I see Burtons name tossed a lot around here. Curious as to how much it would take to acquire him? Is he the best FA TE? Might get outbid if he is. TEs take a long time to develop, so I am all for signing a guy who has spent some time learning.
(03-10-2018, 10:35 PM)The_Franchise_QB Wrote: [ -> ]I see Burtons name tossed a lot around here. Curious as to how much it would take to acquire him? Is he the best FA TE? Might get outbid if he is. TEs take a long time to develop, so I am all for signing a guy who has spent some time learning.
About 8 million to get Burton.
(03-10-2018, 10:45 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ] (03-10-2018, 10:35 PM)The_Franchise_QB Wrote: [ -> ]I see Burtons name tossed a lot around here. Curious as to how much it would take to acquire him? Is he the best FA TE? Might get outbid if he is. TEs take a long time to develop, so I am all for signing a guy who has spent some time learning.
About 8 million to get Burton.
That would put him in the top 5 salary wise for TE. Seems kinda risky for a guy who has never proven anything.
(03-10-2018, 11:38 PM)The_Franchise_QB Wrote: [ -> ] (03-10-2018, 10:45 PM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]About 8 million to get Burton.
That would put him in the top 5 salary wise for TE. Seems kinda risky for a guy who has never proven anything.
Yeah I'm not sure if it's the best move yet. You'd be paying for his skillset and hoping our offense can utilize him well.
I'd be indifferent to him as of right now.
(03-10-2018, 12:03 AM)Dakota Wrote: [ -> ]I just want to see if #27 can stay healthy for a whole season first. I don't want to put all of the Jaguar eggs into Fournette's basket.
Agreed. Wouldn't hurt my feelings nor would I be surprised if they decided to draft Chubb or Michel out of Georgia or maybe Guice out of LSU or Johnson out of Auburn on day two of the draft just to have as an insurance policy. I expect this draft to be very heavy towards the offense. Probably looking at LG/RG, TE, RB & QB in any order with the first four selections this year.
(03-09-2018, 04:58 PM)JNev Wrote: [ -> ]Call me crazy but I'd like to see them draw up more runs for Blake
Not crazy at all. I was disappointed that they didn't turn him loose more in the play-offs. Especially in the New England game. He's been one of the top two or three QB's with scrambling ability now and with the numbers to back it for the last two or three years.
(03-11-2018, 04:20 AM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ] (03-10-2018, 11:38 PM)The_Franchise_QB Wrote: [ -> ]That would put him in the top 5 salary wise for TE. Seems kinda risky for a guy who has never proven anything.
Yeah I'm not sure if it's the best move yet. You'd be paying for his skillset and hoping our offense can utilize him well.
I'd be indifferent to him as of right now.
Same. If the price is right for Burton I would be okay with it but it's hard to figure at the moment.
Good call on Rivera by the way. I think it was you who was big on Seferian-Jenkins earlier this year.
I'd rather Cameron Brate than Burton
It's not like we haven't featured 12 personnel heavily in our offense in the recent past. Last season was the first season in years we even rostered a fullback. Most on here clamored for a fullback and in one season it's back full circle I guess. If anything, ARob would be a higher priority resign if we are only putting two receivers on the field.
(03-09-2018, 04:02 PM)knarnn Wrote: [ -> ]I was listening to Jaguars live on the home page and Brian Sexton and Johnny O were mentioning the reason behind letting ARob walk was because of the shift in our offensive identity. They stated that because we want to be a run first team the team may be looking at moving to more 2 TE sets as the main point in our offense similar to what the patriots did with Gronk and Hernandez. The more I think about it the more it somewhat makes sense.
Bringing in a guy like Burton then drafting another guy like Goedert, Gesicki, Hurst, Andrews etc would give you some serious seam stretching firepower if you can get them on the field at the same time. You could still run the ball, albeit in theory more effectively, as you won’t tip the play as easy as you do in our current line up. While I still would like to have ARob back, if this is what the team has in mind, I get it.
It will be a mistake to draft one of the "sprint' tight ends. To maintain a playoff-caliber rushing attack, your tight end must be a in-line blocker, a offensive tackle with hands. So, if you draft ANY of the tight end prospects, you will still require an in-line tight end to maintain the running game. You can't finesse a pro defensive front stacked against the run with a spiffy "sprint tight end".
Marcedes Lewis is close to the perfect balance of what an NFL tight end must be. He has hands, relative short passing game speed, but he also has the height and weight to more that holds his own as a plow horse against whatever the opposition lines up against him. He is also an excellent pass protector when needs be.
MIKE GESICKI
If you are looking for a tight end who can line up and help in the running game, he's not your guy.
HAYDEN HURST
[font=arial, sans-serif]Will need work as in-line blocker. [/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif]DALLAS GOEDERT[/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif]Effort level as blocker can be inconsistent. Needs to get better hip roll into initial contact. May need a fire lit under him in order to handle in-line blocking duties as a pro.[/font][/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif]MARK ANDREWS[/font][/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif]Despite his size, he lacks the desire and fundamentals as a blocker which will hurt his standing with some teams.[/font][/font][/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif]IAN THOMAS [/font][/font][/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif]Like Jermaine Gresham, Thomas has the bend and "man strength" to become a successful in-line blocker if he improves his hand placement and grit. [font=arial, sans-serif]His production is lacking due to shorter two-year run at Indiana and a senior season filled with injuries, but it is easy to see NFL ability that just needs coaching and more experience. [/font][/font][/font][/font][/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif]DALTON SCHULTZ[/font][/font][/font][/font][/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif]Schultz is a Y-tight end with the ability as a run blocker to help bolster a team's rushing attack very quickly. While his frame could still use more mass, he plays with good technique and play strength at the point of attack and shows an ability to impose his will upon edge defenders if they half-step into the rep. Schultz is a capable and reliable target underneath, but his living will depend on how he impacts the running game. [/font][/font][/font][/font][/font][/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif]You want the Thomas or Schultz type tight ends. Tight ends MUST have the ability to be a in-line blocker. Either Thomas or Schultz checks the hands box. There are plenty of WRs and RBs to sprint out and catch passes. Either will represent a good value in the middle rounds because the "sprint" tight ends are the trendy fashion types.[/font][/font][/font][/font][/font][/font]
Years back we acquired Bryce Paup. It seemed to be a great thing until it was realized the Jaguars did NOT develop any kind of a game plan that kept his exceptional pass rushing talent in mind.
The smart way to go when you want to do a little bit of this and a little bit of that is to look to the hybrid player. Jaylen Samuels of North Carolina State and Kalen Ballage of Arizone State are too good to pass up, but you have to develop a plan on how to use them.
(03-11-2018, 08:28 AM)JUNGLE CAT 2017 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-09-2018, 04:02 PM)knarnn Wrote: [ -> ]I was listening to Jaguars live on the home page and Brian Sexton and Johnny O were mentioning the reason behind letting ARob walk was because of the shift in our offensive identity. They stated that because we want to be a run first team the team may be looking at moving to more 2 TE sets as the main point in our offense similar to what the patriots did with Gronk and Hernandez. The more I think about it the more it somewhat makes sense.
Bringing in a guy like Burton then drafting another guy like Goedert, Gesicki, Hurst, Andrews etc would give you some serious seam stretching firepower if you can get them on the field at the same time. You could still run the ball, albeit in theory more effectively, as you won’t tip the play as easy as you do in our current line up. While I still would like to have ARob back, if this is what the team has in mind, I get it.
It will be a mistake to draft one of the "sprint' tight ends. To maintain a playoff-caliber rushing attack, your tight end must be a in-line blocker, a offensive tackle with hands. So, if you draft ANY of the tight end prospects, you will still require an in-line tight end to maintain the running game. You can't finesse a pro defensive front stacked against the run with a spiffy "sprint tight end".
Marcedes Lewis is close to the perfect balance of what an NFL tight end must be. He has hands, relative short passing game speed, but he also has the height and weight to more that holds his own as a plow horse against whatever the opposition lines up against him. He is also an excellent pass protector when needs be.
MIKE GESICKI
If you are looking for a tight end who can line up and help in the running game, he's not your guy.
HAYDEN HURST
[font=arial, sans-serif]Will need work as in-line blocker. [/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif]DALLAS GOEDERT[/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif]Effort level as blocker can be inconsistent. Needs to get better hip roll into initial contact. May need a fire lit under him in order to handle in-line blocking duties as a pro.[/font][/font]
I believe the Jags were interviewing Dalton Schultz who is probably the best blocking tight end and has some potential upside as a receiver. He may be a mid round target by the team.
(03-11-2018, 05:35 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ] (03-10-2018, 12:03 AM)Dakota Wrote: [ -> ]I just want to see if #27 can stay healthy for a whole season first. I don't want to put all of the Jaguar eggs into Fournette's basket.
Agreed. Wouldn't hurt my feelings nor would I be surprised if they decided to draft Chubb or Michel out of Georgia or maybe Guice out of LSU or Johnson out of Auburn on day two of the draft just to have as an insurance policy. I expect this draft to be very heavy towards the offense. Probably looking at LG/RG, TE, RB & QB in any order with the first four selections this year.
(03-09-2018, 04:58 PM)JNev Wrote: [ -> ]Call me crazy but I'd like to see them draw up more runs for Blake
Not crazy at all. I was disappointed that they didn't turn him loose more in the play-offs. Especially in the New England game. He's been one of the top two or three QB's with scrambling ability now and with the numbers to back it for the last two or three years.
(03-11-2018, 04:20 AM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah I'm not sure if it's the best move yet. You'd be paying for his skillset and hoping our offense can utilize him well.
I'd be indifferent to him as of right now.
Same. If the price is right for Burton I would be okay with it but it's hard to figure at the moment.
Good call on Rivera by the way. I think it was you who was big on Seferian-Jenkins earlier this year.
Believe it was someone else who as big on ASJ early in the year. I was just defending the merits of him Vs Rivera a few weeks ago.
(03-11-2018, 08:39 AM)FreeAgent01 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-11-2018, 08:28 AM)JUNGLE CAT 2017 Wrote: [ -> ]It will be a mistake to draft one of the "sprint' tight ends. To maintain a playoff-caliber rushing attack, your tight end must be a in-line blocker, a offensive tackle with hands. So, if you draft ANY of the tight end prospects, you will still require an in-line tight end to maintain the running game. You can't finesse a pro defensive front stacked against the run with a spiffy "sprint tight end".
Marcedes Lewis is close to the perfect balance of what an NFL tight end must be. He has hands, relative short passing game speed, but he also has the height and weight to more that holds his own as a plow horse against whatever the opposition lines up against him. He is also an excellent pass protector when needs be.
MIKE GESICKI
If you are looking for a tight end who can line up and help in the running game, he's not your guy.
HAYDEN HURST
[font=arial, sans-serif]Will need work as in-line blocker. [/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif]DALLAS GOEDERT[/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif]Effort level as blocker can be inconsistent. Needs to get better hip roll into initial contact. May need a fire lit under him in order to handle in-line blocking duties as a pro.[/font][/font]
I believe the Jags were interviewing Dalton Schultz who is probably the best blocking tight end and has some potential upside as a receiver. He may be a mid round target by the team.
This will be welcomed news.
The Jaguars must draft an in-line blocking tight end. The NFL predicates this. You have two BIG tight ends that block when you go 'jumbo' - short yardage and goal line offense.
You limit your roster to these two BIG tight ends. This frees up a vital roster spot for another unit. In the event of injury to both or you simply need three, the third tight end becomes the offensive tackle with the best pair of hands. You reach down to the practice squad for another BIG tight end you keep in development or hit the waiver wire for the additional 'jumbo' in-line blocking tight end.
In this quick edit, I add that if the Jaguars had the second in-line blocking tight end to use this past post-season, the benefit would have been obvious when the Patriots stacked eight and nine men in the box and challenged us to run the football.
(03-11-2018, 08:39 AM)FreeAgent01 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-11-2018, 08:28 AM)JUNGLE CAT 2017 Wrote: [ -> ]It will be a mistake to draft one of the "sprint' tight ends. To maintain a playoff-caliber rushing attack, your tight end must be a in-line blocker, a offensive tackle with hands. So, if you draft ANY of the tight end prospects, you will still require an in-line tight end to maintain the running game. You can't finesse a pro defensive front stacked against the run with a spiffy "sprint tight end".
Marcedes Lewis is close to the perfect balance of what an NFL tight end must be. He has hands, relative short passing game speed, but he also has the height and weight to more that holds his own as a plow horse against whatever the opposition lines up against him. He is also an excellent pass protector when needs be.
MIKE GESICKI
If you are looking for a tight end who can line up and help in the running game, he's not your guy.
HAYDEN HURST
[font=arial, sans-serif]Will need work as in-line blocker. [/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif]DALLAS GOEDERT[/font]
[font=arial, sans-serif][font=arial, sans-serif]Effort level as blocker can be inconsistent. Needs to get better hip roll into initial contact. May need a fire lit under him in order to handle in-line blocking duties as a pro.[/font][/font]
I believe the Jags were interviewing Dalton Schultz who is probably the best blocking tight end and has some potential upside as a receiver. He may be a mid round target by the team.
Hopefully they can get him in the 3rd round. That way they can get an offensive lineman and wide receiver in rounds 1 and 2. It wouldn't even surprise me if they traded up a little in the 3rd round if he's the next best tight end available. They could throw in their 6th rounder to do this.
TE is the most under appreciated position is football IMO. It’s hard to find a big man with the athletic abilities as a WR so I understand why it is sometimes pushed away. I think Fumagali from Wisconsin or Gisecki is our best bet. I’ve seen Gosecki make some crazy catches and he did well when paried with a good running back
Things are shaping up nicely with ASJ on board.
With the recent roster shuffling I think the line of thinking in the OP is starting to come to form. A pass catching TE should still be high on our list and a 2 or 3 TE front as a primary set would be the best way to combat a loaded box set to stop the run. Marcedes is a good red zone threat but is a non factor outside of that. A #1 WR isn’t needed as much as WRs who can perform off of play action.
I've mentioned that at least one team is sure to be enamoured enough by Gesicki's combine to take him near the tail end of round one. I just didn't realize the Jaguars might be that team.
I'd certainly wouldn't complain if Goedert or Gesicki were the pick at #29, although I figured they'd hold off and get Hayden Hurst in round two. As it relates, I don't think Andrews is in the Jaguars plans with his medical condition not being a good fit for Florida's humidity.
This makes the Lewis release more surprising to me. If we really are becoming a multiple tight end set team that wants to run, a guy like Marcedes is perfect for that. Really good run blocker and capable receiver. You dont want him to be your primary threat, but would be great in a multi tight end set because of his versatility. I dont get that feeling from the tight ends we replaced him with in free agency. And if we really are targeting Gesicki, he isnt that guy either. He is a WR only essentially.
I haven't read any opinion that gives a reasonable explanation of why we released Lewis. Not unless the team just felt he was old and not very good anymore.
(03-21-2018, 12:33 PM)rfc17 Wrote: [ -> ]This makes the Lewis release more surprising to me. If we really are becoming a multiple tight end set team that wants to run, a guy like Marcedes is perfect for that. Really good run blocker and capable receiver. You dont want him to be your primary threat, but would be great in a multi tight end set because of his versatility. I dont get that feeling from the tight ends we replaced him with in free agency. And if we really are targeting Gesicki, he isnt that guy either. He is a WR only essentially.
I haven't read any opinion that gives a reasonable explanation of why we released Lewis. Not unless the team just felt he was old and not very good anymore.
Perhaps the goal is not so much to improve the running game, but the passing game.
A 2 TE set of a clean, sober and healthy ASJ and a guy like Gesicki would seemingly pose any number of matchup problems for opposing defenses.
2 TE sets with 2 pass catching TEs is a bear to defend.