Yeah, Dave and Tom definitely need to go. These three stooges along with the other “talent” they’ve brought in have doomed us. Smh.
Minshew is blowing up big time.
(10-02-2019, 06:37 PM)Jags Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah, Dave and Tom definitely need to go. These three stooges along with the other “talent” they’ve brought in have doomed us. Smh.
I think the first year he was back, TC didn't exert as much influence on the draft as he might have had. He might have wanted to get the lay of the land. This year, he probably had the most influence. In his previous time here, he drafted some talented players, his downfall was his inability to manage the salary cap. My question is, if TC is taking more control over the personnel decisions, why is Caldwell still here?
(10-02-2019, 06:50 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-02-2019, 06:37 PM)Jags Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah, Dave and Tom definitely need to go. These three stooges along with the other “talent” they’ve brought in have doomed us. Smh.
I think the first year he was back, TC didn't exert as much influence on the draft as he might have had. He might have wanted to get the lay of the land. This year, he probably had the most influence. In his previous time here, he drafted some talented players, his downfall was his inability to manage the salary cap. My question is, if TC is taking more control over the personnel decisions, why is Caldwell still here?
There is no indication he's taking any differing degree of "control."
Dave does what he always did. TC signs off. I'm sure Dave has presented player decisions that were altered, but there is no way of knowing how many, or how a consensus was decided.
(10-02-2019, 07:06 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (10-02-2019, 06:50 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]I think the first year he was back, TC didn't exert as much influence on the draft as he might have had. He might have wanted to get the lay of the land. This year, he probably had the most influence. In his previous time here, he drafted some talented players, his downfall was his inability to manage the salary cap. My question is, if TC is taking more control over the personnel decisions, why is Caldwell still here?
There is no indication he's taking any differing degree of "control."
Dave does what he always did. TC signs off. I'm sure Dave has presented player decisions that were altered, but there is no way of knowing how many, or how a consensus was decided.
I think the indication of him taking more control is evident in the quality of the picks. You just have to look over the past 3 years and compare them with the previous years. There's no question he's having an influence on the selections being made.
(10-02-2019, 07:23 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-02-2019, 07:06 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]There is no indication he's taking any differing degree of "control."
Dave does what he always did. TC signs off. I'm sure Dave has presented player decisions that were altered, but there is no way of knowing how many, or how a consensus was decided.
I think the indication of him taking more control is evident in the quality of the picks. You just have to look over the past 3 years and compare them with the previous years. There's no question he's having an influence on the selections being made.
So, pure speculation.
(10-02-2019, 07:25 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (10-02-2019, 07:23 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]I think the indication of him taking more control is evident in the quality of the picks. You just have to look over the past 3 years and compare them with the previous years. There's no question he's having an influence on the selections being made.
So, pure speculation.
Maybe a little bit of speculation, but mostly extrapolation and some hard metrics based on where players were drafted and were they are now. Unless you subscribe to the thought that Caldwell suddenly got smart when TC came along. Possible I guess but that would be speculation.
I'm sure Tom has influence in the player acquisitions but I still think Dave has carried on his job as normal. The Taven "reach" has Dave written all over it. I say "reach" because that was the consensus at the time, not as an opinion of his current play.
(10-02-2019, 07:23 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-02-2019, 07:06 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]There is no indication he's taking any differing degree of "control."
Dave does what he always did. TC signs off. I'm sure Dave has presented player decisions that were altered, but there is no way of knowing how many, or how a consensus was decided.
I think the indication of him taking more control is evident in the quality of the picks. You just have to look over the past 3 years and compare them with the previous years. There's no question he's having an influence on the selections being made.
Agreed 100%
(10-02-2019, 07:23 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-02-2019, 07:06 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]There is no indication he's taking any differing degree of "control."
Dave does what he always did. TC signs off. I'm sure Dave has presented player decisions that were altered, but there is no way of knowing how many, or how a consensus was decided.
I think the indication of him taking more control is evident in the quality of the picks. You just have to look over the past 3 years and compare them with the previous years. There's no question he's having an influence on the selections being made.
The quality of what picks? 2017 and 2018 were okay but pale in comparison to 2016. It's not as if there was some huge jump in quality starting in 2017.
Even 2014 saw the first 6 picks earn a 2nd contract.
(10-03-2019, 09:21 PM)Senor Fantastico Wrote: [ -> ] (10-02-2019, 07:23 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ]I think the indication of him taking more control is evident in the quality of the picks. You just have to look over the past 3 years and compare them with the previous years. There's no question he's having an influence on the selections being made.
The quality of what picks? 2017 and 2018 were okay but pale in comparison to 2016. It's not as if there was some huge jump in quality starting in 2017.
Even 2014 saw the first 6 picks earn a 2nd contract.
Just because they got a 2nd contract doesn't mean it was a good pick. Bortles and Lee were Dave's 1st 2 picks in that loaded draft.
(10-03-2019, 09:53 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ] (10-03-2019, 09:21 PM)Senor Fantastico Wrote: [ -> ]The quality of what picks? 2017 and 2018 were okay but pale in comparison to 2016. It's not as if there was some huge jump in quality starting in 2017.
Even 2014 saw the first 6 picks earn a 2nd contract.
Just because they got a 2nd contract doesn't mean it was a good pick. Bortles and Lee were Dave's 1st 2 picks in that loaded draft.
Yes, definitely the most important part of my post.
You can add Taylor and Oliver.to next months list
There is a tooooon of confirmation bias in this thread. "I like TC more than Dave, so obviously TC has more influence on these good drafts." Can we talk about how Fournette certainly seems more of TC's style than Dave's? Are we going to ignore Ramsey/Jack/Ngakoue before TC arrived? Taven (who's now beginning to look better) was definitely a Dave pick because we didn't like it?
Come on, guys. Dave is a quality GM.
(10-04-2019, 09:49 AM)JaguarKick Wrote: [ -> ]There is a tooooon of confirmation bias in this thread. "I like TC more than Dave, so obviously TC has more influence on these good drafts." Can we talk about how Fournette certainly seems more of TC's style than Dave's? Are we going to ignore Ramsey/Jack/Ngakoue before TC arrived? Taven (who's now beginning to look better) was definitely a Dave pick because we didn't like it?
Come on, guys. Dave is a quality GM.
I agree about the confirmation bias. I would also add, the confirmation bias is so obvious and extreme, it shows a lack of self-awareness.
(10-04-2019, 02:08 AM)Jagson Wrote: [ -> ]You can add Taylor and Oliver.to next months list
Taylor should be in it over Williams
(10-02-2019, 07:23 PM)hb1148 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-02-2019, 07:06 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]There is no indication he's taking any differing degree of "control."
Dave does what he always did. TC signs off. I'm sure Dave has presented player decisions that were altered, but there is no way of knowing how many, or how a consensus was decided.
I think the indication of him taking more control is evident in the quality of the picks. You just have to look over the past 3 years and compare them with the previous years. There's no question he's having an influence on the selections being made.
You think Tom Coughlin was good at drafting talent?
He was mediocre at best.
I definitely feel like the Dave and Tom combo is better than either of them by themselves
(10-04-2019, 09:49 AM)JaguarKick Wrote: [ -> ]There is a tooooon of confirmation bias in this thread. "I like TC more than Dave, so obviously TC has more influence on these good drafts." Can we talk about how Fournette certainly seems more of TC's style than Dave's? Are we going to ignore Ramsey/Jack/Ngakoue before TC arrived? Taven (who's now beginning to look better) was definitely a Dave pick because we didn't like it?
Come on, guys. Dave is a quality GM.
Ramsey, Jack, and Ngakoue were good picks although Ramsey and Jack where no-brainers frankly. I'm glad Jack fell to us thanks to the rumors about his knee. It doesn't mean that Caldwell has done a great job overall. Look prior to the 2016 draft. Need I really invoke the name of Luke Joeckel?
I would say he did "ok" with Linder (not a great center but certainly serviceable), Marquis Lee (pretty good receiver but suffers from white rhino syndrome) and Telvin Smith (although Smith might be retired now). Beyond that, the pickings are pretty slim.
Since TC came on board DC has turned it around. Fournette, Richardson, Taylor are the kind of lunch pail kind of players TC was always fond of. The three drafts since he's been here has great picks at higher positions and great value at lower positions. Minshew no matter how you look at it was the kind of value pick that DC never came close too by himself.