Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

(03-25-2018, 08:29 PM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-25-2018, 07:26 PM)JUNGLE CAT 2017 Wrote: [ -> ]The Lamar Jackson pick is OK. There are a number of selection that are debatable and nobody is complaining about them.

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Bryce Petty is not chopped liver. Over-confident, but not chopped liver.

He is in fact...... chopped liver.

I am not sure what happened to the reply, but I am glad it disappeared. Basically, McCown is a can of corn and Joel Stave is a log of frozen cream corn from the frozen foods case.

I'll speak for Joe Goodberry, he would be very disappointed that the Bengals didn't take Daniels or Wynn. He's been raving about them for a while.

Payne's a guy I think will have a solid and long career but not someone I'd take in the first.

(03-25-2018, 08:52 PM)JUNGLE CAT 2017 Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-25-2018, 08:29 PM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote: [ -> ]He is in fact...... chopped liver.

I am not sure what happened to the reply, but I am glad it disappeared. Basically, McCown is a can of corn and Joel Stave is a log of frozen cream corn from the frozen foods case.

Put them all together and the Jets are serving up a pretty crappy meal.

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(03-26-2018, 01:39 AM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ]I'll speak for Joe Goodberry, he would be very disappointed that the Bengals didn't take Daniels or Wynn. He's been raving about them for a while.

The Bengals have definite needs on the O-Line, but the defense hasn't been good either. Getting a chance to get another disruptor on the inside is just too good to pass up. I have Payne as a top 15 pick. I find him comparable to Geno Atkins and what's better than having Geno Atkins? How about two Geno Atkins types!

(03-26-2018, 01:39 AM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ]I'll speak for Joe Goodberry, he would be very disappointed that the Bengals didn't take Daniels or Wynn. He's been raving about them for a while.

There will be very good O-Linemen later in the draft. To be honest, no one guy stands out to me (other than Nelson), but there is a ton of quality on the top end.

(03-26-2018, 06:18 AM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-25-2018, 08:52 PM)JUNGLE CAT 2017 Wrote: [ -> ]I am not sure what happened to the reply, but I am glad it disappeared. Basically, McCown is a can of corn and Joel Stave is a log of frozen cream corn from the frozen foods case.

Put them all together and the Jets are serving up a pretty crappy meal.

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(03-26-2018, 01:39 AM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ]I'll speak for Joe Goodberry, he would be very disappointed that the Bengals didn't take Daniels or Wynn. He's been raving about them for a while.

The Bengals have definite needs on the O-Line, but the defense hasn't been good either. Getting a chance to get another disruptor on the inside is just too good to pass up. I have Payne as a top 15 pick. I find him comparable to Geno Atkins and what's better than having Geno Atkins? How about two Geno Atkins types!

Atkins is a 3 tech who wins with elite quickness , technique and leverage. Was a great pass rusher in college but undersized. 

Payne mostly played nose in college and his pass rushing and disruption was fairly non existent. He's a great run defender but rarely if ever got penetration. Wasn't asked to do it might either. Grand total of 1 TFL and 1 sack in 2017..

Wildly different skillsets as DTs...

James Washington is a rare WR who is built like a RB and can beat defenders deep. A few people will look at his 40 time and will think he won't be able to do it in the pros but he has game speed and will be faster with his pads and with his build kinda like Fournette. He also does it with his strong hand, technique put of his break, and can high point the ball as well even though he isn't that tall, a good route runner to. Not to mention his college teammate and best deep ball thrower in the draft will be throwing him the ball in Buffalo as well.

(03-26-2018, 07:15 AM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]James Washington is a rare WR who is built like a RB and can beat defenders deep.  A few people will look at his 40 time and will think he won't be able to do it in the pros but this game fast and faster I pass with his build kinda like Fournette.  He also does it with his strong hand, technique put of his break, and can high point the ball as well even though he isn't that tall, a good route runner to.  Not to mention his college teammate and best deep ball thrower in the draft will be throwing him the ball in Buffalo as well.

Pairing them up can only be beneficial to both. Kudos.

(03-26-2018, 06:47 AM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-26-2018, 06:18 AM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote: [ -> ]Put them all together and the Jets are serving up a pretty crappy meal.

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The Bengals have definite needs on the O-Line, but the defense hasn't been good either. Getting a chance to get another disruptor on the inside is just too good to pass up. I have Payne as a top 15 pick. I find him comparable to Geno Atkins and what's better than having Geno Atkins? How about two Geno Atkins types!

Atkins is a 3 tech who wins with elite quickness , technique and leverage. Was a great pass rusher in college but undersized. 

Payne mostly played nose in college and his pass rushing and disruption was fairly non existent. He's a great run defender but rarely if ever got penetration. Wasn't asked to do it might either. Grand total of 1 TFL and 1 sack in 2017..

Wildly different skillsets as DTs...

The Bengals - like the Ravens - are a BAP team. 

Here's a BAP list for our mock draft generated from NFLDRAFTSCOUT.COM:

WR Calvin Ridley Alabama
C James Daniels Iowa
OLB Harold Landry Boston College
CB Jaire Alexander Louisville
LB Leighton Vander Esch Boise State
OG Will Hernandez UTEP
DL Maurice Hurst Michigan +injury red flagged at Combine
OT Conner Williams Texas
DL Tavin Bryan Florida
OG Isaiah Wynn Georgia +shoulder injury
WR D. J. Moore Maryland
CB Mike Hughes Central Florida
OT Kolton Miller UCLA
SS Ronnie Harrison Alabama
DE Sam Hubbard Ohio State
RB Derrius Guice Louisiana State
OLB Rashaan Evans Alabama 
TE Mark Andrews Oklahoma
WR D. J. Chark Louisiana State
OLB Lorenzo Carter Georgia

Here is a second BAP list generated from NFL.COM

WR Calvin Ridley Alabama
DL Tavin Bryan Florida
RB Darrius Guice Louisiana State
LB Leighton Vander Esch Boise State
RB Ronald Jones Southern California
OLB Harold Landry Boston College
OG Will Hernandez UTEP
OT Orlando Brown Oklahoma + Bad Combine Workout???
FS Justin Reid Stanford
OG Isaiah Wynn Georgia
CB Carlton Davis Auburn
C James Daniels Iowa
DL Maurice Hurst Michigan +injury red flagged at Combine
DE Rasheem Greene Southern California
SS Ronnie Harrison Alabama
C/OG Billy Price Ohio State +Biceps injury
CB Mike Hughes Central Florida
DT Tim Settle Virginia Tech
CB Isaiah Oliver Colorado
CB Jaire Alexander Louisville
TE Hayden Hurst South Carolina

Oops had to edit my post above. Damn phone messed up

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(03-26-2018, 07:16 AM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-26-2018, 07:15 AM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]James Washington is a rare WR who is built like a RB and can beat defenders deep.  A few people will look at his 40 time and will think he won't be able to do it in the pros but this game fast and faster I pass with his build kinda like Fournette.  He also does it with his strong hand, technique put of his break, and can high point the ball as well even though he isn't that tall, a good route runner to.  Not to mention his college teammate and best deep ball thrower in the draft will be throwing him the ball in Buffalo as well.

Pairing them up can only be beneficial to both. Kudos.

Yeah, I don't think he would be the best WR for a team like the Jags but the Bill's could use a guy like him and I think would be a good fit.  Auto correct messes up some of my words when I type a lot on my phone

(03-26-2018, 06:47 AM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-26-2018, 06:18 AM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote: [ -> ]Put them all together and the Jets are serving up a pretty crappy meal.

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The Bengals have definite needs on the O-Line, but the defense hasn't been good either. Getting a chance to get another disruptor on the inside is just too good to pass up. I have Payne as a top 15 pick. I find him comparable to Geno Atkins and what's better than having Geno Atkins? How about two Geno Atkins types!

Atkins is a 3 tech who wins with elite quickness , technique and leverage. Was a great pass rusher in college but undersized. 

Payne mostly played nose in college and his pass rushing and disruption was fairly non existent. He's a great run defender but rarely if ever got penetration. Wasn't asked to do it might either. Grand total of 1 TFL and 1 sack in 2017..

Wildly different skillsets as DTs...

Payne was dominant against Georgia in the Championship game. I watched him break through the line on nearly every play. Pairing him next to Atkins is gonna give him a lot more opportunities to get to the QB. He has the skill set to effectively rush the passer, but was not asked to do so in college. He was solely there for run support. He is being brought in to make up for one of the few deficiencies in Atkins game, which is run stuffing. But his pass rushing skills will improve as well. This D-Line should become one of the top units in the NFL with this addition. Remember, Geno only totaled 3 sacks in his final two seasons at Georgia, once he was drafted to the Bengals, they asked him to do different things and now he is one of the best pass rushing DT's in the NFL.

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(03-26-2018, 07:18 AM)JUNGLE CAT 2017 Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-26-2018, 06:47 AM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]Atkins is a 3 tech who wins with elite quickness , technique and leverage. Was a great pass rusher in college but undersized. 

Payne mostly played nose in college and his pass rushing and disruption was fairly non existent. He's a great run defender but rarely if ever got penetration. Wasn't asked to do it might either. Grand total of 1 TFL and 1 sack in 2017..

Wildly different skillsets as DTs...

The Bengals - like the Ravens - are a BAP team. 

Here's a BAP list for our mock draft generated from NFLDRAFTSCOUT.COM:

WR Calvin Ridley Alabama
C James Daniels Iowa
OLB Harold Landry Boston College
CB Jaire Alexander Louisville
LB Leighton Vander Esch Boise State
OG Will Hernandez UTEP
DL Maurice Hurst Michigan +injury red flagged at Combine
OT Conner Williams Texas
DL Tavin Bryan Florida
OG Isaiah Wynn Georgia +shoulder injury
WR D. J. Moore Maryland
CB Mike Hughes Central Florida
OT Kolton Miller UCLA
SS Ronnie Harrison Alabama
DE Sam Hubbard Ohio State
RB Derrius Guice Louisiana State
OLB Rashaan Evans Alabama 
TE Mark Andrews Oklahoma
WR D. J. Chark Louisiana State
OLB Lorenzo Carter Georgia

Here is a second BAP list generated from NFL.COM

DL Tavin Bryan Florida
RB Darrius Guice Louisiana State
LB Leighton Vander Esch Boise State
RB Ronald Jones Southern California
OLB Harold Landry Boston College
OG Will Hernandez UTEP
OT Orlando Brown Oklahoma + Bad Combine Workout???
FS Justin Reid Stanford
OG Isaiah Wynn Georgia
CB Carlton Davis Auburn
C James Daniels Iowa
DL Maurice Hurst Michigan +injury red flagged at Combine
DE Rasheem Greene Southern California
SS Ronnie Harrison Alabama
C/OG Billy Price Ohio State +Biceps injury
CB Mike Hughes Central Florida
DT Tim Settle Virginia Tech
CB Isaiah Oliver Colorado
CB Jaire Alexander Louisville
TE Hayden Hurst South Carolina

That certainly isn't my list of best available players.

(03-26-2018, 08:39 AM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-26-2018, 06:47 AM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]Atkins is a 3 tech who wins with elite quickness , technique and leverage. Was a great pass rusher in college but undersized. 

Payne mostly played nose in college and his pass rushing and disruption was fairly non existent. He's a great run defender but rarely if ever got penetration. Wasn't asked to do it might either. Grand total of 1 TFL and 1 sack in 2017..

Wildly different skillsets as DTs...

Payne was dominant against Georgia in the Championship game. I watched him break through the line on nearly every play. Pairing him next to Atkins is gonna give him a lot more opportunities to get to the QB. He has the skill set to effectively rush the passer, but was not asked to do so in college. He was solely there for run support. He is being brought in to make up for one of the few deficiencies in Atkins game, which is run stuffing. But his pass rushing skills will improve as well. This D-Line should become one of the top units in the NFL with this addition. Remember, Geno only totaled 3 sacks in his final two seasons at Georgia, once he was drafted to the Bengals, they asked him to do different things and now he is one of the best pass rushing DT's in the NFL.

Geno Atkins finished his college career with 33 tackles for a loss and was extremely disruptive in the pass game for Georgia even if his sack numbers were low his last 2 years. He played 3 tech in college and was moved around.  
The only evidence we have of Payne being disruptive as a pass rusher is against Georgia and Tennessee.   
Nowhere near enough evidence to say he's disruptive or to comp him to Geno Atkins. Very different players. He's not bad at all..just a trash comp.

(03-26-2018, 09:02 AM)JackCity Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-26-2018, 08:39 AM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote: [ -> ]Payne was dominant against Georgia in the Championship game. I watched him break through the line on nearly every play. Pairing him next to Atkins is gonna give him a lot more opportunities to get to the QB. He has the skill set to effectively rush the passer, but was not asked to do so in college. He was solely there for run support. He is being brought in to make up for one of the few deficiencies in Atkins game, which is run stuffing. But his pass rushing skills will improve as well. This D-Line should become one of the top units in the NFL with this addition. Remember, Geno only totaled 3 sacks in his final two seasons at Georgia, once he was drafted to the Bengals, they asked him to do different things and now he is one of the best pass rushing DT's in the NFL.

Geno Atkins finished his college career with 33 tackles for a loss and was extremely disruptive in the pass game for Georgia even if his sack numbers were low his last 2 years. He played 3 tech in college and was moved around.  
The only evidence we have of Payne being disruptive as a pass rusher is against Georgia and Tennessee.   
Nowhere near enough evidence to say he's disruptive or to comp him to Geno Atkins. Very different players. He's not bad at all..just a trash comp.

We shall see.

So for the titans pick I was debating between Harold Landry and Will Hernandez.

Landry is an elite pass rusher who fell a ton and thats an extremely valuable position. Hernandez suited the titans style and run game perfectly but I was leaning Landry because pass rusher > interior Oline.

Also wanted to take Hernandez right under the nose of the Jags GM but JNev did the honours and made my choice easier.

There's no way possible that Calvin Ridley is STILL on the draft board at pick 1-26

Here is Mike Mayock's positional ranks for WR:

1. Calvin Ridley, Alabama
2. DJ Moore, Maryland
3. Christian Kirk, Texas A&M
4. Courtland Sutton, SMU
T-5. Anthony Miller, Memphis
T-5. DJ Chark, LSU

Rise: Moore (T-5), Chark (NR)
Fall: Kirk (2), Sutton (3), James Washington, Oklahoma State (4), Dante Pettis, Washington (T-5)

(03-26-2018, 01:18 PM)JUNGLE CAT 2017 Wrote: [ -> ]There's no way possible that Calvin Ridley is STILL on the draft board at pick 1-26

Here is Mike Mayock's positional ranks for WR:

1. Calvin Ridley, Alabama
2. DJ Moore, Maryland
3. Christian Kirk, Texas A&M
4. Courtland Sutton, SMU
T-5. Anthony Miller, Memphis
T-5. DJ Chark, LSU

Rise: Moore (T-5), Chark (NR)
Fall: Kirk (2), Sutton (3), James Washington, Oklahoma State (4), Dante Pettis, Washington (T-5)

Believe it or not, people have differing opinions on players abilities. Especially at WR this year there is faaaaar from a consensus really anywhere

Jags are on the clock

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Connor Williams is looking like a good pick right now for the Jags. Id still turn around and take a C for the Jags if the value is there, our oline would be set for the next 5 years

I think Daniels is slightly > Williams in the proverbial vacuum...but Williams' potential tackle versatility is nice in case Robinson doesn't take a big step forward.

(03-26-2018, 06:03 PM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ]I think Daniels is slightly > Williams in the proverbial vacuum...but Williams' potential tackle versatility is nice in case Robinson doesn't take a big step forward.

Williams could compete with Cann this years and take over for Parnell next year. Would James Daniels fit in what we want to do?  Said to be more fit for a zone scheme.  Id go Frank Ragnow if we went C in the first.  Ragnow has never allowed a sack in his 4 year career in the SEC and a moster in the run game.  Would be more than fine with Ragnow in the first if thats what the FO wanted to do,.

(03-26-2018, 06:12 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-26-2018, 06:03 PM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ]I think Daniels is slightly > Williams in the proverbial vacuum...but Williams' potential tackle versatility is nice in case Robinson doesn't take a big step forward.

Williams could compete with Cann this years and take over for Parnell next year. Would James Daniels fit in what we want to do?  Said to be more fit for a zone scheme.  Id go Frank Ragnow if we went C in the first.  Ragnow has never allowed a sack in his 4 year career in the SEC and a moster in the run game.  Would be more than fine with Ragnow in the first if thats what the FO wanted to do,.

I we took Ragnow, I'd install him at Center and move Linder to RG.