to the Bucs by Gruden.
Hypocrite.
Hypocrite.
09-08-2014, 09:49 PM
I have no respect for Gruden...
He's as shallow as they get.
He's as shallow as they get.
09-08-2014, 10:00 PM
Quote:It was funny on MNF to hear Gruden talk about how domestic violence has no place in the NFL. When he was coach in Tampa, they signed a running back named Michael Pittman who had a prior arrest and one game suspension for domestic violence while with Arizona. Pittman was arrested when he was with Tampa after he ran his car into a car driven by his wife. Also in the car was the couple's weeks old baby. He plead guilty and was welcomed back to the Bucs by Gruden.
Hypocrite.
Quote:
"Obviously, it's a blow to our football team," coach Jon Gruden said. "Michael Pittman's going to get an opportunity to serve this suspension and come back, hopefully, a much better man. Hopefully our whole football team, including Michael, will learn from this situation."
09-08-2014, 10:35 PM
Wow.
A blow to our football team?
A blow to our football team?
09-08-2014, 10:48 PM
Quote:First of all, let me say that I am in no way defending what Ray Rice did. What he did was unexcusable and has no place in our society.
Had this been the initial reaction from the league then I wouldn't have had much to say about it. He hit his fiance.
But Now I have several problems with this process and the way it was handled by the league and the Ravens organization, and those problems hang on one question: Did Ray Rice Lie?
Seems simple enough. The reason I ask that is because as bad as this video is, i didn't learn anything that I didn't already knew. He committed the despicable act of hitting his wife. But he did it then, this mornings release of the video of that event wasn't in REALITY a second offense but in practice its being treated as such!
And if he didn't lie to the league or the teams, then the decision that Rodger Godell made was based on the fact that Ray Rice had never been in trouble before, never had an incident like this with his then fiance and oh by the way the woman in said video pledged in front of God and country that she accepts him as he is as testament to his charecter and to my knowledge has stood by him through this entire process stating that the 4 minute video only represents 4 minutes of Ray Rice's life and not a systemic pattern of abusive behavior.
So now congratulations to the righteously indignant who have compromised the financial future of the victim and her family in an effort to make themselves feel better. This isn't about justice and i will challenge any person who uses that word in this discussion. This was about REVENGE and coming up with a punishment that we all felt good about, not creating the best environment for the correction of said behavior and healing for the rice family. there is a reason for pre trial intervention for first time offenders and there was a reason that Godell was willing to work with this couple based on the fact that his now wife attested to his charecter. I am not advocating or excusing domestic violence. I am advocating with every breath in my body the fact that all human beings are flawed, we all make mistakes, and we should all be given second chances in the face of real contrition.
And think about the cliff that we are on right now. What if the girl accusing Jaemis Winston writes a tell all book with graphic detail. Are we going to let twitter and TMZ dictate whether or not he should be banned from entry into the NFL. Since we are now in the market for retroactive fiat banishment from professional sport what about Greg hardy. Should he be released and suspended indefinately. What about chad Johnson. No charges were filed against Ray lewis and he was suspected of KILLING SOMEONE! Should twitter block his entrance into the hall of fame. Lawrence Taylor was a drug addict, lets drag his bust out of there. Kobe Bryant was accused of rape. I could go on and on and on. Eventually you get to the point that you decide GEE men who work to hard can develop ulcers, we need to send a message so let's rename the @#$% trophy.
If this was a pattern then that's fine. IF this happened again GOD BLESS have at him. But Rodger Godell just violated HIS OWN POLICY just based on PR. I could see an extension to 6 games but this is how we treated Aaron hernandez and he was a serial murderer!
First, I believe that the claim put forth to the NFL is that Ray Rice struck out in reflex only after she hit him first. If I'm right, the video shows they lied to the NFL during the investigation. If so, that would justify a more severe punishment.
As far as your other examples, they apply more to the initial suspension where there was not overwhelming evidence. A tell-all book is not evidence, just one person's claim.
In the case of Ray Lewis, it was clear from the evidence that two of his posse did the killing (after first being attacked by the victims), and Ray tried to stop them. He was convicted of interfering in an investigation, which he did and which he should have been charged with, not murder.
A better example of a player who actually did kill someone is Donte Stallworth. He was given a 1-year suspension. I don't think that one punch is worth the same length of suspension, but lying during the investigation would.
09-09-2014, 06:30 AM
As to overwhelming evidence, this is perfectly in line with my point. The guy confessed. He never said he didn't hit the woman and we knew that whatever happened in the elevator wasn't going to be pretty based on the fact that his fiancé was left unconscious. I didn't learn anything new watching the video for all the disclaimers about how disturbing and gruesome it was.
To me he didn't lie. They said there was provocation and she slapped him in the face. There Is a difference between provocation and over reaction and justifiable provocation that absolves someone of culpability. If Ray Rice was running around saying that she was chasing him with a meat cleaver and he had no choice then that would be a different story. We would be talking about her going through anger management and pre-trial intervention and not him. We knew all along that whatever happened her actions didn't justify being hit in the mouth with a closed fist. We knew that.
This concept of overwhelming evidence is asinine because the guy already confessed, apologized, took corrective action and reconciled with his now wife. This isn't about new facts or information, this is about new emotional fodder because we have pictures that we can slow down to the millisecond of his fist hitting his fiancé and her going flying into the railing. If people want to say that the punishment should have been stronger they are probably right. My point is that in reality they are no more right today than they were when the information first broke and the guy admitted that he hit his wife and that he would never do it again.
In the hearts of everyone this felt like a second incident and in reality it was just visual representation of the first. Human nature causes us to treat pictures differently than words and I get that but our emotional dispositions shouldn't rule over the way that we make decisions.
And furthermore, the idea that the Baltimore Ravens and the Commissioner didn't watch the video before they came to their initial decision is just plain silly. If they didn't then that's just negligent and if they did then its just as shameful for not owning up to their own decisions.
Make no mistake, while I take issue with the way that they have handled it and the way that in my opinion the public has manufactured righteous indignation based on emotion not fact, the person to Blame is Ray Rice. ANY TIME you put your fist to your wife's face your likely to throw the rest of your life away. One of my favorite movies is "He got game." In that movie denzel Washington's character is imprisoned for the rest of his life because in a similar situation his wife hit the corner of a stove and died. Violence whether it be a split second over reaction or anovert calculated pattern runs the risk of severe injury both physical and emotional and frankly we're lucky that we are having this conversation instead of a funeral. His actions were unacceptable, childish, immature, dangerous and yes they were ugly. But they are no more so than when he admitted them months ago.
To me he didn't lie. They said there was provocation and she slapped him in the face. There Is a difference between provocation and over reaction and justifiable provocation that absolves someone of culpability. If Ray Rice was running around saying that she was chasing him with a meat cleaver and he had no choice then that would be a different story. We would be talking about her going through anger management and pre-trial intervention and not him. We knew all along that whatever happened her actions didn't justify being hit in the mouth with a closed fist. We knew that.
This concept of overwhelming evidence is asinine because the guy already confessed, apologized, took corrective action and reconciled with his now wife. This isn't about new facts or information, this is about new emotional fodder because we have pictures that we can slow down to the millisecond of his fist hitting his fiancé and her going flying into the railing. If people want to say that the punishment should have been stronger they are probably right. My point is that in reality they are no more right today than they were when the information first broke and the guy admitted that he hit his wife and that he would never do it again.
In the hearts of everyone this felt like a second incident and in reality it was just visual representation of the first. Human nature causes us to treat pictures differently than words and I get that but our emotional dispositions shouldn't rule over the way that we make decisions.
And furthermore, the idea that the Baltimore Ravens and the Commissioner didn't watch the video before they came to their initial decision is just plain silly. If they didn't then that's just negligent and if they did then its just as shameful for not owning up to their own decisions.
Make no mistake, while I take issue with the way that they have handled it and the way that in my opinion the public has manufactured righteous indignation based on emotion not fact, the person to Blame is Ray Rice. ANY TIME you put your fist to your wife's face your likely to throw the rest of your life away. One of my favorite movies is "He got game." In that movie denzel Washington's character is imprisoned for the rest of his life because in a similar situation his wife hit the corner of a stove and died. Violence whether it be a split second over reaction or anovert calculated pattern runs the risk of severe injury both physical and emotional and frankly we're lucky that we are having this conversation instead of a funeral. His actions were unacceptable, childish, immature, dangerous and yes they were ugly. But they are no more so than when he admitted them months ago.
09-09-2014, 08:02 AM
I hope he never wears another football uniform. He is a disgrace to the human race, as is anyone who physically or emotionally abuses another person. I hope they both get the help they need because they're both emotionally impaired.
09-09-2014, 09:40 AM
She just came out with a statement:
"I woke up this morning feeling like I had a horrible nightmare, feeling like I'm mourning the death of my closest friend," she wrote.
She called the attention to their Feb. 15 fight in the Revel Casino Hotel "unwanted."
"To make us relive a moment in our lives that we regret everyday is a horrible thing. To take something away from the man I love that he has worked his *butt* off for all his life just to gain ratings is horrific. THIS IS OUR LIFE!" she wrote.
I guess I'll never understand the mind set of getting beat up by someone and expecting it to never happen again.
"I woke up this morning feeling like I had a horrible nightmare, feeling like I'm mourning the death of my closest friend," she wrote.
She called the attention to their Feb. 15 fight in the Revel Casino Hotel "unwanted."
"To make us relive a moment in our lives that we regret everyday is a horrible thing. To take something away from the man I love that he has worked his *butt* off for all his life just to gain ratings is horrific. THIS IS OUR LIFE!" she wrote.
I guess I'll never understand the mind set of getting beat up by someone and expecting it to never happen again.
09-09-2014, 10:03 AM
Quote:Wonder if she'll leave him now when them checks stop rolling in.
It's certainly the most opportune time. He'll never be as rich during their marriage as he is right now.
09-09-2014, 10:21 AM
I was in an emotionally abusive marriage for 11 years. A lot of it is lack of self worth. You think so little of yourself that any 'love' from someone is better than none.
There is also self esteem issues coupled with the idea you have of the other person, which ends up being a lie, but by the time you figure it out, you're so emotionally invested you don't see things as they are. This was my issue. My now ex-husband and I knew each 6 years before we got married but always lived apart as he was in the military and moved all the time. It was a couple of years after we married when I noticed his behavior, but it was so subtle, almost not noticeable. By then I had 8 years invested in the relationship and thought things could be worked out with counseling. That only works if both parties are willing. For reasons I can't explain to myself much less anyone else, I stayed with him for another 9 years. And, quite frankly, it almost killed me.
Abuse is psychological warfare no matter what form it takes, and it's never as easy as just walking away.
There is also self esteem issues coupled with the idea you have of the other person, which ends up being a lie, but by the time you figure it out, you're so emotionally invested you don't see things as they are. This was my issue. My now ex-husband and I knew each 6 years before we got married but always lived apart as he was in the military and moved all the time. It was a couple of years after we married when I noticed his behavior, but it was so subtle, almost not noticeable. By then I had 8 years invested in the relationship and thought things could be worked out with counseling. That only works if both parties are willing. For reasons I can't explain to myself much less anyone else, I stayed with him for another 9 years. And, quite frankly, it almost killed me.
Abuse is psychological warfare no matter what form it takes, and it's never as easy as just walking away.
09-09-2014, 10:39 AM
Quote:
In the hearts of everyone this felt like a second incident and in reality it was just visual representation of the first. Human nature causes us to treat pictures differently than words and I get that but our emotional dispositions shouldn't rule over the way that we make decisions.
But it does...
Newspaper line saying "teen killed" doesn't get the same reaction as the news running the actual murder video....
CNN reporting 10 soliders dead today on the scrolling text at the bottom of the screen doesn't get the same reaction as the beheading videos...
Greg Hardy//Ray McDonald domestic abuse stories//lines doesn't get the same reaction as a Video showing the actual abuse...
That's just how it is...
I understand Ray Rice did all these things after to "reconcile" but even he knows that he deserves more than a 2 game suspension.
As for feeling bad for Ray Rice...I thought I read where he still had 10+ million guaranteed on his contract that becomes payable now since he was "terminated" by the ravens prior to the NFL suspension. There shouldn't be any tears shed for Ray Rice.