(01-15-2022, 09:57 PM)jaguarmvp Wrote: [ -> ] (01-15-2022, 05:13 PM)Jag149 Wrote: [ -> ]If you want a bust of Chaisson I am sure he can get one for you and stamp it official. Is he a bad player ? After the draft the selection round makes no difference to me. He is a player under a reasonable contract for the next 2 years. As mentioned before we have 2 years to decide what to do here. Singling out this player to discuss and label a bust, much less official bust is an exercise in futility. The player will be here next year and until someone is better he will be on the roster. That is unless you want to just off load him at a discount. I am sure you may be able to talk yourself into it. There was interest in him right before the trade deadline so sure you can get a cup of coffee for him then watch him flourish elsewhere. Then the same poster can begin another negative thread (has he ever began a different type?) touting how much a Jag move it was to let him go. After all isn't that what griefers do?
Who are you and get off my jock! This is the second thread in a row your comment was more about attacking me while derailing the thread.
You knew what the thread was about but you clicked on it to cry about how negative it is. I got a good idea for you. Don't click on my threads so I don't have to read about your belly aching.
There isn't a whole lot of positives to post about the team right now. Again if you want sunshine and rainbows click on other threads instead of derailing mine.
Adults are trying to talk football and not attack other users.
It's a shame this child cannot recognize the irony in his own statement.
On Chaisson, he's pretty much a sunk cost at this point. Hopefully the light comes on for him, but it's not looking too promising. He's at least on the roster through the next training camp.
Chaisson is where Bryan was the last year or so. Maybe a bit better but not so much it changes much. If you ignore his draft position he has a place as a rotation player. It is kind of hard to ignore the draft though.
(01-16-2022, 01:53 PM)CanDoBetter Wrote: [ -> ]Chaisson is where Bryan was the last year or so. Maybe a bit better but not so much it changes much. If you ignore his draft position he has a place as a rotation player. It is kind of hard to ignore the draft though.
This is spot on. Especially while he’s on a rookie contract. Bryan’s contract is up so he’s gone and Chassion will just be a rotational player.
(01-16-2022, 12:14 PM)scottyg Wrote: [ -> ] (01-15-2022, 09:57 PM)jaguarmvp Wrote: [ -> ]Who are you and get off my jock! This is the second thread in a row your comment was more about attacking me while derailing the thread.
You knew what the thread was about but you clicked on it to cry about how negative it is. I got a good idea for you. Don't click on my threads so I don't have to read about your belly aching.
There isn't a whole lot of positives to post about the team right now. Again if you want sunshine and rainbows click on other threads instead of derailing mine.
Adults are trying to talk football and not attack other users.
It's a shame this child cannot recognize the irony in his own statement.
On Chaisson, he's pretty much a sunk cost at this point. Hopefully the light comes on for him, but it's not looking too promising. He's at least on the roster through the next training camp.
Yeah, when adults are "talking football" - determining the worth of a player under rookie contract is usually focused on what he might or might not offer the team's roster.
What value does he have, whether starting, backing up, or rotating?
What are the odds his upside may still be realized?
Unfortunately, lots of folks these days are much more anxious to polarize everything as trash or priceless treasure and don't seek out the expansive universe of other possibilities.
Chaisson's future in Jax ultimately comes down to who is finally determined as GM, HC, and DC.
But they'd be screwing up royally by moving on from him prior to giving him the chance of another camp.
(Much like Meyer did last year with the 3rd rnd TE, Oliver)
My gut tells me Chaisson ends up somewhere featuring a DC that is very keen on incorporating hybrid roles in his scheme.
If we end up with Cullen, he's more keen to hybrids in the secondary than the front seven, so I'm inclined to think Chaisson could be trade bait come August if he doesn't emerge in camp.
I think the odds are stacked against him, but it is still to soon to label him definitively
(01-16-2022, 02:51 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (01-16-2022, 12:14 PM)scottyg Wrote: [ -> ]It's a shame this child cannot recognize the irony in his own statement.
On Chaisson, he's pretty much a sunk cost at this point. Hopefully the light comes on for him, but it's not looking too promising. He's at least on the roster through the next training camp.
Yeah, when adults are "talking football" - determining the worth of a player under rookie contract is usually focused on what he might or might not offer the team's roster.
What value does he have, whether starting, backing up, or rotating?
What are the odds his upside may still be realized?
Unfortunately, lots of folks these days are much more anxious to polarize everything as trash or priceless treasure and don't seek out the expansive universe of other possibilities.
Chaisson's future in Jax ultimately comes down to who is finally determined as GM, HC, and DC.
But they'd be screwing up royally by moving on from him prior to giving him the chance of another camp.
(Much like Meyer did last year with the 3rd rnd TE, Oliver)
My gut tells me Chaisson ends up somewhere featuring a DC that is very keen on incorporating hybrid roles in his scheme.
If we end up with Cullen, he's more keen to hybrids in the secondary than the front seven, so I'm inclined to think Chaisson could be trade bait come August if he doesn't emerge in camp.
I think the odds are stacked against him, but it is still to soon to label him definitively
It's a shame he wasn't shopped around last off season, maybe someone would have given up more than he's worth but at this point if your a GM would you even give up a 6th for him? I wouldn't.
(01-14-2022, 10:16 PM)jaguarmvp Wrote: [ -> ]I am saying yes. I have seen next to nothing on the field that suggest he will become a decent player. Another 1st round bust for the Caldwell regime. I believe the pick was part of the Ramsey trade that makes it hurt even worse. I think it's time to throw in the towel because I have yet to see one flash. Do you think he can become a decent player?
Put plainly, he was chosen specifically to replace the lost production when Yan left. He hasn't come close to matching that production after multiple seasons in multiple schemes. You can't dismiss the poor play on fit, it's on his (in)ability.
I think he'll be pushed down the depth chart after this darft, and he will have to show signs of life offf the bench or he'll be deemed a bust. At this point, I can't say that I think he can become decent. I think he can serve as depth/relief, and that's likely his ceiling.
(01-14-2022, 11:00 PM)Jagulars Wrote: [ -> ]He was a very raw player coming into the league. On the line. Standing. He has struggled with both. I would bring in competition. Can Myles Jack try outside in the 34? He plays best outside.
Jack is a 4-3 WLB, There's no way I want Jack taking on OT every down trying to get a sack. He'd get manhandled.
(01-15-2022, 09:57 PM)jaguarmvp Wrote: [ -> ] (01-15-2022, 05:13 PM)Jag149 Wrote: [ -> ]If you want a bust of Chaisson I am sure he can get one for you and stamp it official. Is he a bad player ? After the draft the selection round makes no difference to me. He is a player under a reasonable contract for the next 2 years. As mentioned before we have 2 years to decide what to do here. Singling out this player to discuss and label a bust, much less official bust is an exercise in futility. The player will be here next year and until someone is better he will be on the roster. That is unless you want to just off load him at a discount. I am sure you may be able to talk yourself into it. There was interest in him right before the trade deadline so sure you can get a cup of coffee for him then watch him flourish elsewhere. Then the same poster can begin another negative thread (has he ever began a different type?) touting how much a Jag move it was to let him go. After all isn't that what griefers do?
Who are you and get off my jock! This is the second thread in a row your comment was more about attacking me while derailing the thread.
You knew what the thread was about but you clicked on it to cry about how negative it is. I got a good idea for you. Don't click on my threads so I don't have to read about your belly aching.
There isn't a whole lot of positives to post about the team right now. Again if you want sunshine and rainbows click on other threads instead of derailing mine.
Adults are trying to talk football and not attack other users.
How would you know, you put the adults on ignore.
(01-18-2022, 10:31 AM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]This should have been a huge red flag. He got dominated vs Andrew Thomas of UGA.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlgvZW95ny4
I think the biggest red flag should have been the fact that he only managed 9.5 career sacks at LSU in 24 games. Not to mention. In 2019, Burrow was absolutely destroying defenses early and often and that would have presented their defense more opportunities to pin their ears back and get after the QB.
Caldwell didn't learn his lessons with Dante Fowler Jr. He fell in love with the athlete on paper and at the combine and not the football player on film and on the stat sheet. He fell in love with what "could" be instead of what "will" be.
(01-18-2022, 10:39 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ] (01-18-2022, 10:31 AM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]This should have been a huge red flag. He got dominated vs Andrew Thomas of UGA.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlgvZW95ny4
I think the biggest red flag should have been the fact that he only managed 9.5 career sacks at LSU in 24 games. Not to mention. In 2019, Burrow was absolutely destroying defenses early and often and that would have presented their defense more opportunities to pin their ears back and get after the QB.
Caldwell didn't learn his lessons with Dante Fowler Jr. He fell in love with the athlete on paper and at the combine and not the football player on film and on the stat sheet. He fell in love with what "could" be instead of what "will" be.
Well, it could be worse... We could have wasted our top 10 pick on him instead of Henderson. Then we could be [BLEEP] about how he was way over-drafted on top of being poorly scouted
We'd have really been able to let Dave have it if he'd blown
that pick on him!
I'm just being weird... Coffee is not working today. Still getting another cup tho.
(01-18-2022, 10:49 AM)scottyg Wrote: [ -> ] (01-18-2022, 10:39 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]I think the biggest red flag should have been the fact that he only managed 9.5 career sacks at LSU in 24 games. Not to mention. In 2019, Burrow was absolutely destroying defenses early and often and that would have presented their defense more opportunities to pin their ears back and get after the QB.
Caldwell didn't learn his lessons with Dante Fowler Jr. He fell in love with the athlete on paper and at the combine and not the football player on film and on the stat sheet. He fell in love with what "could" be instead of what "will" be.
Well, it could be worse... We could have wasted our top 10 pick on him instead of Henderson. Then we could be [BLEEP] about how he was way over-drafted on top of being poorly scouted
We'd have really been able to let Dave have it if he'd blown that pick on him!
I'm just being weird... Coffee is not working today. Still getting another cup tho.
Lol .... I can see Dave's Resume now ..... "My drafts sucked, but they could have been much worse. A few examples are as follows: ....."
(01-18-2022, 11:00 AM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ] (01-18-2022, 10:49 AM)scottyg Wrote: [ -> ]Well, it could be worse... We could have wasted our top 10 pick on him instead of Henderson. Then we could be [BLEEP] about how he was way over-drafted on top of being poorly scouted
We'd have really been able to let Dave have it if he'd blown that pick on him!
I'm just being weird... Coffee is not working today. Still getting another cup tho.
Lol .... I can see Dave's Resume now ..... "My drafts sucked, but they could have been much worse. A few examples are as follows: ....."
He has a job in the NFL still. It's amazing. He's a personnel executive with the Eagles currently.
(01-18-2022, 10:39 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ] (01-18-2022, 10:31 AM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]This should have been a huge red flag. He got dominated vs Andrew Thomas of UGA.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlgvZW95ny4
I think the biggest red flag should have been the fact that he only managed 9.5 career sacks at LSU in 24 games. Not to mention. In 2019, Burrow was absolutely destroying defenses early and often and that would have presented their defense more opportunities to pin their ears back and get after the QB.
Caldwell didn't learn his lessons with Dante Fowler Jr. He fell in love with the athlete on paper and at the combine and not the football player on film and on the stat sheet. He fell in love with what "could" be instead of what "will" be.
Isn't that something we should think about this year too? I can't say I know the two top candidates but the Chaisson(and Bryan) examples makes me think we should avoid guys with all the tools and none of the production.
(01-18-2022, 12:41 PM)CanDoBetter Wrote: [ -> ] (01-18-2022, 10:39 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]I think the biggest red flag should have been the fact that he only managed 9.5 career sacks at LSU in 24 games. Not to mention. In 2019, Burrow was absolutely destroying defenses early and often and that would have presented their defense more opportunities to pin their ears back and get after the QB.
Caldwell didn't learn his lessons with Dante Fowler Jr. He fell in love with the athlete on paper and at the combine and not the football player on film and on the stat sheet. He fell in love with what "could" be instead of what "will" be.
Isn't that something we should think about this year too? I can't say I know the two top candidates but the Chaisson(and Bryan) examples makes me think we should avoid guys with all the tools and none of the production.
It's a roll of the dice. This first round class is looking like 2013's. Hutchinson had a massive year and then got handled against the best team in college football.
He also had an injury the year prior. Thibodeaux did as well. They just don't have that consistent stat sheet you want to see out of a top prospect coming out of college.
Then, if you don't like them. It leaves you with Neal. It's tough this year for sure. Praying like hell Washington, New York [Giants] or Philadelphia want to come up for a player they covet. Don't care if it's QB or DE. Just need a trade down BAD.
Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
(01-18-2022, 12:41 PM)CanDoBetter Wrote: [ -> ] (01-18-2022, 10:39 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]I think the biggest red flag should have been the fact that he only managed 9.5 career sacks at LSU in 24 games. Not to mention. In 2019, Burrow was absolutely destroying defenses early and often and that would have presented their defense more opportunities to pin their ears back and get after the QB.
Caldwell didn't learn his lessons with Dante Fowler Jr. He fell in love with the athlete on paper and at the combine and not the football player on film and on the stat sheet. He fell in love with what "could" be instead of what "will" be.
Isn't that something we should think about this year too? I can't say I know the two top candidates but the Chaisson(and Bryan) examples makes me think we should avoid guys with all the tools and none of the production.
Gene Smith did the same; got caught up in potential and camp/pro-day numbers. I still have flashbacks to Derek Cox, 2nd team all conference in the FCS at William and Mary, yet we traded up to the 2nd round to grab him before other teams could draft him in the projected rounds 6 and 7 ... all because the dude jumped long and high at his pro day.
(01-18-2022, 11:36 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ] (01-18-2022, 11:00 AM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]Lol .... I can see Dave's Resume now ..... "My drafts sucked, but they could have been much worse. A few examples are as follows: ....."
He has a job in the NFL still. It's amazing. He's a personnel executive with the Eagles currently.
Dave was a pretty good talent evaluator most of the time. He was terrible scouting offensive tackles, and absolutely putrid at evaluating quarterback though. He apparently really mailed it in on the Henderson/Chaisson picks too. So, you know, as I was saying, Dave was pretty good aside from a pretty big handful of astronomical failures. sigh.
Dave's problem was he wasn't shown the door when Bradley was canned.
(01-18-2022, 02:50 PM)scottyg Wrote: [ -> ] (01-18-2022, 11:36 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]He has a job in the NFL still. It's amazing. He's a personnel executive with the Eagles currently.
Dave was a pretty good talent evaluator most of the time. He was terrible scouting offensive tackles, and absolutely putrid at evaluating quarterback though. He apparently really mailed it in on the Henderson/Chaisson picks too. So, you know, as I was saying, Dave was pretty good aside from a pretty big handful of astronomical failures. sigh.
(01-18-2022, 03:37 PM)MoJagFan Wrote: [ -> ]Dave's problem was he wasn't shown the door when Bradley was canned.
Scouts like Tarzan. Selects like Jane.
Didn't get that when it all went down. Khan hired the two of them together. They both failed together. There was no reason to really give him another chance. It's rare that happens anymore. Unless, you know, you're Baalke and you get away with political murder in the front office.
My only hope was that Khan would have fired Baalke like the 49ers did and then get lucky and find this city it's Shanahan/Lynch duo.