Let's continue the discussion debate about the players of the AFC South, focusing now on the offensive linemen.
Left Tackle
1. Duane Brown-Texans: I remember when he was drafted and I wasn't too thrilled about him as a prospect. He proved me wrong then. Has had a very good career.
2. Taylor Lewan-Tacks: Won't be long until he is unquestionably the best in this division.
3. Branden Albert-Jaguars: A recent Pro Bowl player/ Hopefully he has 2-3 solid seasons left.
4. Anthony Castonzo-Colts: Never sold on him. A guy.
Left Guard
1. 1. Jack Mewhort-Colts: Slid in from college T and is doing okay.
2. Quinton Spain-Tacks
3. Xavier Sula-Filo-Texans: Something of a disappointment for the Texans
4. A.J. Cann-Jaguars: a projected pick. Given the flux of the Jaguars OL, could be in any of three positions or not even starting by the time things are said and done at the end of preseason.
Center
1. Brandon Linder-Jaguars: A projected pick. Could be C or RG by the time all is said and done. He played C last year and was the best in the division.
2. Ryan Kelly-Colts: Good young prospect.
3. Nick Martin-Texans
4. Ben Jones-Tacks: Anchors the tacks physical running game.
Right Guard
1. Jeff Allen-Texans
2. Josh Kline-Tacks
3. Denzelle Goode-Colts
4.???-Jaguars: If Linder plays RG, he goes to the top of this list.; If Cann plays RG, he goes to 2 or 3.
RT
1. Jack Conklin-Tacks: After trading down and up, wound up being a great pick for the tacks. Helps fuel their physical running game.
2. Jermey Parnell-Jaguars: This is proof of the tremendous drop off in the division after Conklin.
3. Joe Haeg-Colts:
4. Kendall Lamm-Texans
Except for the titans it's pretty amazing the unproven (or just plain terrible, in some cases) nature of most of the division's offensive lines.
Hopefully Ngakoue develops, because for years the Jaguars have failed to take advantage of just how bad the division's pass blocking is (except against the colts recently) and I think the ability to take advantage of it is what has secured the division for the texans during the last few seasons.
(06-25-2017, 12:34 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]Except for the titans it's pretty amazing the unproven (or just plain terrible, in some cases) nature of most of the division's offensive lines.
Hopefully Ngakoue develops, because for years the Jaguars have failed to take advantage of just how bad the division's pass blocking is (except against the colts recently) and I think the ability to take advantage of it is what has secured the division for the texans during the last few seasons.
Agreed.
Compiling this listing left me dumbfounded at the state of this division's offensive lines.
On an aside, not that I have anything against the Texans' projected starter other than being a Texan, the part in my that wants to be a decent human being is rooting for Quissenberry to make a complete recovery from cancer.
As for Ngakoue, Fowler, and Smoot, I hope they all develop into good pass rushers to exploit this division's weaknesses in the trenches. I think Ngakoue and Fowler seem to match up well against the tack tackles. Those will be matchups to watch over the years for us.
I think overall, our defense matches up well against Tennessee and the other offenses in the division.
My concern would be run defense.
(06-25-2017, 03:30 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ] (06-25-2017, 12:34 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]Except for the titans it's pretty amazing the unproven (or just plain terrible, in some cases) nature of most of the division's offensive lines.
Hopefully Ngakoue develops, because for years the Jaguars have failed to take advantage of just how bad the division's pass blocking is (except against the colts recently) and I think the ability to take advantage of it is what has secured the division for the texans during the last few seasons.
Agreed.
Compiling this listing left me dumbfounded at the state of this division's offensive lines.
On an aside, not that I have anything against the Texans' projected starter other than being a Texan, the part in my that wants to be a decent human being is rooting for Quissenberry to make a complete recovery from cancer.
As for Ngakoue, Fowler, and Smoot, I hope they all develop into good pass rushers to exploit this division's weaknesses in the trenches. I think Ngakoue and Fowler seem to match up well against the tack tackles. Those will be matchups to watch over the years for us.
I think overall, our defense matches up well against Tennessee and the other offenses in the division.
My concern would be run defense.
Personally I think run defense will be fine if Myles Jack can learn his role decently and the coaching staff does their gameplanning well.
Tennessee's offense worries me about the same amount as the texans, which is not really at all. Every team in the division has weak armed QBs except for Bortles, and maybe Luck if his shoulder recovers, and weak armed guys against a secondary this good will be doing a lot of dinking and dunking. I foresee a lot of INTs for Ramsey against Mariota. Should have had a couple of them in the last meeting of 2016. I see the same with the wild and weak armed QB the texans drafted, Watson.
It'll be an interesting season. Maybe the Jaguars 2017 is more like what all the pundits thought 2016 would be since the Gus cancer is finally gone.
(06-25-2017, 05:17 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ] (06-25-2017, 03:30 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]Agreed.
Compiling this listing left me dumbfounded at the state of this division's offensive lines.
On an aside, not that I have anything against the Texans' projected starter other than being a Texan, the part in my that wants to be a decent human being is rooting for Quissenberry to make a complete recovery from cancer.
As for Ngakoue, Fowler, and Smoot, I hope they all develop into good pass rushers to exploit this division's weaknesses in the trenches. I think Ngakoue and Fowler seem to match up well against the tack tackles. Those will be matchups to watch over the years for us.
I think overall, our defense matches up well against Tennessee and the other offenses in the division.
My concern would be run defense.
Personally I think run defense will be fine if Myles Jack can learn his role decently and the coaching staff does their gameplanning well.
Tennessee's offense worries me about the same amount as the texans, which is not really at all. Every team in the division has weak armed QBs except for Bortles, and maybe Luck if his shoulder recovers, and weak armed guys against a secondary this good will be doing a lot of dinking and dunking. I foresee a lot of INTs for Ramsey against Mariota. Should have had a couple of them in the last meeting of 2016. I see the same with the wild and weak armed QB the texans drafted, Watson.
It'll be an interesting season. Maybe the Jaguars 2017 is more like what all the pundits thought 2016 would be since the Gus cancer is finally gone.
While I do not see the opposing QBs in this division as having weak arms, I do not see many overpowering or imposing passing games. In fact, if Luck is not the same guy the Colts drafted due to his shoulder, they are in some serious trouble.
(06-25-2017, 05:28 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ] (06-25-2017, 05:17 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]Personally I think run defense will be fine if Myles Jack can learn his role decently and the coaching staff does their gameplanning well.
Tennessee's offense worries me about the same amount as the texans, which is not really at all. Every team in the division has weak armed QBs except for Bortles, and maybe Luck if his shoulder recovers, and weak armed guys against a secondary this good will be doing a lot of dinking and dunking. I foresee a lot of INTs for Ramsey against Mariota. Should have had a couple of them in the last meeting of 2016. I see the same with the wild and weak armed QB the texans drafted, Watson.
It'll be an interesting season. Maybe the Jaguars 2017 is more like what all the pundits thought 2016 would be since the Gus cancer is finally gone.
While I do not see the opposing QBs in this division as having weak arms, I do not see many overpowering or imposing passing games. In fact, if Luck is not the same guy the Colts drafted due to his shoulder, they are in some serious trouble.
Watson apparently has absolutely terrible arm strength going by his pass velocity at the combine. As for Mariota, maybe it's my imagination, but every time I see him his passes look more like later career Manning than someone like Brett Favre. Against bad defenses it's worked, mostly with short passes, but against good defenses he looked no better than Bortles.
What were the good defenses he played last year? Denver, Vikings, KC? The Jaguars? In those four games he passed for 699 yards, 3 TDs, and 2 INTs, and at the end of the season he had three of those teams in a row and put up three stinkers, completed a total of 33 passes over the three. The titans still won two of those games, but not because of Mariota.
For comparison, against Den, Min, and KC (just three of those games rather than 4) Bortles threw for just over 700 yards and 3TDs and 3 INTs. The difference? Gus is terrible, and so was the Jaguars running game, Bortles was being asked to carry the team, and against really good defenses he couldn't pull it out with no support. Mariota just got asked to manage some games where his team could run the ball decently, played good defense, and also had better coaching, as little as some around here think of Mularkey he was nowhere near as bad as Gus. He might not have been Belichick, but he's miles ahead a guy like Gus.
In any case I don't see this as a strong QB division right now, which is funny considering a lot of pundits are all over Mariota's jock, and there's no one in the NFL that's received more wet sloppy kisses for less big game performance than Andrew Luck.
So what it looks like is all of these teams have something in common. Uncertain offensive line play. I wish we had a Joe Thomas kind of player.
(06-25-2017, 06:02 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ] (06-25-2017, 05:28 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]While I do not see the opposing QBs in this division as having weak arms, I do not see many overpowering or imposing passing games. In fact, if Luck is not the same guy the Colts drafted due to his shoulder, they are in some serious trouble.
Watson apparently has absolutely terrible arm strength going by his pass velocity at the combine. As for Mariota, maybe it's my imagination, but every time I see him his passes look more like later career Manning than someone like Brett Favre. Against bad defenses it's worked, mostly with short passes, but against good defenses he looked no better than Bortles.
What were the good defenses he played last year? Denver, Vikings, KC? The Jaguars? In those four games he passed for 699 yards, 3 TDs, and 2 INTs, and at the end of the season he had three of those teams in a row and put up three stinkers, completed a total of 33 passes over the three. The titans still won two of those games, but not because of Mariota.
For comparison, against Den, Min, and KC (just three of those games rather than 4) Bortles threw for just over 700 yards and 3TDs and 3 INTs. The difference? Gus is terrible, and so was the Jaguars running game, Bortles was being asked to carry the team, and against really good defenses he couldn't pull it out with no support. Mariota just got asked to manage some games where his team could run the ball decently, played good defense, and also had better coaching, as little as some around here think of Mularkey he was nowhere near as bad as Gus. He might not have been Belichick, but he's miles ahead a guy like Gus.
In any case I don't see this as a strong QB division right now, which is funny considering a lot of pundits are all over Mariota's jock, and there's no one in the NFL that's received more wet sloppy kisses for less big game performance than Andrew Luck.
While I am not a huge Mariota fan, I don't think his failure to put up big numbers against those defenses should be marks against him completely, especially considering the pedestrian WRs he's had to work with. Besides those are tough defenses overall and match up pretty well against most offenses.
The one thing I will give Mariota credit for is he takes care of the football. Even though he is in a game plan to run the ball, etc., he is doing a good job taking care of the football. He isn't losing many games for them, even if he isn't dazzling with Fouts like passing.
(06-27-2017, 08:36 AM)Browntrouser Wrote: [ -> ]So what it looks like is all of these teams have something in common. Uncertain offensive line play. I wish we had a Joe Thomas kind of player.
Hopefully Cam Robinson will become that player for us.
(06-27-2017, 08:52 AM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ] (06-25-2017, 06:02 PM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]Watson apparently has absolutely terrible arm strength going by his pass velocity at the combine. As for Mariota, maybe it's my imagination, but every time I see him his passes look more like later career Manning than someone like Brett Favre. Against bad defenses it's worked, mostly with short passes, but against good defenses he looked no better than Bortles.
What were the good defenses he played last year? Denver, Vikings, KC? The Jaguars? In those four games he passed for 699 yards, 3 TDs, and 2 INTs, and at the end of the season he had three of those teams in a row and put up three stinkers, completed a total of 33 passes over the three. The titans still won two of those games, but not because of Mariota.
For comparison, against Den, Min, and KC (just three of those games rather than 4) Bortles threw for just over 700 yards and 3TDs and 3 INTs. The difference? Gus is terrible, and so was the Jaguars running game, Bortles was being asked to carry the team, and against really good defenses he couldn't pull it out with no support. Mariota just got asked to manage some games where his team could run the ball decently, played good defense, and also had better coaching, as little as some around here think of Mularkey he was nowhere near as bad as Gus. He might not have been Belichick, but he's miles ahead a guy like Gus.
In any case I don't see this as a strong QB division right now, which is funny considering a lot of pundits are all over Mariota's jock, and there's no one in the NFL that's received more wet sloppy kisses for less big game performance than Andrew Luck.
While I am not a huge Mariota fan, I don't think his failure to put up big numbers against those defenses should be marks against him completely, especially considering the pedestrian WRs he's had to work with. Besides those are tough defenses overall and match up pretty well against most offenses.
The one thing I will give Mariota credit for is he takes care of the football. Even though he is in a game plan to run the ball, etc., he is doing a good job taking care of the football. He isn't losing many games for them, even if he isn't dazzling with Fouts like passing.
(06-27-2017, 08:36 AM)Browntrouser Wrote: [ -> ]So what it looks like is all of these teams have something in common. Uncertain offensive line play. I wish we had a Joe Thomas kind of player.
Hopefully Cam Robinson will become that player for us.
My point wasn't that he should be blamed for having three stickers against three good defenses, my point was just that there's a lot of perception hinging on winning instead of individual performance.
Mariota has some a great job keeping his interceptions down overall, but personally I believe most of that is just a function of being a game manager instead of being asked to carry his team.
According to football outsiders his adjusted interception percentage (turnover worthy throws added to int total, tipped passes removed) he had a 2.3% while Bortles had 2.6%
So if they threw the same number of passes Mariota would be expected to throw 1 or 2 less interceptions over a season.
I think most of what's made Bortles perception so low and Mariota so high is just the success of the team.
I get the feeling we'll see Bortles do as well or better this season if Marrone is decent.