Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Ive recently received a lot of older Jaguars memorabilia and I had some questions about a few of the players.

I was too young to really remember the early Jags years so 95-98 are a little foggy to me and I’m interested in some of the lesser known players from that period (IE not Boselli, Brunell, Smith, etc).

First, were there any players in the early years that looked like they were going to be real good or Pro Bowlers that didn’t reach that point due to injury? I’ve heard stories about guys like Michael Cheever, Dave Thomas, and Bryan Schwartz but there’s not a lot of articles or videos from that time period. 

Second, how good was Clyde Simmons when he was here? I know he was a monster with the Eagles but was he good enough here to be considered one of the better DEs in Jags history?

Tavian Banks looked like he was going to be special until his knee was destroyed. Tony Brackens would have been a bigger star if he had more love for the game. Speculation is he put forth just enough effort to make enough money to buy the ranch he currently lives on. Really wasn’t the same player after micro fracture surgery on his knee either.

Clyde Simmons was an outstanding FA pickup for the Jags. His blocked FG against the Steelers on MNF is the stuff of legend.

Tavian Banks had the "look" of a star until his knee was obliterated. Brunell was never the same after Armstead took out his knee. Gary Walker was a great FA pickup.

(12-26-2017, 09:15 PM)NCJag Wrote: [ -> ]Tavian Banks had the "look" of a star until his knee was obliterated.  Brunell was never the same after Armstead took out his knee. Gary Walker was a great FA pickup.

I hated that we had to give up Walker and Payne in the expansion draft. Both of them were a bane to this team for years after they left.

(12-26-2017, 08:55 PM)HolsterHusto Wrote: [ -> ]Ive recently received a lot of older Jaguars memorabilia and I had some questions about a few of the players.

I was too young to really remember the early Jags years so 95-98 are a little foggy to me and I’m interested in some of the lesser known players from that period (IE not Boselli, Brunell, Smith, etc).

First, were there any players in the early years that looked like they were going to be real good or Pro Bowlers that didn’t reach that point due to injury? I’ve heard stories about guys like Michael Cheever, Dave Thomas, and Bryan Schwartz but there’s not a lot of articles or videos from that time period. 

Second, how good was Clyde Simmons when he was here? I know he was a monster with the Eagles but was he good enough here to be considered one of the better DEs in Jags history?

Cheever was a Meester type center. He was above average. 

Bryan was always hurt. I went to an open practice and saw him up close. He was a thumper. He would echo on the practice sleds.

Dave Thomas was a big CB. He was a solid tackler and would do good against big receivers like Carl Pickens.

Clyde Simmons was a Paul Spicer type in my opinion once he was with the Jags. His biggest moment was up in Buffalo in our first playoff game. He intercepted a shuffle pass and returned it for a TD. 

Tavian Banks was a very good scat back but over shadowed by Fred Taylor. He got hurt in Atlanta.

(12-26-2017, 08:55 PM)HolsterHusto Wrote: [ -> ]Ive recently received a lot of older Jaguars memorabilia and I had some questions about a few of the players.

I was too young to really remember the early Jags years so 95-98 are a little foggy to me and I’m interested in some of the lesser known players from that period (IE not Boselli, Brunell, Smith, etc).

First, were there any players in the early years that looked like they were going to be real good or Pro Bowlers that didn’t reach that point due to injury? I’ve heard stories about guys like Michael Cheever, Dave Thomas, and Bryan Schwartz but there’s not a lot of articles or videos from that time period. 

Second, how good was Clyde Simmons when he was here? I know he was a monster with the Eagles but was he good enough here to be considered one of the better DEs in Jags history?

Thanks for the question.  It's almost always good to talk about those early Jaguars teams.

The first question...the only one that looked like he could be a Pro Bowl caliber guy with a career cut short due to injury was Cheever.  Someone else in the thread compared him to a Meester type C.  In terms of effectiveness...yes.  But I think he was more of a power player than Meester.  He took over for an injured Dave Widell, and the running game took off and the team  won five straight games to close the season at 9-7 and reach the playoffs, where the team beat Buffalo and Denver before finally losing in New England.  In that New England game, Widell returned to health, and the running game bogged down.  I credit Cheever with sparking that running game.  But he hurt his back lifting weights in the following offseason, and he was never heard from again.

Another guy mentioned in this thread was Tavian Banks, who was a rookie RB out of Iowa in 1998, the Fred Taylor draft.  He was part of the compensation we received from Buffalo in the Rob Johnson deal (we received a first round pick-the 9th overall, which turned into Fred Taylor-and a 4th round pick, which turned into Tavian Banks.  He was an explosive, big play receiving/kick return threat, who, due to his position as a receiving back, likely would never have made the Pro bowl, but was unquestionably a dangerous player.  He suffered a cheap shot by Falcons' CB Ray Buchanon on the sideline that tore up his knee and ended his career.

Brackens actually did make the Pro Bowl as a Jaguar, and until this year, had the Jaguars single season sack record.  He was a speed rusher who made a lot of big plays from his RDE spot.  During that 1996 playoff run (his rookie year), he made a first half INT of a Rick Mirer pass that turned the Seattle game around for the Jaguars.  In another week or so, he made one of the most important yet underrated and unappreciated plays in team history in the regular season ending game against the Falcons-the Morten's miss game.  The Falcons were a 3 win team going into that game, and few people thought they stood a chance in the game.  But they largely outplayed our Jaguars throughout the game.  They bubble screened us to death in the run-n-shoot offense.  There was a screen pass to a WR (Terrance Mathis, IIRC) that went deep into Jaguars territory with time winding down in the 4th quarter.  Brackens wound up chasing the play down from behind after a lengthy gain.  The drive stalled at that point as time went down to the last seconds, Morten Anderson missed the FG, and the rest is history.  But for Brackens' hustle, Mathis likely scores a TD, and the Jaguars' 1996 run never occurs.  His career was cut short due to injury-a cheap shot block on his knee by Dallas LT Flozell Adams.  In the offseason before that injury, his contract expired and he was given the franchise tag (IIRC), and he wound up in a contract stalemate that turned the fans against him-unjustly IMO.

But the above notwithstanding, I can not recall too many Jaguars players that were on the verge of becoming Pro Bowlers whose career got cut short by injury.   Cornerback Dave Thomas suffered a horrible broken leg against Washington, but he was never close to being a Pro Bowl CB-though I will go to my grave believing he could have excelled at S (but he never wanted to play that position, as I recall).

Clyde Simmons was pretty good when he was here.  In fact, he was the starter at RDE before Brackens was able to put his game together enough as a rookie to get to start-which was most of the season.  As others have mentioned, he had some important plays for the Jaguars during that run, including a blocked FG against Cincinnati (which was a bad team but owned us until we were able to turn things around and finally beat them in that game) and his INT of Bills QB Jim Kelly.  While he was not the player he was in Philadelphia (surrounded by one of the most dominant DLs I've ever seen-better than the one we have this year), he was good while he was here, and I will always view him favorably for his time spent here.

(12-26-2017, 10:44 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]

(12-26-2017, 08:55 PM)HolsterHusto Wrote: [ -> ]Ive recently received a lot of older Jaguars memorabilia and I had some questions about a few of the players.

I was too young to really remember the early Jags years so 95-98 are a little foggy to me and I’m interested in some of the lesser known players from that period (IE not Boselli, Brunell, Smith, etc).

First, were there any players in the early years that looked like they were going to be real good or Pro Bowlers that didn’t reach that point due to injury? I’ve heard stories about guys like Michael Cheever, Dave Thomas, and Bryan Schwartz but there’s not a lot of articles or videos from that time period. 

Second, how good was Clyde Simmons when he was here? I know he was a monster with the Eagles but was he good enough here to be considered one of the better DEs in Jags history?

But the above notwithstanding, I can not recall too many Jaguars players that were on the verge of becoming Pro Bowlers whose career got cut short by injury.   Cornerback Dave Thomas suffered a horrible broken leg against Washington, but he was never close to being a Pro Bowl CB-though I will go to my grave believing he could have excelled at S (but he never wanted to play that position, as I recall).

Broken leg was against the Bengals on a kickoff in one of those sub-zero degree games.  You could actually hear the crack on television.

(12-26-2017, 10:44 PM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]

(12-26-2017, 08:55 PM)HolsterHusto Wrote: [ -> ]Ive recently received a lot of older Jaguars memorabilia and I had some questions about a few of the players.

I was too young to really remember the early Jags years so 95-98 are a little foggy to me and I’m interested in some of the lesser known players from that period (IE not Boselli, Brunell, Smith, etc).

First, were there any players in the early years that looked like they were going to be real good or Pro Bowlers that didn’t reach that point due to injury? I’ve heard stories about guys like Michael Cheever, Dave Thomas, and Bryan Schwartz but there’s not a lot of articles or videos from that time period. 

Second, how good was Clyde Simmons when he was here? I know he was a monster with the Eagles but was he good enough here to be considered one of the better DEs in Jags history?

Thanks for the question.  It's almost always good to talk about those early Jaguars teams.

The first question...the only one that looked like he could be a Pro Bowl caliber guy with a career cut short due to injury was Cheever.  Someone else in the thread compared him to a Meester type C.  In terms of effectiveness...yes.  But I think he was more of a power player than Meester.  He took over for an injured Dave Widell, and the running game took off and the team  won five straight games to close the season at 9-7 and reach the playoffs, where the team beat Buffalo and Denver before finally losing in New England.  In that New England game, Widell returned to health, and the running game bogged down.  I credit Cheever with sparking that running game.  But he hurt his back lifting weights in the following offseason, and he was never heard from again.

Another guy mentioned in this thread was Tavian Banks, who was a rookie RB out of Iowa in 1998, the Fred Taylor draft.  He was part of the compensation we received from Buffalo in the Rob Johnson deal (we received a first round pick-the 9th overall, which turned into Fred Taylor-and a 4th round pick, which turned into Tavian Banks.  He was an explosive, big play receiving/kick return threat, who, due to his position as a receiving back, likely would never have made the Pro bowl, but was unquestionably a dangerous player.  He suffered a cheap shot by Falcons' CB Ray Buchanon on the sideline that tore up his knee and ended his career.

Brackens actually did make the Pro Bowl as a Jaguar, and until this year, had the Jaguars single season sack record.  He was a speed rusher who made a lot of big plays from his RDE spot.  During that 1996 playoff run (his rookie year), he made a first half INT of a Rick Mirer pass that turned the Seattle game around for the Jaguars.  In another week or so, he made one of the most important yet underrated and unappreciated plays in team history in the regular season ending game against the Falcons-the Morten's miss game.  The Falcons were a 3 win team going into that game, and few people thought they stood a chance in the game.  But they largely outplayed our Jaguars throughout the game.  They bubble screened us to death in the run-n-shoot offense.  There was a screen pass to a WR (Terrance Mathis, IIRC) that went deep into Jaguars territory with time winding down in the 4th quarter.  Brackens wound up chasing the play down from behind after a lengthy gain.  The drive stalled at that point as time went down to the last seconds, Morten Anderson missed the FG, and the rest is history.  But for Brackens' hustle, Mathis likely scores a TD, and the Jaguars' 1996 run never occurs.  His career was cut short due to injury-a cheap shot block on his knee by Dallas LT Flozell Adams.  In the offseason before that injury, his contract expired and he was given the franchise tag (IIRC), and he wound up in a contract stalemate that turned the fans against him-unjustly IMO.  

But the above notwithstanding, I can not recall too many Jaguars players that were on the verge of becoming Pro Bowlers whose career got cut short by injury.   Cornerback Dave Thomas suffered a horrible broken leg against Washington, but he was never close to being a Pro Bowl CB-though I will go to my grave believing he could have excelled at S (but he never wanted to play that position, as I recall).

Clyde Simmons was pretty good when he was here.  In fact, he was the starter at RDE before Brackens was able to put his game together enough as a rookie to get to start-which was most of the season.  As others have mentioned, he had some important plays for the Jaguars during that run, including a blocked FG against Cincinnati (which was a bad team but owned us until we were able to turn things around and finally beat them in that game) and his INT of Bills QB Jim Kelly.  While he was not the player he was in Philadelphia (surrounded by one of the most dominant DLs I've ever seen-better than the one we have this year), he was good while he was here, and I will always view him favorably for his time spent here.

Great information, guys. I wish I had been a little older to have been able to take in the 95-97 years. It’s a shame how hard it is t find information on those early teams outside of a few Times Union articles and a handful of games/highlights on YouTube.