Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

One game but it's from the incident before the beginning of last year, not a new incident so there's still hope that he's shaped up since then. Time will tell.

Now he's been placed on the PUP list?

Jaguars reportedly place DE Dante Fowler Jr. on PUP list

(07-22-2018, 08:31 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Now he's been placed on the PUP list?

Jaguars reportedly place DE Dante Fowler Jr. on PUP list

Well, writings on the wall at this point. Another Gator bites the dust! Shame because it felt like he was beginning to fit a nice backup/change of pace role.

(07-22-2018, 09:36 AM)B2hibry Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-22-2018, 08:31 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Now he's been placed on the PUP list?

Jaguars reportedly place DE Dante Fowler Jr. on PUP list

Well, writings on the wall at this point. Another Gator bites the dust! Shame because it felt like he was beginning to fit a nice backup/change of pace role.

Just what you're looking for in a 3rd overall pick.

How many times do people have to see Fouler's story before they understand that drafting is all about getting great players regardless of the position, not about trying to fill roster slots.

I can't even believe this right now.

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(07-22-2018, 09:36 AM)B2hibry Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-22-2018, 08:31 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Now he's been placed on the PUP list?

Jaguars reportedly place DE Dante Fowler Jr. on PUP list

Well, writings on the wall at this point. Another Gator bites the dust! Shame because it felt like he was beginning to fit a nice backup/change of pace role.

On about 25 other teams he would be a starter. Campbell and Yan are just better than he is right now.

Looks like he's on his way out the door.

(07-22-2018, 10:08 AM)JagFanatic24 Wrote: [ -> ]I can't even believe this right now.

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(07-22-2018, 09:36 AM)B2hibry Wrote: [ -> ]Well, writings on the wall at this point. Another Gator bites the dust! Shame because it felt like he was beginning to fit a nice backup/change of pace role.

On about 25 other teams he would be a starter. Campbell and Yan are just better than he is right now.

Looks like he's on his way out the door.

On those teams he's be considered a stop gap guy they're trying to replace. Gets tons of terrible fouls, has no pass rush moves at all, and has had multiple off the field issues.

It wouldn't surprise me if we've already seen him play his last down here.

(07-22-2018, 10:29 AM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-22-2018, 10:08 AM)JagFanatic24 Wrote: [ -> ]I can't even believe this right now.

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On about 25 other teams he would be a starter. Campbell and Yan are just better than he is right now.

Looks like he's on his way out the door.

On those teams he's be considered a stop gap guy they're trying to replace. Gets tons of terrible fouls, has no pass rush moves at all, and has had multiple off the field issues.

It wouldn't surprise me if we've already seen him play his last down here.

I'm no fan, but think you're overstating it a bit.

(07-22-2018, 08:31 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Now he's been placed on the PUP list?

Jaguars reportedly place DE Dante Fowler Jr. on PUP list

There was speculation a few weeks back that he had some sort of upper body injury.

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(07-22-2018, 09:36 AM)B2hibry Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-22-2018, 08:31 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Now he's been placed on the PUP list?

Jaguars reportedly place DE Dante Fowler Jr. on PUP list

Well, writings on the wall at this point. Another Gator bites the dust! Shame because it felt like he was beginning to fit a nice backup/change of pace role.

Writing's on the wall?

While I do not know how serious the injury is, with the PUP designation, he could easily be back by week 2 and be effective.

He may not be back here in 2019, but I don't think this would be the final nail in the coffin, absent further information showing the injury was his fault.

(07-22-2018, 09:39 AM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-22-2018, 09:36 AM)B2hibry Wrote: [ -> ]Well, writings on the wall at this point. Another Gator bites the dust! Shame because it felt like he was beginning to fit a nice backup/change of pace role.

Just what you're looking for in a 3rd overall pick.

How many times do people have to see Fouler's story before they understand that drafting is all about getting great players regardless of the position, not about trying to fill roster slots.

Well, wait a minute.

Fowler's only real strike has been getting hurt.

He got into the road rage incident that led to his one game suspension.  It happens.  No big deal to me.

In 2016, his first action, he had a lot of penalties and did not make too much impact.

But last year, under coaches that hold players responsible, two full seasons removed from his ACL, he had a very good year.

Even if you view Fowler as a complete bust (and that would be a stretch given his performance last year, including the two sacks in the AFC championship) Caldwell has proven he knows how to draft.

Wow, A one game suspension and a injury and now the dude is a bust?

 Buuuuwwwwwwaaaaaaaa!!! #onlyonthejagsboard

(07-22-2018, 10:29 AM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-22-2018, 10:08 AM)JagFanatic24 Wrote: [ -> ]I can't even believe this right now.

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On about 25 other teams he would be a starter. Campbell and Yan are just better than he is right now.

Looks like he's on his way out the door.

On those teams he's be considered a stop gap guy they're trying to replace. Gets tons of terrible fouls, has no pass rush moves at all, and has had multiple off the field issues.

It wouldn't surprise me if we've already seen him play his last down here.

Stop gap guy they're trying to replace?

In Philadelphia, his 8 sacks (not counting his two in the playoffs) would have been good for second on the team for the world champs.
He would have also been second in sacks in Dallas, tied for second in Washington, and a half sack off the lead on the Giants.

In the NFC North, Fowler's 8 sacks would be second on the Vikings, Bears and Lions, and would have led the Packers.

In the NFC South, his 8 sacks would have been good for second on the Saints, 3rd on the Panthers (they had two guys tied for first with 11 sacks), 2nd in Atlanta, and would have led Tampa by 2 sacks.

In the NFC West, his 8 sacks would have 3rd on the Rams (behind Aaron Donald who had 11 and a half sack behind Quinn), 3rd on Seattle (one sack behind the leader, and a half sack behind Bennett), easily 2nd behind Jones in Arizona, and would have led the 49ers.

In the AFC East, Fowler would have led the Patriots, Bills and Jets in sacks, and would have been 2nd on Miami.

Among AFC North teams, Fowler would have been tied for 2nd on the Steelers (ahead of rookie T.J. Watt), tied for 2nd on Baltimore, 3rd on the Bengals, and would have led the Browns.

Fowler would have led Tennessee, easily led Indy, and would have been 2nd in Houston behind Clowney.

In the AFC West, Fowler would have been 2nd in KC, 3rd on the Bolts behind two other great DEs in Bosa and Ingram,tied for 2nd on the Raiders, and 2nd on Denver behind Miller.

So of the 31 other teams, he would have led or been in 2nd in sacks on 26 of them, based solely on his productivity last year.

Keep in mind, Fowler was playing as a situational rusher, not full time.  Now it's possible Fowler may not have been as productive in other systems.  But it's possible that playing more and in other systems, he may have been even more productive

You may think him a disappointment as a 3rd round pick for the Jaguars.

But given his still young age and productivity last year, he certainly wouldn't fit into the category of a guy teams would readily look to replace.

(07-22-2018, 10:51 AM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-22-2018, 09:39 AM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]Just what you're looking for in a 3rd overall pick.

How many times do people have to see Fouler's story before they understand that drafting is all about getting great players regardless of the position, not about trying to fill roster slots.

Well, wait a minute.

Fowler's only real strike has been getting hurt.

He got into the road rage incident that led to his one game suspension.  It happens.  No big deal to me.

In 2016, his first action, he had a lot of penalties and did not make too much impact.

But last year, under coaches that hold players responsible, two full seasons removed from his ACL, he had a very good year.

Even if you view Fowler as a complete bust (and that would be a stretch given his performance last year, including the two sacks in the AFC championship) Caldwell has proven he knows how to draft.

2 off field incidents and multiple immature plays gave him a rep that will stick until it doesn't.

(07-22-2018, 11:29 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-22-2018, 10:51 AM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]Well, wait a minute.

Fowler's only real strike has been getting hurt.

He got into the road rage incident that led to his one game suspension.  It happens.  No big deal to me.

In 2016, his first action, he had a lot of penalties and did not make too much impact.

But last year, under coaches that hold players responsible, two full seasons removed from his ACL, he had a very good year.

Even if you view Fowler as a complete bust (and that would be a stretch given his performance last year, including the two sacks in the AFC championship) Caldwell has proven he knows how to draft.

2 off field incidents and multiple immature plays gave him a rep that will stick until it doesn't.

Do those things damage his rep?

Certainly.

Do those things make him a complete bust when he is 24 years old and coming off of a 8 sack season (10 counting the playoffs) playing in a part time role, after missing all of his rookie year with a torn ACL?

Certainly not.

(07-22-2018, 11:28 AM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-22-2018, 10:29 AM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]On those teams he's be considered a stop gap guy they're trying to replace. Gets tons of terrible fouls, has no pass rush moves at all, and has had multiple off the field issues.

It wouldn't surprise me if we've already seen him play his last down here.

Stop gap gap guy trying to replace?

In Philadelphia, his 8 sacks (not counting his two in the playoffs) would have been good for second on the team for the world champs.
He would have also been second in sacks in Dallas, tied for second in Washington, and a half sack off the lead on the Giants.

In the NFC North, Fowler's 8 sacks would be second on the Vikings, Bears and Lions, and would have led the Packers.

In the NFC South, his 8 sacks would have been good for second on the Saints, 3rd on the Panthers (they had two guys tied for first with 11 sacks), 2nd in Atlanta, and would have led Tampa by 2 sacks.

In the NFC West, his 8 sacks would have 3rd on the Rams (behind Aaron Donald who had 11 and a half sack behind Quinn), 3rd on Seattle (one sack behind the leader, and a half sack behind Bennett), easily 2nd behind Jones in Arizona, and would have led the 49ers.

In the AFC East, Fowler would have led the Patriots, Bills and Jets in sacks, and would have been 2nd on Miami.

Among AFC North teams, Fowler would have been tied for 2nd on the Steelers (ahead of rookie T.J. Watt), tied for 2nd on Baltimore, 3rd on the Bengals, and would have led the Browns.

Fowler would have led Tennessee, easily led Indy, and would have been 2nd in Houston behind Clowney.

In the AFC West, Fowler would have been 2nd in KC, 3rd on the Bolts behind two other great DEs in Bosa and Ingram,tied for 2nd on the Raiders, and 2nd on Denver behind Miller.

So of the 31 other teams, he would have led or been in 2nd in sacks on 26 of them, based solely on his productivity last year.

Keep in mind, Fowler was playing as a situational rusher, not full time.  Now it's possible Fowler may not have been as productive in other systems.  But it's possible that playing more and in other systems, he may have been even more productive

You may think him a disappointment as a 3rd round pick for the Jaguars.

But given his still young age and productivity last year, he certainly wouldn't fit into the category of a guy teams would readily look to replace.

Fowler wouldn't have those numbers on those teams though, he's a product of those around him.

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(07-22-2018, 11:35 AM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-22-2018, 11:29 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]2 off field incidents and multiple immature plays gave him a rep that will stick until it doesn't.

Do those things damage his rep?

Certainly.

Do those things make him a complete bust when he is 24 years old and coming off of a 8 sack season (10 counting the playoffs) playing in a part time role, after missing all of his rookie year with a torn ACL?

Certainly not.

I don't think he's a complete bust; I don't think he's ever going to be 3rd pick value.

(07-22-2018, 11:35 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-22-2018, 11:28 AM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]Stop gap gap guy trying to replace?

In Philadelphia, his 8 sacks (not counting his two in the playoffs) would have been good for second on the team for the world champs.
He would have also been second in sacks in Dallas, tied for second in Washington, and a half sack off the lead on the Giants.

In the NFC North, Fowler's 8 sacks would be second on the Vikings, Bears and Lions, and would have led the Packers.

In the NFC South, his 8 sacks would have been good for second on the Saints, 3rd on the Panthers (they had two guys tied for first with 11 sacks), 2nd in Atlanta, and would have led Tampa by 2 sacks.

In the NFC West, his 8 sacks would have 3rd on the Rams (behind Aaron Donald who had 11 and a half sack behind Quinn), 3rd on Seattle (one sack behind the leader, and a half sack behind Bennett), easily 2nd behind Jones in Arizona, and would have led the 49ers.

In the AFC East, Fowler would have led the Patriots, Bills and Jets in sacks, and would have been 2nd on Miami.

Among AFC North teams, Fowler would have been tied for 2nd on the Steelers (ahead of rookie T.J. Watt), tied for 2nd on Baltimore, 3rd on the Bengals, and would have led the Browns.

Fowler would have led Tennessee, easily led Indy, and would have been 2nd in Houston behind Clowney.

In the AFC West, Fowler would have been 2nd in KC, 3rd on the Bolts behind two other great DEs in Bosa and Ingram,tied for 2nd on the Raiders, and 2nd on Denver behind Miller.

So of the 31 other teams, he would have led or been in 2nd in sacks on 26 of them, based solely on his productivity last year.

Keep in mind, Fowler was playing as a situational rusher, not full time.  Now it's possible Fowler may not have been as productive in other systems.  But it's possible that playing more and in other systems, he may have been even more productive

You may think him a disappointment as a 3rd round pick for the Jaguars.

But given his still young age and productivity last year, he certainly wouldn't fit into the category of a guy teams would readily look to replace.

Fowler wouldn't have those numbers on those teams though, he's a product of those around him.

But you don't know that for sure.

On a defense as talented as ours, everyone benefits from everyone else's production. 

With the coverage our back seven provides, it gives everyone on the DL an extra step or second to get to the passer.  With our DL getting the pressure it gets, the secondary doesn't have to cover as long and doesn't have to face as many accurate throws.  With as many accomplished pass rushers as we have, it makes it hard for offensive lines to double anyone, making everyone productive.  If we had Ngakoue and three Gene Smith era stiffs along the DL, does Yannick put up 12 sacks?  Not likely.

So to the extent that other defenses do not have that dynamic between pass rush and coverage, no it isn't likely Fowler benefits to that degree.

But playing full time, perhaps in a two point stance, it certainly isn't out of the question that he replicates those 8 sacks.

There is a reason the consensus was that he was a top 5-10 pick when he was drafted.

(07-22-2018, 10:51 AM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-22-2018, 09:39 AM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]Just what you're looking for in a 3rd overall pick.

How many times do people have to see Fouler's story before they understand that drafting is all about getting great players regardless of the position, not about trying to fill roster slots.

Well, wait a minute.

Fowler's only real strike has been getting hurt.

He got into the road rage incident that led to his one game suspension.  It happens.  No big deal to me.

In 2016, his first action, he had a lot of penalties and did not make too much impact.

But last year, under coaches that hold players responsible, two full seasons removed from his ACL, he had a very good year.

Even if you view Fowler as a complete bust (and that would be a stretch given his performance last year, including the two sacks in the AFC championship) Caldwell has proven he knows how to draft.

He also had that bizarre incident with the two women outside an elevator where he watched them have a fight rather than do anything to help anyone.

The way I look at his 2017 is he was the benefactor of a lot of help sliding away from him, and he still was mostly just the guy that got his stats as cleanup of what other guys did.

Two sacks in the AFC Championship, both were coverage sacks where he ran Tom Brady down. Don't get me wrong, he's a good athlete from a standpoint of running fast straight ahead for his size, but he's not a good pass rusher, and I expect a DE taken #3 overall to be more like Joey Bosa than Dion Jordan.

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(07-22-2018, 11:35 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-22-2018, 11:28 AM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]Stop gap gap guy trying to replace?

In Philadelphia, his 8 sacks (not counting his two in the playoffs) would have been good for second on the team for the world champs.
He would have also been second in sacks in Dallas, tied for second in Washington, and a half sack off the lead on the Giants.

In the NFC North, Fowler's 8 sacks would be second on the Vikings, Bears and Lions, and would have led the Packers.

In the NFC South, his 8 sacks would have been good for second on the Saints, 3rd on the Panthers (they had two guys tied for first with 11 sacks), 2nd in Atlanta, and would have led Tampa by 2 sacks.

In the NFC West, his 8 sacks would have 3rd on the Rams (behind Aaron Donald who had 11 and a half sack behind Quinn), 3rd on Seattle (one sack behind the leader, and a half sack behind Bennett), easily 2nd behind Jones in Arizona, and would have led the 49ers.

In the AFC East, Fowler would have led the Patriots, Bills and Jets in sacks, and would have been 2nd on Miami.

Among AFC North teams, Fowler would have been tied for 2nd on the Steelers (ahead of rookie T.J. Watt), tied for 2nd on Baltimore, 3rd on the Bengals, and would have led the Browns.

Fowler would have led Tennessee, easily led Indy, and would have been 2nd in Houston behind Clowney.

In the AFC West, Fowler would have been 2nd in KC, 3rd on the Bolts behind two other great DEs in Bosa and Ingram,tied for 2nd on the Raiders, and 2nd on Denver behind Miller.

So of the 31 other teams, he would have led or been in 2nd in sacks on 26 of them, based solely on his productivity last year.

Keep in mind, Fowler was playing as a situational rusher, not full time.  Now it's possible Fowler may not have been as productive in other systems.  But it's possible that playing more and in other systems, he may have been even more productive

You may think him a disappointment as a 3rd round pick for the Jaguars.

But given his still young age and productivity last year, he certainly wouldn't fit into the category of a guy teams would readily look to replace.

Fowler wouldn't have those numbers on those teams though, he's a product of those around him.

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(07-22-2018, 11:35 AM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]Do those things damage his rep?

Certainly.

Do those things make him a complete bust when he is 24 years old and coming off of a 8 sack season (10 counting the playoffs) playing in a part time role, after missing all of his rookie year with a torn ACL?

Certainly not.

I don't think he's a complete bust; I don't think he's ever going to be 3rd pick value.

Nail on the head right here.

(07-22-2018, 11:28 AM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-22-2018, 10:29 AM)SeldomRite Wrote: [ -> ]On those teams he's be considered a stop gap guy they're trying to replace. Gets tons of terrible fouls, has no pass rush moves at all, and has had multiple off the field issues.

It wouldn't surprise me if we've already seen him play his last down here.

Stop gap guy they're trying to replace?

In Philadelphia, his 8 sacks (not counting his two in the playoffs) would have been good for second on the team for the world champs.
He would have also been second in sacks in Dallas, tied for second in Washington, and a half sack off the lead on the Giants.

In the NFC North, Fowler's 8 sacks would be second on the Vikings, Bears and Lions, and would have led the Packers.

In the NFC South, his 8 sacks would have been good for second on the Saints, 3rd on the Panthers (they had two guys tied for first with 11 sacks), 2nd in Atlanta, and would have led Tampa by 2 sacks.

In the NFC West, his 8 sacks would have 3rd on the Rams (behind Aaron Donald who had 11 and a half sack behind Quinn), 3rd on Seattle (one sack behind the leader, and a half sack behind Bennett), easily 2nd behind Jones in Arizona, and would have led the 49ers.

In the AFC East, Fowler would have led the Patriots, Bills and Jets in sacks, and would have been 2nd on Miami.

Among AFC North teams, Fowler would have been tied for 2nd on the Steelers (ahead of rookie T.J. Watt), tied for 2nd on Baltimore, 3rd on the Bengals, and would have led the Browns.

Fowler would have led Tennessee, easily led Indy, and would have been 2nd in Houston behind Clowney.

In the AFC West, Fowler would have been 2nd in KC, 3rd on the Bolts behind two other great DEs in Bosa and Ingram,tied for 2nd on the Raiders, and 2nd on Denver behind Miller.

So of the 31 other teams, he would have led or been in 2nd in sacks on 26 of them, based solely on his productivity last year.

Keep in mind, Fowler was playing as a situational rusher, not full time.  Now it's possible Fowler may not have been as productive in other systems.  But it's possible that playing more and in other systems, he may have been even more productive

You may think him a disappointment as a 3rd round pick for the Jaguars.

But given his still young age and productivity last year, he certainly wouldn't fit into the category of a guy teams would readily look to replace.

He also would have been doubled on those other teams and produced nothing. When your a sub on the best DL, you get 1 on 1, pure pass rush situations. You don't have to think, fight through double teams, etc.


Some team will greatly overpay and get little back or this injury is serious and his $ comes back to reality for a backup.

Sent from my SM-T820 using Tapatalk

Pressures predict future sacks way better than sacks predict future sacks. Fowler had a measly 20 pressures to get his 8 sacks for an absurd and exceedingly unlikely to be sustainable 2.5 pressures per sack. The normal ratio for elite pass rushers is 6-7 pressures per sack.

Remember that article that got bandied around when Vic Beasley led the league in sacks and people were saying it was a fluke cause he only averaged 4.5 pressures per sack? Well, they were right...and we should expect a similar if not steeper drop off for Fowler if we're being honest.

Our elite secondary plus the fact that he'll always be getting less attention than the rest of our dline might help him keep a better than expected ratio, but not nearly what it was.

https://football.realgm.com/wiretap/4078...r-One-Game

Thank God, the NFL suspend an MLB player instead of Dante. (comments are funny...)

(07-22-2018, 11:15 AM)Jagwired Wrote: [ -> ]Wow, A one game suspension and a injury and now the dude is a bust?

 Buuuuwwwwwwaaaaaaaa!!! #onlyonthejagsboard

I don’t believe anyone called him a bust but with his history, injury, and the fact rumor has it he is not in playing shape (lost a ton of muscle), it would appear he won’t play much this year. Due for a new contract soon as well. Coughlin don’t play that!