(01-03-2022, 08:08 PM)jaguarmvp Wrote: [ -> ]Honestly I can't name one. Even looking at the "better players" on the team. It's insane with the amount of draft capital we have we have almost nothing to show for it
Potential core guys but have question marks.
Lawrence: Great in post game interviews but questionable on the field. Jury is still out but causes for concern.
Josh Allen : Good player but far from elite. It must be a month or so since he had a sack. Iffy
Linder : He is older and misses too much time every year.
Jack : He was bad last year and Horrendous this year. Time to move on.
To be honest the cupboard is starvation bare
This is obviously one of the main reasons why we suck. I just hope the next regime doesn't gut the roster like Caldwell did. That just made things even worse. We need to keep every player we have until someone actually beats them out.
I would say
Lawrence
J Robinson
Linder
Allen
Jack
ETN
Arnold
Hamilton
Wright
Cooke
Agnew
(01-03-2022, 08:14 PM)RicoTx Wrote: [ -> ]God, just shut up about Lawrence already.
If you're too stupid to see he's a 'core player' you're a moron.
FTFY
(01-03-2022, 10:24 PM)rfc17 Wrote: [ -> ]Trevor Lawrence is the only one. Anyone else is replaceable. Obviously you'll keep the rookies like Little, Campbell, Cisco, Etienne and see how they develop next year. James Robinson hopefully comes back healthy. Josh Allen is still on his rookie deal so he'll be here. Next year is a contract year for him so interesting to see how he plays. But none of them are special. Lawrence is the only one you build around and with better coaching / development you hope he becomes the player we all (well most of us) want him to be.
This might be the realest statement posted. I'd say Allen has shown enough that you keep building around him. This year's first rounder will also be part of the core.
Like it or not, everyone else is the supporting cast. The youth that we've spent picks on will be given opportunity to cement their spots within the foundation of what's being built, but by no means can we say that guys like Little, Campbell, Cisco, Etienne are irreplaceable.
(01-03-2022, 11:02 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]Crust, Mantle, Core & Intercourse. I mean. Inner core.
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Last year around this time was when we got screwed. Let's not repeat that fiasco!
(01-04-2022, 08:34 AM)JagFanatic24 Wrote: [ -> ]I would say
Lawrence
J Robinson
Linder
Allen
Jack
ETN
Arnold
Hamilton
Wright
Cooke
Agnew
.gif "Laughing")
(01-04-2022, 08:34 AM)JagFanatic24 Wrote: [ -> ]I would say
Lawrence
J Robinson
Linder
Allen
Jack
ETN
Arnold
Hamilton
Wright
Cooke
Agnew
Good list. The only players I'd not include are:
Linder: Too many injuries.
Wright: He's o.k., but short kickoffs hurt the team.
The players I'd add are:
Campbell
Griffin
Bartch (depending on evaluation of his progress this season)
(01-04-2022, 10:28 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ] (01-03-2022, 10:24 PM)rfc17 Wrote: [ -> ]Trevor Lawrence is the only one. Anyone else is replaceable. Obviously you'll keep the rookies like Little, Campbell, Cisco, Etienne and see how they develop next year. James Robinson hopefully comes back healthy. Josh Allen is still on his rookie deal so he'll be here. Next year is a contract year for him so interesting to see how he plays. But none of them are special. Lawrence is the only one you build around and with better coaching / development you hope he becomes the player we all (well most of us) want him to be.
This might be the realest statement posted. I'd say Allen has shown enough that you keep building around him. This year's first rounder will also be part of the core.
Like it or not, everyone else is the supporting cast. The youth that we've spent picks on will be given opportunity to cement their spots within the foundation of what's being built, but by no means can we say that guys like Little, Campbell, Cisco, Etienne are irreplaceable.
(01-03-2022, 11:02 PM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]Crust, Mantle, Core & Intercourse. I mean. Inner core.
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Last year around this time was when we got screwed. Let's not repeat that fiasco!
Well, the least they could do is offer to take us out to dinner first.
Or, I would settle for a free buba burger meal at the stadium.
We have several players who would fall or will hopefully develop into the second and third tier level starters on a contending caliber team. There are several contenders you could put Linder, Norwell, Hamilton, and Griffin on and they'd find a way on the field in most cases but they wouldn't be difference makers.
I am not sure we have any players you would consider a real core player on a contending team. Allen and Lawrence are probably the two with that kind of potential, maybe Little/Campbell/Cisco if they reach their 90th percentile outcomes.
We essentially need to add half a dozen guys who would be the best player on this team, and then another half a dozen players that would be in the same tier as the best players on our team right now. If we add ~12 players like that over the next couple of years we can probably start to think about competing for real, but one of those has to be Trevor of course.
Core players on offense:
Lawrence - QB
Etienne - RB
Robinson - RB
Arnold - TE
Agnew - WR/ST
Little - LT
Core players on defense:
Allen - DE
Smoot - DE
Campbell - CB
CIsco - SS
That's about it really. Again, whomever comes into the office next at GM and HC needs to be spending heavily in free agency to add depth, promise and stop gaps and they need to draft guys that are ready to come in instantly and start making an impact or at least be maybe a half season or year away from replacing a stop gap player that's signed in March.
Lawrence
Bartch
Little
Cisco
Campbell
Jenkins
Griffin
(01-04-2022, 03:57 PM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ]Lawrence
Bartch
Little
Cisco
Campbell
Jenkins
Griffin
Bartch?
Obviously not.
There are a few players we can't get rid of either because they are rookies that showed promise or are good enough to have to stay so we don't create even more holes:
Lawrence
J Robinson(he needs to get a chance to come back from injury)
Etienne
Jones
Treadwell
Agnew
Little
Norwell(please draft his long term replacement)
Linder(please draft his long term replacement)
Allen
Griffin
Campbell
Cisco
Then there's a few players we should get rid of:
Chaisson
Jack(unless we go back to a 4-3)
Taylor
Consider tagging:
Chark
Anyone not named I'm not bothered either way. Give them a chance to compete for a roster spot next year or cut them loose. It probably won't matter.
(01-04-2022, 05:19 PM)CanDoBetter Wrote: [ -> ]Obviously not.
There are a few players we can't get rid of either because they are rookies that showed promise or are good enough to have to stay so we don't create even more holes:
Lawrence
J Robinson(he needs to get a chance to come back from injury)
Etienne
Jones
Treadwell
Agnew
Little
Norwell(please draft his long term replacement)
Linder(please draft his long term replacement)
Allen
Griffin
Campbell
Cisco
I'm good with this list . . . I think we need to also keep Cam because we need to replace so much on the O line already. Or make sure we pick up some quality, experienced linemen in free agency.
(01-04-2022, 04:01 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ] (01-04-2022, 03:57 PM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ]Lawrence
Bartch
Little
Cisco
Campbell
Jenkins
Griffin
Bartch?
I'd not call him core by any stretch, but he's a good back-up OL on a very cheap rookie deal w/ 2 years left.
Good to have when you have so many holes to fill. Odds of getting through a season w/o needing a guy like that to step in are slim.
I suppose he could surprise me and win a starting guard spot, but I figure him in more as a back-up.
(01-04-2022, 07:30 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (01-04-2022, 04:01 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Bartch?
I'd not call him core by any stretch, but he's a good back-up OL on a very cheap rookie deal w/ 2 years left.
Good to have when you have so many holes to fill. Odds of getting through a season w/o needing a guy like that to step in are slim.
I suppose he could surprise me and win a starting guard spot, but I figure him in more as a back-up.
I seen him getting beat quite a bit before he got hurt. Id let him compete in training camp and see how he does but he is no core player on this team. Would love it if we could sign Scherff.
(01-04-2022, 05:19 PM)CanDoBetter Wrote: [ -> ]Obviously not.
There are a few players we can't get rid of either because they are rookies that showed promise or are good enough to have to stay so we don't create even more holes:
Lawrence
J Robinson(he needs to get a chance to come back from injury)
Etienne
Jones
Treadwell
Agnew
Little
Norwell(please draft his long term replacement)
Linder(please draft his long term replacement)
Allen
Griffin
Campbell
Cisco
Then there's a few players we should get rid of:
Chaisson
Jack(unless we go back to a 4-3)
Taylor
Consider tagging:
Chark
Anyone not named I'm not bothered either way. Give them a chance to compete for a roster spot next year or cut them loose. It probably won't matter.
I think there's a significant difference between "core" and "solid player", though. I can't consider JRob part of the core until we know for sure he's going to recover. I don't consider a street FA who's barely contributed (Treadwell) to be a block around which we build the team. You're not going to purge the entire roster in any season, as the replacement cost of many guys is too much for a complete cleanse. Those solid players continue to contribute, but assuming we find a top WR prospect in the darft (or FA), someone like Treadwell is likely back on the street.
May be a difference of opinion, but to me "core" is the guys that shape the team identity, that you would be scrambling if they were lost or traded, or that you've invested heavily to put them in position to become a part of the core. When I think of cores, I always think of the three-headed monster that were the 90's Cowboys - Aikman, Smith, Irvin. They had a bunch of other talent around them, but all the other pieces, excepting very few were able to shuffle in and out of the rosters from year to year and they maintained that group, and continued to win no matter who was playing at the other spots.
I see your points but IMO "core" means those players that definitely will be around next season. fA and draft should be used to build around it.
This is also why I think someone like Treadwell will stick. He's no star but the wr room is so bad you can't get rid of someone who appears to have some chemistry with Trevor. I don't expect any high profile FA signings anyway.
(01-05-2022, 10:25 AM)CanDoBetter Wrote: [ -> ]I see your points but IMO "core" means those players that definitely will be around next season. fA and draft should be used to build around it.
That is way too low of a bar for what core means to me. I think it pretty much means guys who you would be willing to franchise tag if they were a FA and you were struggling to come to terms on a contract. Even that can be too low of a bar though, since we tagged Cam and he certainly isn't truly that caliber. But it's the best I've got.
(01-05-2022, 10:34 AM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ] (01-05-2022, 10:25 AM)CanDoBetter Wrote: [ -> ]I see your points but IMO "core" means those players that definitely will be around next season. fA and draft should be used to build around it.
That is way too low of a bar for what core means to me. I think it pretty much means guys who you would be willing to franchise tag if they were a FA and you were struggling to come to terms on a contract. Even that can be too low of a bar though, since we tagged Cam and he certainly isn't truly that caliber. But it's the best I've got.
Then that's only Lawrence if he becomes the player we hope. Possibly Allen too.
(01-05-2022, 10:35 AM)CanDoBetter Wrote: [ -> ] (01-05-2022, 10:34 AM)Upper Wrote: [ -> ]That is way too low of a bar for what core means to me. I think it pretty much means guys who you would be willing to franchise tag if they were a FA and you were struggling to come to terms on a contract. Even that can be too low of a bar though, since we tagged Cam and he certainly isn't truly that caliber. But it's the best I've got.
Then that's only Lawrence if he becomes the player we hope. Possibly Allen too.
Exactly. We're back at square 1.