(01-31-2020, 11:06 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (01-30-2020, 12:33 PM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ]I can only assume that people who think Allen was better than Bosa didn't actually watch the Niners play (I know it's actually more likely huge bias + google). Allen was very good, Bosa was easily better. Unfortunately because so much of what lineman do doesn't show up in a box score so it's easy to trick yourself into thinking otherwise.
And Allen played 60.4% of our defensive snaps, Bosa was 75.8%.
Were it not for the fact that he played in Jacksonville on a team that won six games, Allen likely would have won the award. San Francisco's Nick Bosa is the likely winner and Allen outperformed him despite playing significantly fewer snaps. Allen had a team-high 10.5 sacks, 44 tackles and two forced fumbles while playing only 42% of the Jaguars' defensive snaps (423). Bosa had nine sacks, 47 tackles, one forced fumble and one interception while playing 76% of the 49ers' defensive snaps (735). Bosa started 14 games. Allen started four. But because the 49ers won 13 games and earned the NFC's top seed, Bosa gets more attention. -- Michael DiRocco
It's not just the success of the 49ers or their larger market. It's also that Bosa already has a brother playing in the League. He's also a guy who happens to look like the majority of the fans playing a position where most players have more melanin.
But melanin (or lack thereof) doesn't get sacks. Allen
was better.
You have to give a giant boost to a QB for positional value for the award to not come down to AJ Brown, Jacobs, Sanders, or one of the other very good WR like McLaurin or Deebo.
There shouldn't have been a QB in the top 5.
(02-01-2020, 09:00 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (01-31-2020, 11:06 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Were it not for the fact that he played in Jacksonville on a team that won six games, Allen likely would have won the award. San Francisco's Nick Bosa is the likely winner and Allen outperformed him despite playing significantly fewer snaps. Allen had a team-high 10.5 sacks, 44 tackles and two forced fumbles while playing only 42% of the Jaguars' defensive snaps (423). Bosa had nine sacks, 47 tackles, one forced fumble and one interception while playing 76% of the 49ers' defensive snaps (735). Bosa started 14 games. Allen started four. But because the 49ers won 13 games and earned the NFC's top seed, Bosa gets more attention. -- Michael DiRocco
It's not just the success of the 49ers or their larger market. It's also that Bosa already has a brother playing in the League. He's also a guy who happens to look like the majority of the fans playing a position where most players have more melanin.
But melanin (or lack thereof) doesn't get sacks. Allen
was better.
Get out of here with that nonsense.
(02-01-2020, 07:35 PM)mal234 Wrote: [ -> ]Just like I predicted Kyler Murray won the AP offensive Rookie of the Year Award. IMO, he did not deserve it. There were other rookies that were more deserving including Josh Jacobs who was one of the finalists. But just like with Nick, the NFL wants to push Kyler for whatever reasons.
mikesez would say it's because of the amount of melanin he has that made that happen....
We all know why Kyler Murray won it. The NFL is pushing the African American QB pretty hard.. and that’s a good thing. Plenty of phenomenal African American QBs in this game, something we didn’t always see in the past for many unfair reasons. Dak, Lamar Jackson, Teddy, Russell Wilson, the list goes on. Kyler Murray however, did not deserve this award. A guy who started all 16 games and still didn’t put up better numbers than Minshew is laughable at best to win ROTY. It was no doubt a political move.
(02-02-2020, 02:32 PM)Talented Kalamari Wrote: [ -> ]We all know why Kyler Murray won it. The NFL is pushing the African American QB pretty hard.. and that’s a good thing. Plenty of phenomenal African American QBs in this game, something we didn’t always see in the past for many unfair reasons. Dak, Lamar Jackson, Teddy, Russell Wilson, the list goes on. Kyler Murray however, did not deserve this award. A guy who started all 16 games and still didn’t put up better numbers than Minshew is laughable at best to win ROTY. It was no doubt a political move.
Not to mention Kyler Murray's head coach has been in love with him for years and designed an entire offense FOR him.
Minshew was thrown in.
(02-02-2020, 12:17 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ] (02-01-2020, 07:35 PM)mal234 Wrote: [ -> ]Just like I predicted Kyler Murray won the AP offensive Rookie of the Year Award. IMO, he did not deserve it. There were other rookies that were more deserving including Josh Jacobs who was one of the finalists. But just like with Nick, the NFL wants to push Kyler for whatever reasons.
mikesez would say it's because of the amount of melanin he has that made that happen....
Nah. The way I see it, the ROTY awards are usually biased to the #1 overall pick. Maybe there's a melanin issue, but between the two, Bosa is more likely getting extra attention for his race than Kyler is. Which percentage is higher? Black QBs or white DEs?
(02-02-2020, 09:11 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (02-02-2020, 12:17 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]mikesez would say it's because of the amount of melanin he has that made that happen....
Nah. The way I see it, the ROTY awards are usually biased to the #1 overall pick. Maybe there's a melanin issue, but between the two, Bosa is more likely getting extra attention for his race than Kyler is. Which percentage is higher? Black QBs or white DEs?
Historically?
By a very far and wide margin white DEs.
(02-02-2020, 09:47 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ] (02-02-2020, 09:11 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Nah. The way I see it, the ROTY awards are usually biased to the #1 overall pick. Maybe there's a melanin issue, but between the two, Bosa is more likely getting extra attention for his race than Kyler is. Which percentage is higher? Black QBs or white DEs?
Historically?
By a very far and wide margin white DEs.
I never watched football before the Jaguars. Maybe you're right, but in the last 20 years, it has been more common to see a front four that is all dark skinned than it is to see a front four that is all light skinned, that's for sure.
This thread took a weird turn
Stay in the political section Mike.
Bosa with an absurd 12 pressures on 38 pass rushes last night. Constant havoc like that is what separated him from Allen who had 30 fewer total pressures on the season. And the dominant run defense.
Yeah I can’t say Bosa was not deserving. I do think that Allen has similar talent though, which is really big for this defense moving forward.
I really don't have a problem with Bosa winning the award. I simply can not believe Minshew did not receive a single ROY vote. And the guy who won--Murray--Minshew outshined him in almost every category. It's a crock.
(02-03-2020, 10:55 AM)JagFanFirst Wrote: [ -> ]I really don't have a problem with Bosa winning the award. I simply can not believe Minshew did not receive a single ROY vote. And the guy who won--Murray--Minshew outshined him in almost every category. It's a crock.
Agreed. This is harder to explain. At the end of the day, these awards really don’t matter going forward. All thar matters is that we keep improving big-time next year. No rookie year award will change that
(02-03-2020, 09:31 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Stay in the political section Mike.
OK cry baby.
All of this should lead to fuel to the Minshew fire. Go 2nd year QB growth.
(02-03-2020, 03:30 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (02-03-2020, 09:31 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Stay in the political section Mike.
OK cry baby.
Cry baby?
You're bringing up race in a conversation about Minshew and the rookie of the year. Keep it outta here because it has absolutely nothing to do with how someone won the award.
Bosa didn't win because he's white. It's because he was the best defensive rookie as evidence by his play last night.
Murray didn't win because the NFL has an agenda to advance the black QB. Murray was pretty great this year and so was Minshew. People just decided not to vote for Gardner so whatever.
(02-03-2020, 04:34 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (02-03-2020, 03:30 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]OK cry baby.
Cry baby?
You're bringing up race in a conversation about Minshew and the rookie of the year. Keep it outta here because it has absolutely nothing to do with how someone won the award.
Bosa didn't win because he's white. It's because he was the best defensive rookie as evidence by his play last night.
Murray didn't win because the NFL has an agenda to advance the black QB. Murray was pretty great this year and so was Minshew. People just decided not to vote for Gardner so whatever.
You’re clearly in denial. Alright. Would love to live in the same fantasy land that you live in. Sounds great.
(02-03-2020, 05:29 PM)Talented Kalamari Wrote: [ -> ] (02-03-2020, 04:34 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Cry baby?
You're bringing up race in a conversation about Minshew and the rookie of the year. Keep it outta here because it has absolutely nothing to do with how someone won the award.
Bosa didn't win because he's white. It's because he was the best defensive rookie as evidence by his play last night.
Murray didn't win because the NFL has an agenda to advance the black QB. Murray was pretty great this year and so was Minshew. People just decided not to vote for Gardner so whatever.
You’re clearly in denial. Alright. Would love to live in the same fantasy land that you live in. Sounds great.
You mean reality? It’s nice.
Murray was the #1 pick and it gave him a leg up on everyone for the ROY. Bosa is fantastic but he also happened to play on a 13-3 team. These were all likely factors for voters and skin color played zero part in any of it.
I’m also not sure you know what denial means considering it doesn’t apply here.