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Rest In Peace Otto.  Your life matters to most of us here in the US. 

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/28/politics/...index.html

Rick Santorum stated the following:  "But, this is reprehensible, what he just did. He gave cover, as you said, to a leader who knew very well what was going on with Otto Warmbier," Santorum, who is a CNN political commentator, said. "And again, I don't understand why the President does this. I am disappointed, to say the least, that he did it."

Trump has already let everyone, North Korea included, know how he viewed this as unacceptable. Trump can't prove Kim knew about the torture (strangulation?), so why make baseless accusations that would potentially derail the negotiations? Seriously... what was he supposed to say?

(03-01-2019, 01:10 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]Trump has already let everyone, North Korea included, know how he viewed this as unacceptable. Trump can't prove Kim knew about the torture (strangulation?), so why make baseless accusations that would potentially derail the negotiations? Seriously... what was he supposed to say?

hehehehe ... Donald just can't help himself. A person with a soul would have kept his mouth shut.

Donald's a weird guy. Socialism: bad, bad, bad. Communism: good, good, good. Xi - great guy. Putin - good strong leader. Kim - my buddy and I believe whatever he tells me. 

And he can't understand why Kim doesn't want to buy a condo from him. Oh - also, Vietnam, another one-party Communist state - doing great!

And how is Otto's death unacceptable? Like the killing of the journalist by the Saudis was unacceptable? Hahahaha!

If Obama or Clinton had said anything like this Jim Jordan would be elbowing Trey Gowdy to be first in line to hold two weeks of hearings.

You just can't make this stuff up. What a loser.

(03-01-2019, 02:21 PM)Adam2012 Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-01-2019, 01:10 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]Trump has already let everyone, North Korea included, know how he viewed this as unacceptable. Trump can't prove Kim knew about the torture (strangulation?), so why make baseless accusations that would potentially derail the negotiations? Seriously... what was he supposed to say?

hehehehe ... Donald just can't help himself. A person with a soul would have kept his mouth shut.

Donald's a weird guy. Socialism: bad, bad, bad. Communism: good, good, good. Xi - great guy. Putin - good strong leader. Kim - my buddy and I believe whatever he tells me. 

And he can't understand why Kim doesn't want to buy a condo from him. Oh - also, Vietnam, another one-party Communist state - doing great!

And how is Otto's death unacceptable? Like the killing of the journalist by the Saudis was unacceptable? Hahahaha!

If Obama or Clinton had said anything like this Jim Jordan would be elbowing Trey Gowdy to be first in line to hold two weeks of hearings.

You just can't make this stuff up. What a loser.

You fit the profile of someone who would overuse the phrase hehehe.

Trump stepped in it with this statement. I understand his motivation for attempting to avoid an accusatory tone, but in doing so he lost touch with those who are most directly affected by it. He needs to publicly revisit this, revise his statement and apologize.

(03-01-2019, 02:21 PM)Adam2012 Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-01-2019, 01:10 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]Trump has already let everyone, North Korea included, know how he viewed this as unacceptable. Trump can't prove Kim knew about the torture (strangulation?), so why make baseless accusations that would potentially derail the negotiations? Seriously... what was he supposed to say?

hehehehe ... Donald just can't help himself. A person with a soul would have kept his mouth shut.

Donald's a weird guy. Socialism: bad, bad, bad. Communism: good, good, good. Xi - great guy. Putin - good strong leader. Kim - my buddy and I believe whatever he tells me. 

And he can't understand why Kim doesn't want to buy a condo from him. Oh - also, Vietnam, another one-party Communist state - doing great!

And how is Otto's death unacceptable? Like the killing of the journalist by the Saudis was unacceptable? Hahahaha!

If Obama or Clinton had said anything like this Jim Jordan would be elbowing Trey Gowdy to be first in line to hold two weeks of hearings.

You just can't make this stuff up. What a loser.

So, if he's asked about it, you recommend that he remain silent?

It's odd that you take Trump complimenting China / North Korea as an endorsement for Communism. Most people would see he's just stroking their ego as he negotiates with them. You, however, see it as some weird sign of affection. 

You offer no real alternative, just that what he did was incorrect. Oh, and you deflect... as usual.

Knowing that Regime he's lucky he's not resting in pieces.

(03-01-2019, 03:49 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]So, if he's asked about it, you recommend that he remain silent?

Yes, what they heck has Kim Jung Un done to show that you should take him on his word; especially, when it comes to imprisonment and torture.

na·ive
Dictionary result for naive
/nīˈēv/
adjective(of a person or action) showing a lack of experience, wisdom, or judgment.

1. "the rather naive young man had been totally misled"
   

Christ on a cracker. Can you guys find something more substantial to [BLEEP] about? In a hell hole like that, I'd say it would be pretty easy to stow a guy away in some far away camp in northern North Korea or some Nk camp in Russia without many knowing. So what if he knew or didn't know. Can't do anything about it now.

(03-01-2019, 05:03 PM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-01-2019, 03:49 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]So, if he's asked about it, you recommend that he remain silent?

Yes, what they heck has Kim Jung Un done to show that you should take him on his word; especially, when it comes to imprisonment and torture.

na·ive
Dictionary result for naive
/nīˈēv/
adjective(of a person or action) showing a lack of experience, wisdom, or judgment.

1. "the rather naive young man had been totally misled"
   

Naivety is believing Trump ignoring questions is a reasonable solution to this made-up outrage.

Trump has already expressed his problems with the Otto situation to Kim personally. Even though Kim probably knew about it, you can't prove it. How would openly insulting Kim, on something you can't prove, be beneficial to anyone.

(03-01-2019, 06:34 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-01-2019, 05:03 PM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]Yes, what they heck has Kim Jung Un done to show that you should take him on his word; especially, when it comes to imprisonment and torture.

na·ive
Dictionary result for naive
/nīˈēv/
adjective(of a person or action) showing a lack of experience, wisdom, or judgment.

1. "the rather naive young man had been totally misled"
   

Naivety is believing Trump ignoring questions is a reasonable solution to this made-up outrage.

Trump has already expressed his problems with the Otto situation to Kim personally. Even though Kim probably knew about it, you can't prove it. How would openly insulting Kim, on something you can't prove, be beneficial to anyone.

The Americans took several measures over the course of Otto's lengthy imprisonment to get him out.  Of course, Kim was fully aware.

Trump just stated he is in a bad position because he has to negotiate.  TRUMP IS WEAK !!  PRESIDENT REAGAN TOOK ON THE SOVIETS DIRECTLY AND DID THE SAME TO OTHER COMMUNIST AND DICTATORSHIP LEAD COUNTRIES.

As Trump walks out on negotiations, he's weak because he didn't rehash this? Really?

(03-03-2019, 09:30 AM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-01-2019, 06:34 PM)JagNGeorgia Wrote: [ -> ]Naivety is believing Trump ignoring questions is a reasonable solution to this made-up outrage.

Trump has already expressed his problems with the Otto situation to Kim personally. Even though Kim probably knew about it, you can't prove it. How would openly insulting Kim, on something you can't prove, be beneficial to anyone.

The Americans took several measures over the course of Otto's lengthy imprisonment to get him out.  Of course, Kim was fully aware.

Trump just stated he is in a bad position because he has to negotiate.  TRUMP IS WEAK !!  PRESIDENT REAGAN TOOK ON THE SOVIETS DIRECTLY AND DID THE SAME TO OTHER COMMUNIST AND DICTATORSHIP LEAD COUNTRIES.

"DIRECTLY"



We didn't bomb the Soviet Union, didn't shoot at their troops or sink their ships, and while there were existing trade sanctions, I don't remember Reagan increasing them. Reagan made some verbal demands and threats, but never took "DIRECT" action against the Soviets.

Reagan did invade Grenada and supported the Contras in Nicaragua, but neither of those countries had artillery poised to instantly destroy the largest city of an ally, never mind that the Norks also have nukes.

Trump tried to negotiate a favorable deal. He failed (So far. But I've gotten a car dealer to call me back and accept my original offer after I initially walked, so it's still possible). At least he didn't agree to a grossly unfavorable deal like the three former presidents.

(03-03-2019, 12:53 PM)MalabarJag Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-03-2019, 09:30 AM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]The Americans took several measures over the course of Otto's lengthy imprisonment to get him out.  Of course, Kim was fully aware.

Trump just stated he is in a bad position because he has to negotiate.  TRUMP IS WEAK !!  PRESIDENT REAGAN TOOK ON THE SOVIETS DIRECTLY AND DID THE SAME TO OTHER COMMUNIST AND DICTATORSHIP LEAD COUNTRIES.

"DIRECTLY"



We didn't bomb the Soviet Union, didn't shoot at their troops or sink their ships, and while there were existing trade sanctions, I don't remember Reagan increasing them. Reagan made some verbal demands and threats, but never took "DIRECT" action against the Soviets.

Reagan did invade Grenada and supported the Contras in Nicaragua, but neither of those countries had artillery poised to instantly destroy the largest city of an ally, never mind that the Norks also have nukes.

Trump tried to negotiate a favorable deal. He failed (So far. But I've gotten a car dealer to call me back and accept my original offer after I initially walked, so it's still possible). At least he didn't agree to a grossly unfavorable deal like the three former presidents.

That scenario is the perfect metaphor for this presidency.

(03-03-2019, 10:09 AM)jj82284 Wrote: [ -> ]As Trump walks out on negotiations, he's weak because he didn't rehash this?  Really?

I actually negotiate contracts for a living so no, he wasn't weak for walking out as that is standard practice in the industry.  He is weak for discarding the actual events that took place  since Otto being taken captive up until his death; ultimately, giving Kim a "pardon" --- sometimes he just needs to shut up (another key skill in negotiating) !!!

(03-03-2019, 05:02 PM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-03-2019, 10:09 AM)jj82284 Wrote: [ -> ]As Trump walks out on negotiations, he's weak because he didn't rehash this?  Really?

I actually negotiate contracts for a living so no, he wasn't weak for walking out as that is standard practice in the industry.  He is weak for discarding the actual events that took place  since Otto being taken captive up until his death; ultimately, giving Kim a "pardon" --- sometimes he just needs to shut up (another key skill in negotiating) !!!

U negotiate contracts?  Cool.  How many nuclear armed psychopaths have u disarmed?   

"My button is bigger than your button" madman

"We get along well, I take him at his word" wuss

Let it all play out the evaluate

(03-03-2019, 05:07 PM)jj82284 Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-03-2019, 05:02 PM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]I actually negotiate contracts for a living so no, he wasn't weak for walking out as that is standard practice in the industry.  He is weak for discarding the actual events that took place  since Otto being taken captive up until his death; ultimately, giving Kim a "pardon" --- sometimes he just needs to shut up (another key skill in negotiating) !!!

U negotiate contracts?  Cool.  How many nuclear armed psychopaths have u disarmed?   

Are you referring to Trump or Kim, or both?

(03-03-2019, 06:41 PM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-03-2019, 05:07 PM)jj82284 Wrote: [ -> ]U negotiate contracts?  Cool.  How many nuclear armed psychopaths have u disarmed?   

Are you referring to Trump or Kim, or both?

Okay, I had to laugh at that one.

(03-01-2019, 12:05 PM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]Rest In Peace Otto.  Your life matters to most of us here in the US. 

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/28/politics/...index.html

Rick Santorum stated the following:  "But, this is reprehensible, what he just did. He gave cover, as you said, to a leader who knew very well what was going on with Otto Warmbier," Santorum, who is a CNN political commentator, said. "And again, I don't understand why the President does this. I am disappointed, to say the least, that he did it."

Kim Jong Un knows every detail of what happened to Otto.  He may not have paid much attention while Otto's brain was still healthy, but I'm sure he's looked into the details by now.  So do a few others in the NK regime.


History will find out eventually.  But I don't see how this kind of knowledge would help anyone feel better. Otto is only in the next world, not this one.  Whatever happened to him over there is roughly the same as what has happened to hundreds of thousands of innocent Koreans over there.  I don't know how to hold the Kims accountable for their crimes without making things worse.  It's actually kind of sad that they are so diplomatically isolated.  It would be a wonderful thing if an American President could meet them at the negotiating table and offer them exile if they renounced their position and government and never came back.  Is St Helena available?

I'm glad conservatives Republicans Trump supporters have learned not to overreact to everything a President says, like they used to under Obama.   Of course, some might say they've taken it to an extreme, but still... learning to remain calm and forgiving in the face of absolutely ridiculous statements from the President is I suppose a good thing.