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Love our gov.

The governor made three proposals.
One, allow any citizen to shoot someone who commits a burglary within 500 ft of a disorderly assembly. Sounds dumb, too many arbitrary conditions that people won't understand, invites confrontation between untrained people. Hire trained, armed, security guards instead.
Two, make blocking traffic a felony, and offer immunity to people who injure protestors that were blocking traffic. This is dumb, it's already a crime. People who block traffic usually go to jail. It's infrequent already.
Third, remove state funding from cities who "defund" their police departments. Dumb again. One, no city in FL has done this. Two, are we saying that a government agency must always increase it's expenditure? That's the opposite of conservative. Conservatives are supposed to be the ones who want to cut spending. Three, these are local government decisions that Tallahassee doesn't need to worry about. A real conservative would care about preserving the distinct roles of state and local government, and not try to make the one the slave of the other.

These ideas aren't conservative. They are just trying to ride Trump's coattails, and Trump's not going to be around in a couple of months.

Best of luck to our governor, may he remember the values that got him that seat in Congress in the first place.

1. Tennessee v. Garner already dictates that you can’t kill someone for only a burglary or certain crimes. Theyd have to classify it as a forcible felony and that’d never hold up in court.

2. He’s saying he wants immunity for people that unintentionally hurt someone unlawfully in the road. I don’t see how anyone would have a problem with that.

3. I don’t think he’s suggesting you can only increase a budget. I think he’s suggesting that if you reduce the budget for political reasons, then you don’t need the funding since you now have newly created money.

I think the point is to create laws to deter the radicals from coming to Florida.

(11-11-2020, 12:16 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]The governor made three proposals.
One, allow any citizen to shoot someone who commits a burglary within 500 ft of a disorderly assembly. Sounds dumb, too many arbitrary conditions that people won't understand, invites confrontation between untrained people.  Hire trained, armed, security guards instead.
Two, make blocking traffic a felony, and offer immunity to people who injure protestors that were blocking traffic.  This is dumb, it's already a crime.  People who block traffic usually go to jail.  It's infrequent already.
Third, remove state funding from cities who "defund" their police departments.  Dumb again.  One, no city in FL has done this.  Two, are we saying that a government agency must always increase it's expenditure? That's the opposite of conservative.  Conservatives are supposed to be the ones who want to cut spending.  Three, these are local government decisions that Tallahassee doesn't need to worry about.  A real conservative would care about preserving the distinct roles of state and local government, and not try to make the one the slave of the other.

These ideas aren't conservative.  They are just trying to ride Trump's coattails, and Trump's not going to be around in a couple of months.

Best of luck to our governor, may he remember the values that got him that seat in Congress in the first place.

Whats the foundation of conservatism?  Property rights.  

Ur welcome

#ambientignorance

(11-11-2020, 01:17 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]I think the point is to create laws to deter the radicals from coming to Florida.

Bingo

(11-11-2020, 01:17 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]I think the point is to create laws to deter the radicals from coming to Florida.

It’s pretty well known that Floridians don’t tolerate that stuff or we would see more of it. We definitely have our eccentricities, but punk lawlessness doesn’t play well here.

Plus, it’s just too danged hot most of the time to protest.

(11-11-2020, 12:01 AM)StroudCrowd1 Wrote: [ -> ]https://www.foxnews.com/politics/florida...businesses

Love our gov.

C'mon man --  change your pic.  Put the crown on DeSantis !!!  There's a new king in town

I must admit that shooting looters may hurt our 2024 vote so I'm not sure where I stand on this yet -- ha !!

(11-11-2020, 02:57 AM)jj82284 Wrote: [ -> ]

(11-11-2020, 12:16 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]The governor made three proposals.
One, allow any citizen to shoot someone who commits a burglary within 500 ft of a disorderly assembly. Sounds dumb, too many arbitrary conditions that people won't understand, invites confrontation between untrained people.  Hire trained, armed, security guards instead.
Two, make blocking traffic a felony, and offer immunity to people who injure protestors that were blocking traffic.  This is dumb, it's already a crime.  People who block traffic usually go to jail.  It's infrequent already.
Third, remove state funding from cities who "defund" their police departments.  Dumb again.  One, no city in FL has done this.  Two, are we saying that a government agency must always increase it's expenditure? That's the opposite of conservative.  Conservatives are supposed to be the ones who want to cut spending.  Three, these are local government decisions that Tallahassee doesn't need to worry about.  A real conservative would care about preserving the distinct roles of state and local government, and not try to make the one the slave of the other.

These ideas aren't conservative.  They are just trying to ride Trump's coattails, and Trump's not going to be around in a couple of months.

Best of luck to our governor, may he remember the values that got him that seat in Congress in the first place.

Whats the foundation of conservatism?  Property rights.  

Ur welcome

#ambientignorance

Property rights are one of many things that conservatives should defend at this moment. Life and liberty are the two others that Locke mentioned.  We should never sacrifice lives at the altar of property.

And you would do well to remember that Locke was a radical in his time.  He wasn't conservative.  He was beyond liberal.

The bedrock of conservatism is to be skeptical of people who want to "fix" society by changing laws.  The bedrock of conservatism is that any change to law or to appropriation or to tax will have unintended adverse consequences.  

Be skeptical of people who want to change the law. Be skeptical to changing the structure of authority. It's rarely more complicated than that.  

As a conservative, I am skeptical of what DeSantis is trying to do here.

But you're not skeptical of what the progressives are trying to do? Why invoke Locke if he's irrelevant?

Also, none of those laws place life over property. Let's not remove agency from this equation.

(11-11-2020, 12:48 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]But you're not skeptical of what the progressives are trying to do? Why invoke Locke if he's irrelevant?

Also, none of those laws place life over property. Let's not remove agency from this equation.

I mention Locke because he (along with Hobbes) laid the foundation that the Declaration of Independence and constitution would be written on, 100 years later, and yes protection of property was at the center of that system of thought.

And I am skeptical of everything progressives do.  As a conservative I assign a high burden of proof to progressives.  But occasionally some of their ideas meet that burden of proof.  Specifically some of their ideas on health care and climate change turn out to be sound, even if you are skeptical at first. 

A public insurance scheme that leaves room for private insurance schemes that go above and beyond is a sound idea. A plan that expects doctors to simply be employees of the state is not sound and invites extra fraud. But a mixed system is tried and true in many countries.  

A climate change plan that uses financial incentives to reduce but not eliminate the use of fossil fuel is sound, especially if nuclear energy is included. But a green new deal that seeks to eliminate fossil fuels altogether is decades and perhaps even a century ahead of what's technically feasible.  And a green new deal that includes a "jobs guarantee" or a "jobs bank" will devolve into a state-run economy in short order.

(11-11-2020, 11:58 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]

(11-11-2020, 02:57 AM)jj82284 Wrote: [ -> ]Whats the foundation of conservatism?  Property rights.  

Ur welcome

#ambientignorance

We should never sacrifice lives at the altar of property.

You are freely entitled to your opinion, though it is not one I share. I will gladly sacrifice your life for my property, as my property represents slivers of my life spent acquiring it. You however can completely avoid that situation by refraining from any attempt to take my property.

(11-11-2020, 01:53 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]

(11-11-2020, 11:58 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]We should never sacrifice lives at the altar of property.

You are freely entitled to your opinion, though it is not one I share. I will gladly sacrifice your life for my property, as my property represents slivers of my life spent acquiring it. You however can completely avoid that situation by refraining from any attempt to take my property.

Don't worry, I don't want to take your property.
I think you're missing the point.  You're considering Locke from a modern perspective.  Locke's ideal government is born out of a hypothetical state of nature where no one is sure who owns what.  As the government gains legitimacy, the line between "yours" and "ours" becomes more distinct. But it doesn't do these things for its own sake.  It does these things to prevent conflicts and loss of life between people who believe they each own the same thing.

You are butchering Locke.

(11-11-2020, 11:58 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]

(11-11-2020, 02:57 AM)jj82284 Wrote: [ -> ]Whats the foundation of conservatism?  Property rights.  

Ur welcome

#ambientignorance

Property rights are one of many things that conservatives should defend at this moment. Life and liberty are the two others that Locke mentioned.  We should never sacrifice lives at the altar of property.

And you would do well to remember that Locke was a radical in his time.  He wasn't conservative.  He was beyond liberal.

The bedrock of conservatism is to be skeptical of people who want to "fix" society by changing laws.  The bedrock of conservatism is that any change to law or to appropriation or to tax will have unintended adverse consequences.  

Be skeptical of people who want to change the law. Be skeptical to changing the structure of authority. It's rarely more complicated than that.  

As a conservative, I am skeptical of what DeSantis is trying to do here.

You are not a conservative you are a troll that goes out of the your way to defend the absurd.

(11-11-2020, 07:45 PM)copycat Wrote: [ -> ]

(11-11-2020, 11:58 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Property rights are one of many things that conservatives should defend at this moment. Life and liberty are the two others that Locke mentioned.  We should never sacrifice lives at the altar of property.

And you would do well to remember that Locke was a radical in his time.  He wasn't conservative.  He was beyond liberal.

The bedrock of conservatism is to be skeptical of people who want to "fix" society by changing laws.  The bedrock of conservatism is that any change to law or to appropriation or to tax will have unintended adverse consequences.  

Be skeptical of people who want to change the law. Be skeptical to changing the structure of authority. It's rarely more complicated than that.  

As a conservative, I am skeptical of what DeSantis is trying to do here.

You are not a conservative you are a troll that goes out of the your way to defend the absurd.

The only absurd thing here is DeSantis' proposals.
Florida doesn't have a problem with violent protests.
I'm defending the status quo: no violent protests.
DeSantis is creating a problem where none exists.

DeSantis is a clown and another Trump lackey.