Quote:I don't think anybody would argue that don't have two great receivers. I wouldn't expect much from Steven Jackson. He turns 31 this year, was injured part of last year and average 3.5 per carry. Rodgers is a decent situational player but has not shown he can carry a heavier workload. So need to probably add a back in the draft.
A bit of a stretch to say Lamar Holmes did a good job. They have a huge hole at left tackle right now. They need to protect their greatest asset right now. And if they stay at 6, they could have a Jake Matthews staring at them in the face.
On defense, what do they have? Osi is 32 and could still be cut. They re-signed guys from what was a bad defense. They have nothing at linebacker beyond Weatherspoon. They need help at safety.
Maybe I will be proven wrong, I just don't see them trading away picks with so many holes.
and I won't deny you have good points either, it's a personal opinion thing really
i don't think atlanta need to rebuild from the ground up and already have alot of the pieces in place so could be a contender again this year or next year
in my head the main thing the atlanta d missed last year was john abraham and the pressure he brought
the main thing the offense missed was a healthy roddy white and julio jones. With both on the field you have a pretty solid shot one guy will get open and make a big play
give matt ryan his two favourite toys back and bring back that pressure with an elite pass rusher i think the holes will start to seal up
i also think jackson will work better when the falcons have the wide outs to return to their pass first offense.
sharing carries with rodgers and with a solidified line in front of him obviously i think he will stay healthy and put up numbers
as for holmes at lt i'm not saying he was a booknd but i think he improved as the year went on and looked alright later in the year
the reason i think pass rusher is a more dire need is when i look a the draft i feel the depth at tackle is better than at de
I think the difference between matthews and say kouandijo is a lot smaller than the difference between say clowney and kareem martins and that adding clowney would have a much bigger effect on the team performance,
So Clowney is on the board and some of you people want to trade? Out of your mind.
Quote:So Clowney is on the board and some of you people want to trade? Out of your mind.
Agree.
If Clowney is there at 3 (which I don't think he will be), you run the card up.
Quote:so if I was the falcons I would want to make sure i got an elite pass rusher to be my difference maker especially as i think there is a higher chance of a good tackle falling to the 2nd round than a top end pass rusher
Ok, so they give their 1st and 2nd to move up to get Clowney. Or they could just stay at 6 and get another stud pass rush prospect in Mack and also get a good tackle in the 2nd like maybe Zack Martin.
Quote:So Clowney is on the board and some of you people want to trade? Out of your mind.
Clowney is a high risk/ super high reward type of prospect. If the Jags could get a 2015 1st, + a 3rd or even 4th rounder, to swap picks from 3 to 6, I'd make that deal. The Jags are still going to get a good player no matter where they draft in the first round, and they will likely get a safer one than Clowney under my trades. Overall, the Jags trading down multiple times like I suggest in my post towards the top of the thread would help out the Jags rebuild better than a single pick of Clowney.
Quote:Using that template...
Trade down from 3 to 6 with Atlanta, as they will be desperate to get Clown at that pick, Atlanta gives us their 2015 1st rounder, plus their 3rd rounder in the 2014 draft in return.
Trade down from 6 to 10 with Detroit, as they will be desperate to get Sammy Watkins at that pick. Detroit gives Jax its 2nd rounder in 2014 to move up, plus a 2015 4th rounder.
Jax would then currently sit with:
pick 10 (jags have their choice of Barr/ Gilbert/ Evans there. or possibly a further trade down. They might even be able to swindle a 3rd or 4th rounder from Tennessee at that point to swap picks as the Titans would likely be desperate for Gilbert to replace the CB they lost in FA.
Then the Jags could hold up the Rams for ransom as the Rams would want Evans....purging a 2nd rounder from the Rams to swap spots in the round....
finally:
Jags at pick 12 - take one of Barr/ DT Donald/ TE Ebron/ DE Ford
and still have:
3 high 2nd rounders
3 high 3rd rounders
2 fourth rounders
3 fifth rounders
2 sixth rounders
1 seventh rounder
extra 2015 1st rounder (which could be packaged to move up for Jameis)
extra 2015 4th rounder
I would love it. I've said many times now my hope is to be able to trade back and back again. The closer we get the worse I like having to pick at 3. Clowney is tough to pass on but only if he passes the Dave and Gus interview process. I get the feeling Clowney doesn't have the attitude they want in a player and that could hinder his play here. He's also a cheap rental because IF he does live up to his potential he's going to ask for insane money before long. He's going to want to be paid (rightfully so) however what worries me then is we see his play drop from there. Therefore stuck with a massive contract amd an underperformer. Especially if this team doesn't turn it around soon.
I would love to trade back to the mid-first. There is a lot better value there. Aaron Donald would not be flashy but I would love him. He's got the potential to be a very special player.
Quote:Why do people keep thinking Atlanta is going to trade up to get Clowney? Just because he said he would want to play there?
Atlanta has a lot of holes on their roster and they can't afford to keep trading up for players.
Yup and it looks like ATL will be moving to a 3-4, I think they will be happy with Barr or Mack since those 2 guys are better 3-4 OLB, tho if Clowney falls to them he will be hard to pass up but I doubt they will trade up for him.
Before I knew they were going to a 3-4 I thought it was a possibility but not now
Quote:Ok, so they give their 1st and 2nd to move up to get Clowney. Or they could just stay at 6 and get another stud pass rush prospect in Mack and also get a good tackle in the 2nd like maybe Zack Martin.
an elite pass rusher will have a far greater impact on the performance of the falcons than a left tackle. I really believe that injuries and the loss of john abraham was what contributed to the falcons down year and that to replace them they need to address that in the first round
i also believe that they will not be as bad next year with their wide receivers back and the revamped lines so this may be there one chance at a really elite pass rushing talent
though i understand the example zack martin won't fall to the second but yes a guy mack and victor moses is an ideal draft for them strengthening two positions of need
but mack's stock has risen alot over the last few weeks and he is not a guarantee at 6 right now so if atlanta want to guarantee locking down an elite pass rush i think they need to trade
the rams could go clowney or mack as could the jags or the raiders and thought it's unlikely in my head houston could take clowney or mack would be a very big upgrade to their weak lb core.
The only team I cannot feasibly see taking a pass rusher is cleveland which gives you a 2 in 5 chance of a pass rusher reaching you.
i think matthews and say kyle van noy could be a very good realistic draft for atlanta but it doesn't lock down their pass rush like grabbing clowney or mack would
No trade downs.. If Clowney is there, take him!!
Quote:Why do people keep thinking Atlanta is going to trade up to get Clowney? Just because he said he would want to play there?
Atlanta has a lot of holes on their roster and they can't afford to keep trading up for players.
That, and we'd be stupid to give up Clowney for anything less than a king's ransom (which we'll never get.)
Quote:Using that template...
Trade down from 3 to 6 with Atlanta, as they will be desperate to get Clown at that pick, Atlanta gives us their 2015 1st rounder, plus their 3rd rounder in the 2014 draft in return.
Trade down from 6 to 10 with Detroit, as they will be desperate to get Sammy Watkins at that pick. Detroit gives Jax its 2nd rounder in 2014 to move up, plus a 2015 4th rounder.
Atlanta is going to give up their 2015 1st rounder + 2014 3rd rounder to move up 3 spots??
Jim Irsay is the owner smoking meth, not Arthur Blanks.
Ever considered that having a lot more than 10 draft picks in one years isn't that smart. I mean do you really want that many rookies playing? I don't.
Quote:Do all rookies play?
You can answer that yourself.
I personally think we have enough picks this years. A trade to get more picks next year would be fine..
Quote:Ever considered that having a lot more than 10 draft picks in one years isn't that smart. I mean do you really want that many rookies playing? I don't.
They can be used to move up or flipped for picks next year.
Quote:They can be used to move up or flipped for picks next year.
Well sure, they can.
We also have a lot of needs right now. If there's a guy that fits, a guy that would make you better now, just pull the trigger. I know it's fun to think about trading back, getting the guy you want anyway, AND getting some future picks, but the reality is that the compensation probably won't be as high as many think.
Some people's entire fictional draft strategy involved "trading back" over and over again, "stockpiling picks" without ever taking a player and pulling the trigger.
I think this organization is very direct in who they target. I look for them using a couple of their extra picks to move up in the draft and get a player that they feel will start, like moving up to the late 3rd and grabbing a guard or center.
I see it similarly in the 1st round. They probably are very comfortable with 3 players right now.
Unless someone wants to trade up and offers a deal "too good to turn down" (which likely won't happen), Dave will sit at 3 and take a player he likes a lot.
Quote:Ever considered that having a lot more than 10 draft picks in one years isn't that smart. I mean do you really want that many rookies playing? I don't.
This is why it's smart... for the first five rounds or so, you're going to be able to get talent graded a round higher.
This draft is very deep at most positions, due to the combination of a strong class and the addition of a (perhaps record) number of very talented underclassmen.
This is a draft where you're going to be able to find talent in the second that would be gone in the first in most drafts. Second rounders in the third, etc., etc... all the way back to probably the fifth round.
I think Falcons have Matthews number one on their board over Clowney