Even though we are only 1-3. Dave dodged a bullet with Vernon not signing. So far Yannick is looking like an all pro and Vernon is a waste of money. Even though Vernon is really good against the run. 1 sack is far from being one of the highest paid DE in the nfl.
So as bad as it has been. Imagine how much worse we could of been if we signed Vernon. Who is not disruptive at all so far for the giants. When Yannick is not taking any plays off and is playing above and beyond normal NFL rookies.
Go Jags!
Yannick is not looking like an all pro. Just a promising young rookie.
Quote:Yannick is not looking like an all pro. Just a promising young rookie.
I disagree. He is playing better then most pass rushers we have had since Kampman and he couldnt stay healthy. Before that was Heywood but same. So going back to when Brackens?
Yannick is not looking like an all pro. Calm down. And sacks are not everything.
Quote:Yannick is not looking like an all pro. Calm down. And sacks are not everything.
Are int's worthless too?
Quote:I disagree. He is playing better then most pass rushers we have had since Kampman and he couldnt stay healthy. Before that was Heywood but same. So going back to when Brackens?
So because he looks better than the trash we've had he's an all-pro? Ngakoue has a lot of splash plays and he's pretty good at getting in the QB's face but he sucks against the run. Not an all-pro.
Quote:Are int's worthless too?
Did I say they were worthless? I said they weren't everything, just like INTs aren't. Marcus Peters gets a lot of INTs but he gets beat as much as he picks the ball off. Likewise, you can get a lot of sacks and not be consistently pressuring the QB. Olivier Vernon pressures the QB more consistently than Ngakoue does right now even though Ngakoue has more sacks. It's a lot of factors that go into getting sacks and they are not representative of how disruptive a player is. Fowler only had 8.5 sacks his last year at Florida but he was still one of the most disruptive players in the country. Vernon is a better player than Ngakoue right now plain and simple. Was he worth the money? Probably not, but either way it doesn't matter. We have what we have, no point in trying to go back and sing the praises of Caldwell and claim Vernon a bust especially when you're wrong in the first place.
Quote:So because he looks better than the trash we've had he's an all-pro? Ngakoue has a lot of splash plays and he's pretty good at getting in the QB's face but he sucks against the run. Not an all-pro.
Did I say they were worthless? I said they weren't everything, just like INTs aren't. Marcus Peters gets a lot of INTs but he gets beat as much as he picks the ball off. Likewise, you can get a lot of sacks and not be consistently pressuring the QB. Olivier Vernon pressures the QB more consistently than Ngakoue does right now even though Ngakoue has more sacks. It's a lot of factors that go into getting sacks and they are not representative of how disruptive a player is. Fowler only had 8.5 sacks his last year at Florida but he was still one of the most disruptive players in the country. Vernon is a better player than Ngakoue right now plain and simple. Was he worth the money? Probably not, but either way it doesn't matter. We have what we have, no point in trying to go back and sing the praises of Caldwell and claim Vernon a bust especially when you're wrong in the first place.
Fowler is a rookie and looking better then Vernon. Same with Yannick. You don't pay a guy huge money as a pass rusher to be a run stuffer. The guy who's friend is a die hard giants fan and watches every game even said vernon is okay. I love those who look at ff stat line. And act like they know something. How do you not see an issue if both fowler and yannick both rookies have more sacks then one of the highest paid Pass rushers who in 4 games has one sack and zero ints and 12 tackles.
If he was here right now fans be crying over his lack of production. But because plays for the giants is so great? How bout no. Still stinks. Is not playing like is being paid to play. And in jax people be calling for his head. And not like he is the main pass rusher cause jpp is there as well.
Ok, you clearly haven't watched Vernon this year. In fact, I bet tonight was the first time you've even seen him play and that's why you made this thread after looking up his stats real quick. Bye.
Quote:So because he looks better than the trash we've had he's an all-pro? Ngakoue has a lot of splash plays and he's pretty good at getting in the QB's face but he sucks against the run
. Not an all-pro.
Ngakoue was drafted as a pass rusher first. This scheme essentially has 3 DT's on the field to stop the run in base downs and requires quick linebackers to close the gaps. He will develop against the run but getting to the QB is the most important thing and the primary role of the LEO position. And yes, he has been doing that better than Vernon.
1-3, last in division, at least we have one of the bestest young rosters. So comforting. But wait, next year when we get a new coach...
But the coach is going to bring new systems. They have to learn all over again, and gel in the new setup
So then, the following year then...
We are Jags
Quote:Ok, you clearly haven't watched Vernon this year. In fact, I bet tonight was the first time you've even seen him play and that's why you made this thread after looking up his stats real quick. Bye.
Well if you wanna do stats Fowler has 2 PD Yannick has one Vernon has 0. So he rushes and so far can't bat down a pass and can't sack. Yup top five Pass rusher money right there.
In 4 games, Vernon has 2 more hurries than Ngakoue. A rookie third round pick. Take in account Vernon is on the field more too.
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It can be true that Vernon has been better than Yannick and Fowler (he has), but that it was still good we aren't on the hook for another top contract on our salary cap.
I think that's the case here.
Quote:1-3, last in division, at least we have one of the bestest young rosters. So comforting. But wait, next year when we get a new coach...
But the coach is going to bring new systems. They have to learn all over again, and gel in the new setup
So then, the following year then...
We are Jags
Normally I would agree. However our new guard is brand new just picked up a few weeks back. our guard was moved to center (linder) our new LT (beachum) is coming off an injury. Our rb (ivory) is new, Lee is still a work in progress and 7 defenders are new. (ramsey) (fowler first year playing off of injury) (yannick) (jack) (Gipson) (prince) (jackson) and (colvin in my eyes one of our best corners) is just returning back.
It will take time to gel. If in the next 2-4 games we don't improve ya can state that. But to think all these players will learn a brand new playbook and play high caliber out of the gate is foolish at best.
I am thinking we will win 7 or 8 games this year. Which is a major improvement. And shows signs are looking up. Anything above that. Is gravy. But 7-9 with a good chunk of new starters is reasonable.
Quote:Ngakoue was drafted as a pass rusher first. This scheme essentially has 3 DT's on the field to stop the run in base downs and requires quick linebackers to close the gaps. He will develop against the run but getting to the QB is the most important thing and the primary role of the LEO position. And yes, he has been doing that better than Vernon.
The issue I was addressing is if he looks like an all-pro or not. An all-pro is not a sieve against the run.
YN has played above anyone's expectations so far. Yes, as of now, he is playing better than Vernon.
Yes I think we dodged a bullet.
Honest question, do we have evidence that Yannick has been a sieve against the run? I know that was in his scouting report but I can't think of any plays where he has clearly looked awful against the run. I also can't find any stats that say he is really bad against the run either.
About all I can find is a quote from Gus last week saying the team has been quite surprised by how good he has held up against the run. Obviously that doesn't mean much, but it's a little something where I can't find anything else.