Leaving the 2018 draft, we kind of all assumed that Taven Bryan was going to be a back up in his rookie year who was extremely raw. I think we were down on him because we were losing but I think he has the talent to turn out to be pretty good this season. Any thoughts?
He has to find the football. He got lost in the scrum last season.
(04-30-2019, 03:47 AM)Black and Teal Wrote: [ -> ]Leaving the 2018 draft, we kind of all assumed that Taven Bryan was going to be a back up in his rookie year who was extremely raw. I think we were down on him because we were losing but I think he has the talent to turn out to be pretty good this season. Any thoughts?
I don't have much to say about it other than I that I agree with you. He passed my eyeball test physically. He moves like an NFL player. Very few rookie defensive linemen do much in their first season. And from what I have read, he is a hard worker and willing learner. So I have hope for the guy.
(04-30-2019, 03:47 AM)Black and Teal Wrote: [ -> ]Leaving the 2018 draft, we kind of all assumed that Taven Bryan was going to be a back up in his rookie year who was extremely raw. I think we were down on him because we were losing but I think he has the talent to turn out to be pretty good this season. Any thoughts?
He has a full season under his belt, and has an abundance of talent surrounding him.
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Everything is in place for him to succeed. He shouldn't face any double teams to start the season.
I want to see some improvement from him. More impact plays....more TFLs... more pressures/sacks...more disruptions in the backfield.
He needs to get stronger, bigger, and quicker. He couldn't get off the O-lineman's block last year. Hopefully he's been hitting the weights and doing speed drills.
Just looked at some film on Youtube, he used to overpower blocks in college. This didn't work for him going against guys they were bigger in the NFL. He has quick feet and needs to use this to his advantage. One thing he could work on is the push-pull move where he meets the block head-on, then moves backwards quickly and pulls the lineman down.
He should also be trying to get around the block instead of trying to bull-rush his way forward, which is what worked for him in college. Not sure how much the Jags like to stunt, but he'd benefit from this.
needs to improve a ton reading his blocks or he's not much good on the field bar a splash play or two. Has to improve on all the usual things like hand technique, pad level etc etc.
We should see some development in all those areas through the year simply through play time but still skeptical he gives much of an impact
(04-30-2019, 09:28 AM)cincyjacket Wrote: [ -> ]He needs to get stronger, bigger, and quicker. He couldn't get off the O-lineman's block last year. Hopefully he's been hitting the weights and doing speed drills.
So, he's too weak, too small, and too slow. Now that we've come to the conclusion that his tangible skills are deficient, can we at least do the Tebow thing and say his intangibles are good?
Taven played out of position most of last year. When he was placed back into his natural position we saw improvement w/respect to better success. This year I truly believe that we'll see additional improvement.
NH3...
(04-30-2019, 05:20 AM)JaguarJosh05 Wrote: [ -> ]He has to find the football. He got lost in the scrum last season.
I see this take frequently.
It's really funny how those two or three plays influence fans' overall opinion on the kid.
In reality, ball awareness is an issue, but it's probably only a minor one. He'll be more experienced entering the season this year and the game should slow down for him a bit. I bet the awareness takes care of itself easily as he matures a bit.
As mentioned, hand technique and pad level are areas he needs to polish and I'd rank that well ahead of this inflated perception that he's "lost" out there.
Those of you saying he's not strong... I have no idea what you've watched. The kid looks as strong on bull rushes as nearly any 3 tech in the game. He's just raw and he has a full offseason to improve that. Strength is the least of his issues IMO.
As I mentioned in the other Bryan thread a few weeks ago, I expect he'll rack up some pressures at about a 7% clip and an 11:1 sack ratio on those pressures.
So, if he gets around 700 snaps at 3 tech, we'd see in the neighborhood of 50 pressures and 4.5 sacks.
Hopefully he exceeds those numbers, but that would be a solid contribution.
Let's give him more than a handful of games at his true position before judging him....
(04-30-2019, 11:34 AM)jaglawyer Wrote: [ -> ]Let's give him more than a handful of games at his true position before judging him....
This. He didn't play outside very much for the Gators. He was worked mostly inside. And he honestly didn't play a whole lot for them to begin with. The Jaguars thought they were set to be a play-off team for the next few years after the 2017 campaign ended. They considered Bryan a project player to work in behind Campbell just based on his frame and showing at the combine.
But he did seem out of place too much off the edge as a rookie. That's just from being extremely raw and we all know that. But the idea that he's not strong enough (and I am not aiming this at you) is hilarious. The kid threw 225 pounds up 30 times on the bench. And still cleared a 4.98 at the combine in the 40 at his size. Those are good numbers to have... for an inside defender who played inside at Florida. Not outside. At least not yet.
I think he'll find his home this year playing inside for us. He did use the bull rush move quite a bit off the edge as a rookie. And he was flat out moving guys with two hands in front of him at times. Maybe he was caught out of position and appeared "weak" and "slow" off the edge because he was thinking too much and trying to figure out how to approach his role. Moving him back inside is the best way to go.
Once they moved him to the 3 tech, he played much better. I guarantee we will see improvement this season. His work ethic and measurable all but insure that. The only way he doesn't take a significant step forward this season is if he gets injured.
(04-30-2019, 01:07 PM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]I just hope he can edge out Chris Prosinski and John Chick as being the best Jag player to come from Wyoming.
https://trib.com/news/state-and-regional...07.html#20
Up until that knee i jury, John Chick was EXPLOSIVE off the edge. Back i the DPR days that dudes first step and ability to get after the QB was something, huge liability against the run though
(04-30-2019, 11:09 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (04-30-2019, 05:20 AM)JaguarJosh05 Wrote: [ -> ]He has to find the football. He got lost in the scrum last season.
I see this take frequently.
It's really funny how those two or three plays influence fans' overall opinion on the kid.
In reality, ball awareness is an issue, but it's probably only a minor one. He'll be more experienced entering the season this year and the game should slow down for him a bit. I bet the awareness takes care of itself easily as he matures a bit.
As mentioned, hand technique and pad level are areas he needs to polish and I'd rank that well ahead of this inflated perception that he's "lost" out there.
Those of you saying he's not strong... I have no idea what you've watched. The kid looks as strong on bull rushes as nearly any 3 tech in the game. He's just raw and he has a full offseason to improve that. Strength is the least of his issues IMO.
As I mentioned in the other Bryan thread a few weeks ago, I expect he'll rack up some pressures at about a 7% clip and an 11:1 sack ratio on those pressures.
So, if he gets around 700 snaps at 3 tech, we'd see in the neighborhood of 50 pressures and 4.5 sacks.
Hopefully he exceeds those numbers, but that would be a solid contribution.
I Concur to all of the above.
NH3...
(04-30-2019, 11:09 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (04-30-2019, 05:20 AM)JaguarJosh05 Wrote: [ -> ]He has to find the football. He got lost in the scrum last season.
I see this take frequently.
It's really funny how those two or three plays influence fans' overall opinion on the kid.
In reality, ball awareness is an issue, but it's probably only a minor one. He'll be more experienced entering the season this year and the game should slow down for him a bit. I bet the awareness takes care of itself easily as he matures a bit.
As mentioned, hand technique and pad level are areas he needs to polish and I'd rank that well ahead of this inflated perception that he's "lost" out there.
Those of you saying he's not strong... I have no idea what you've watched. The kid looks as strong on bull rushes as nearly any 3 tech in the game. He's just raw and he has a full offseason to improve that. Strength is the least of his issues IMO.
As I mentioned in the other Bryan thread a few weeks ago, I expect he'll rack up some pressures at about a 7% clip and an 11:1 sack ratio on those pressures.
So, if he gets around 700 snaps at 3 tech, we'd see in the neighborhood of 50 pressures and 4.5 sacks.
Hopefully he exceeds those numbers, but that would be a solid contribution.
And the few times he did look like he got lost on the play, it usually came from him getting into the back field so fast, he simply ran himself right out/past the play.
I can't wait to see Ngakoue, Bryan, Campbell and Allen coming after QBs on 3rd down. There's a lot of explosion coming from those 4 in that lineup.
And I agree exactly about the strength comments. The one thing Bryan isn't lacking is strength and he showed that early. He's really strong, but he just lacks the hand placement/techniques to take full advantage of it.
(04-30-2019, 11:57 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ] (04-30-2019, 11:34 AM)jaglawyer Wrote: [ -> ]Let's give him more than a handful of games at his true position before judging him....
This. He didn't play outside very much for the Gators. He was worked mostly inside. And he honestly didn't play a whole lot for them to begin with. The Jaguars thought they were set to be a play-off team for the next few years after the 2017 campaign ended. They considered Bryan a project player to work in behind Campbell just based on his frame and showing at the combine.
But he did seem out of place too much off the edge as a rookie. That's just from being extremely raw and we all know that. But the idea that he's not strong enough (and I am not aiming this at you) is hilarious. The kid threw 225 pounds up 30 times on the bench. And still cleared a 4.98 at the combine in the 40 at his size. Those are good numbers to have... for an inside defender who played inside at Florida. Not outside. At least not yet.
I think he'll find his home this year playing inside for us. He did use the bull rush move quite a bit off the edge as a rookie. And he was flat out moving guys with two hands in front of him at times. Maybe he was caught out of position and appeared "weak" and "slow" off the edge because he was thinking too much and trying to figure out how to approach his role. Moving him back inside is the best way to go.
Bryan said it himself in an interview that 3 Tech is the only position on the DL hes ever played, at any level.
It was obvious he was going to struggle when trying to learn/play a brand new position (5T DE) when hes literally never played it before in his life. Then you add onto the fact that he has to do it going against the best players in the world at said sport.
(04-30-2019, 06:29 PM)Eric1 Wrote: [ -> ] (04-30-2019, 11:09 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]I see this take frequently.
It's really funny how those two or three plays influence fans' overall opinion on the kid.
In reality, ball awareness is an issue, but it's probably only a minor one. He'll be more experienced entering the season this year and the game should slow down for him a bit. I bet the awareness takes care of itself easily as he matures a bit.
As mentioned, hand technique and pad level are areas he needs to polish and I'd rank that well ahead of this inflated perception that he's "lost" out there.
Those of you saying he's not strong... I have no idea what you've watched. The kid looks as strong on bull rushes as nearly any 3 tech in the game. He's just raw and he has a full offseason to improve that. Strength is the least of his issues IMO.
As I mentioned in the other Bryan thread a few weeks ago, I expect he'll rack up some pressures at about a 7% clip and an 11:1 sack ratio on those pressures.
So, if he gets around 700 snaps at 3 tech, we'd see in the neighborhood of 50 pressures and 4.5 sacks.
Hopefully he exceeds those numbers, but that would be a solid contribution.
And the few times he did look like he got lost on the play, it usually came from him getting into the back field so fast, he simply ran himself right out/past the play.
I can't wait to see Ngakoue, Bryan, Campbell and Allen coming after QBs on 3rd down. There's a lot of explosion coming from those 4 in that lineup.
And I agree exactly about the strength comments. The one thing Bryan isn't lacking is strength and he showed that early. He's really strong, but he just lacks the hand placement/techniques to take full advantage of it.
(04-30-2019, 11:57 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]This. He didn't play outside very much for the Gators. He was worked mostly inside. And he honestly didn't play a whole lot for them to begin with. The Jaguars thought they were set to be a play-off team for the next few years after the 2017 campaign ended. They considered Bryan a project player to work in behind Campbell just based on his frame and showing at the combine.
But he did seem out of place too much off the edge as a rookie. That's just from being extremely raw and we all know that. But the idea that he's not strong enough (and I am not aiming this at you) is hilarious. The kid threw 225 pounds up 30 times on the bench. And still cleared a 4.98 at the combine in the 40 at his size. Those are good numbers to have... for an inside defender who played inside at Florida. Not outside. At least not yet.
I think he'll find his home this year playing inside for us. He did use the bull rush move quite a bit off the edge as a rookie. And he was flat out moving guys with two hands in front of him at times. Maybe he was caught out of position and appeared "weak" and "slow" off the edge because he was thinking too much and trying to figure out how to approach his role. Moving him back inside is the best way to go.
Bryan said it himself in an interview that 3 Tech is the only position on the DL hes ever played, at any level.
It was obvious he was going to struggle when trying to learn/play a brand new position (5T DE) when hes literally never played it before in his life. Then you add onto the fact that he has to do it going against the best players in the world at said sport.
Exactly. I have learned over the years to just breath and relax. Not every draft pick will be a homerun. Sometimes you get a guy with raw talent that takes time to bloom. Sometimes that bloom takes two years.
But most draft picks are not overnight sensations to begin with. When they are. That's great. But the odds say otherwise. I think he'll "get it" in year two. It'll start to click.
Best thing that happened for him last year was not ending up on IR and playing on the edge a bit to get adjusted to NFL speed. Now he's going back inside where he's comfortable and he's had that experience from working the outside last year to carry into his technique.
We could look back by the end of the year and quietly all crack a smile and get a good laugh when this kid ends up being the team leader in sacks and TFL's. Not talking small numbers here either. I mean towards double digits or more.
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If Taven lives up to his draft billing, we could have the best D-Line in the NFL. Every draftnik, analyst, and scouting report said he was raw. Every poster and Jaguar fan knew the pick was a luxury pick. I think we can be patient with him as he learns the game with a full offseason behind him.
"Tavern Bryan’s Sophomore Year"
Well, if this guy ever turns into a Blackmon-style alcoholic, we already have his nickname I guess.