Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

I am very leery of trading premium draft picks for a player you then have to sign to a huge new contract. That's like paying twice for one player.

(04-22-2022, 04:45 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]I am very leery of trading premium draft picks for a player you then have to sign to a huge new contract.  That's like paying twice for one player.

That being said, i'd gladly trade a single first round pick for a proven game changer.

(04-22-2022, 05:03 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2022, 04:45 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]I am very leery of trading premium draft picks for a player you then have to sign to a huge new contract.  That's like paying twice for one player.

That being said, i'd gladly trade a single first round pick for a proven game changer.

It depends on what pick in the first round and their contract situation.  If it's a pick at the bottom of the first round for a guy who does not need a new contract then sure.

But with as many needs as we have, I don't want to pay twice for the same player.

(04-21-2022, 03:36 PM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote: [ -> ]After hearing today that Samuel no longer wants to play the WR/RB hybrid role, I no longer have interest in him. He will cost a lot in terms of a trade and in salary and if he no longer wants to play the role that made him a breakout star last season, he doesn't have the value he had just a week ago, imo.

Agreed.  Some idiot agent has gotten in his ear warning him about a shortened career or a team lowballing him on a contract because he functions as a RB.

(04-21-2022, 10:08 PM)Jag88 Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-21-2022, 03:36 PM)TheO-LineMatters Wrote: [ -> ]After hearing today that Samuel no longer wants to play the WR/RB hybrid role, I no longer have interest in him. He will cost a lot in terms of a trade and in salary and if he no longer wants to play the role that made him a breakout star last season, he doesn't have the value he had just a week ago, imo.

I think hes stupid if he doesnt want to "play that role" 
I would want to touch the ball as much as possible and get paid good. Maybe he can save it for the playoffs smh

That would make him more valuable to a team...yet at the same time, potentially devastate his value to a team. 

Right now, receivers are getting paid a ton of money.  Know which position isn't?

Running Back.

You can bet when it comes to contract negotiations, whenever you have guys that can play multiple positions, especially on a regular basis, teams will negotiate new contracts on the lower paid positions.

I recall reading guys like Mike Desicki (and I forget who else, but it was another TE), one who lined up regularly in the slot.  In fact, he lined up more split wide than at a traditional Y.  He wanted to get paid like a WR, but they negotiated his deal as a TE.  I have hears of LBs being treated similarly.

If Deebo Samuel plays more RB, he will subject himself to more punishment, and his career may be shortened, impacting how much money he can make longer term.

solid 0.3% improvement there from shenault lol

that % is about as much as Urban improved our team last season

(04-22-2022, 02:15 AM)Talented Kalamari Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2022, 02:11 AM)StrayaJag Wrote: [ -> ]Can this go in deebo thread lol

My ocd kicks in when there r multiple threads for a topic that cpuld just be combined into 1 big thread

Depends, Can you not act like a virgin?

What a comeback. Congrats on winning the internet or something.

Answer this, as was asked in the other thread - where's the money coming from to sign him? He wants a bigtime deal, we ain't got bigtime money laying around any more.

Come up with that plan, and we'll assume you've had some sexytimes or something. Am I doing that right?

(04-22-2022, 03:28 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2022, 03:26 AM)TheDogCatcher Wrote: [ -> ]There seem to be too many chiefs on this message board. So many people analyzing the flow of threads. Handle that stuff behind the scenes so the Indians can have fun.

I think it's extremely stupid how often topics are merged into the same thread just for the question/discussion to die because people come onto the board, see a thread they've already looked at and don't know theres another discussion to be had.

It's that hard to see threads with new input? TIL.

I've been managing to do that across two different message boards. And face it, this is nearly an identical post as the OP in the other thread - do anything to get this guy! No analysis, no consideration of what it might take to trade for him or sign him once a trade is done, nothing.

Maybe topics die because people have already discussed the idea to death in the other thread?

(04-22-2022, 04:45 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]I am very leery of trading premium draft picks for a player you then have to sign to a huge new contract.  That's like paying twice for one player.

Everyone on this board always says that. Draft picks are a crap shoot. It’s better to get proven players. The Rams have proven that. Why hold on so dearly to these picks when we don’t know how to draft anyways?

(04-22-2022, 11:08 AM)Talented Kalamari Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2022, 04:45 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]I am very leery of trading premium draft picks for a player you then have to sign to a huge new contract.  That's like paying twice for one player.

Everyone on this board always says that. Draft picks are a crap shoot. It’s better to get proven players. The Rams have proven that. Why hold on so dearly to these picks when we don’t know how to draft anyways?

The whole narrative on the Rams being being built on mainly trades is overblown. Yes, they did it for some of their name players, but so have lots of other teams. 

Most of the Rams team is built on good drafting, just finding most of those players with later draft pick and having a lot of them for misses to not work against them. Heck they drafted their Defensive MVP and Offensive MVP.

The other issue is that trading for (and then immediately) paying name players makes sense when you on the verge of a particular window. As such a team doesn't have time for a players to pan out.

(04-21-2022, 12:59 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Shenault drop rate in 2021 - 8%
Samuel drop rate in 2021 - 8.3%

Just remember that if you are one of those people that's been calling to cut Viska for the past five months

Shenault - 660 yards from scrimmage 0 TDs
Samuel - 1770 yards from scrimmage 14 TDs

(04-22-2022, 11:08 AM)Talented Kalamari Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2022, 04:45 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]I am very leery of trading premium draft picks for a player you then have to sign to a huge new contract.  That's like paying twice for one player.

Everyone on this board always says that. Draft picks are a crap shoot. It’s better to get proven players. The Rams have proven that. Why hold on so dearly to these picks when we don’t know how to draft anyways?

That's just it...they don't always say that.

Many people believe "picks not players."  The problem with that approach is you are not aggressive in making your team better, availabe players could go elsewhere, and the picks you get when you trade away star players don't translate into star players.  (See Jalen Ramsey trade).

The problem with your approach, as expressed above, is like the potential draftees you would take with those picks, the trade target would have to be worth it.  History is replete with trades for veteran players that didn't work out.

Way back, some 45 or so years ago, Seattle traded their top pick (which was I think 2nd overall in the draft) to Dallas for a bunch of established veteran players.  Dallas wound up frafting Tony Dorsett, who wound up a Hall of Fame RB.

More recently, the Bills traded a 1st round pick and a 4th round pick for Jaguars' QB Rob Johnson.  He was a complete washout for the Bills.  With those picks, the Jaguars landed RB Fred Taylor and RB Tavian Banks (an earlier version of Travis Etienne).

Just last year, the Colts traded a 1 and a 3 for Carson Wentz.  He lasted all of one season in Indy beore his meltdown in the last week of the season.  The Colts wound up trading him away this year for a fraction of what it cost to get him.

My philosophy is somewhere in between the Rams extreme and the Kethmanist approach.  Don't be afraid to make a trade for a veteran player that can help your team, but don't get crazy with it and get it right.

(04-22-2022, 04:01 AM)Jag88 Wrote: [ -> ]Some people arent convinced yet that laviska cant catch the ball. Smh. This team can not overcome drops.

He only had 3 drops in 2020.  If he can do it in 2020, he can do it in 2022.

(04-23-2022, 10:38 PM)TheDuke007 Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2022, 04:01 AM)Jag88 Wrote: [ -> ]Some people arent convinced yet that laviska cant catch the ball. Smh. This team can not overcome drops.

He only had 3 drops in 2020.  If he can do it in 2020, he can do it in 2022.

This I agree with. Last year we truly had a coach people did not respect because he did not respect them. I know that isn't a good reason but things like that do get in a players head making them press too hard.

(04-23-2022, 10:48 PM)Jag149 Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-23-2022, 10:38 PM)TheDuke007 Wrote: [ -> ]He only had 3 drops in 2020.  If he can do it in 2020, he can do it in 2022.

This I agree with. Last year we truly had a coach people did not respect because he did not respect them. I know that isn't a good reason but things like that do get in a players head making them press too hard.

With all due respect, the head coach is not going to cause you to drop balls. Lol 
Maybe losing mcardell as the wrs coach didnt help though.

(04-23-2022, 11:03 PM)Jag88 Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-23-2022, 10:48 PM)Jag149 Wrote: [ -> ]This I agree with. Last year we truly had a coach people did not respect because he did not respect them. I know that isn't a good reason but things like that do get in a players head making them press too hard.

With all due respect, the head coach is not going to cause you to drop balls. Lol 
Maybe losing mcardell as the wrs coach didnt help though.

Who fired Keenan?

(04-22-2022, 01:01 PM)JagFanatic24 Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-21-2022, 12:59 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Shenault drop rate in 2021 - 8%
Samuel drop rate in 2021 - 8.3%

Just remember that if you are one of those people that's been calling to cut Viska for the past five months

Shenault - 660 yards from scrimmage 0 TDs
Samuel - 1770 yards from scrimmage 14 TDs

So Samuel not only had a slightly higher percentage of drops, but a much, much higher number of total drops, correct?




lol

(04-25-2022, 10:00 AM)scottyg Wrote: [ -> ]

(04-22-2022, 01:01 PM)JagFanatic24 Wrote: [ -> ]Shenault - 660 yards from scrimmage 0 TDs
Samuel - 1770 yards from scrimmage 14 TDs

So Samuel not only had a slightly higher percentage of drops, but a much, much higher number of total drops, correct?




lol

He had a LOT of drops. 

I'd love for Deebo to be a Jag, but at what cost? 

And the point of my post was merely to inform that portion of the Shenault haters club that overlaps with the "trade for Deebo" club that they are likely going to continue cursing drops if they get their wish. 

Not diminishing Deebo's production.