I know, Jamal Agnew is a great punt returner, but if you also look at what he can do as a WR, it's probable that he spends a lot more time at WR this year. Which may be one of the reasons they are trying Chenault at punt returner.
https://www.si.com/nfl/jaguars/duval-ins...ault-agnew
Jamal Agnew had a great practice, looking closer and closer to a return
One of the big names at minicamp was Jamal Agnew, the All-Pro returner and breakout receiver from last season. Agnew flashed serious talent at receiver in 2021 despite being relatively new to the position, and a big reason why is because of his rare movement skills. After suffering a hip injury at the end of last year, though, Agnew has had to work his way back this offseason.
Agnew sure looked like his old self during Monday's practice. He cut hard whenever he ran routes, made several acrobatic catches and didn't look like he has lost any of his speed. It will be interesting to see if he is fully cleared at the start of training camp, but he had a great day on Monday and shouldn't be expected to be much further off.
Lots of discussion on this in other threads. Probably good to have one dedicated to the topic.
I tend to think his value as a returner is so high that he's best to be relegated to a package of plays on offense and not over utilized in the passing game. (I'm thinking between 3 or 4 targets par game unless the package presents a major problem to the opposition and more touches are warranted)
That's just me taking sort of an old school approach to return specialist usage though. Many ways to skin this cat and this staff seems creative about that stuff. He may be more integral than I anticipate. He's looking like a playmaker more and more.
I tend to think Shenault's involvement in the return drills is about helping him add value, getting his confidence up, and maybe take him above the cut bubble safely in case he has the drop issue again. (all reports are that he's catching everything coming his way in OTAs BTW)
Also - they've had big numbers working as returners so they simply have options there due to Agnew's injury recovery and any potential setback.
Hip injuries can be tricky - and guys who take hard hits like returners can have setbacks.
That's another reason Shenault was included.
(06-14-2022, 10:28 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Lots of discussion on this in other threads. Probably good to have one dedicated to the topic.
I tend to think his value as a returner is so high that he's best to be relegated to a package of plays on offense and not over utilized in the passing game. (I'm thinking between 3 or 4 targets par game unless the package presents a major problem to the opposition and more touches are warranted)
That's just me taking sort of an old school approach to return specialist usage though. Many ways to skin this cat and this staff seems creative about that stuff. He may be more integral than I anticipate. He's looking like a playmaker more and more.
I tend to think Shenault's involvement in the return drills is about helping him add value, getting his confidence up, and maybe take him above the cut bubble safely in case he has the drop issue again. (all reports are that he's catching everything coming his way in OTAs BTW)
Also - they've had big numbers working as returners so they simply have options there due to Agnew's injury recovery and any potential setback.
Hip injuries can be tricky - and guys who take hard hits like returners can have setbacks.
That's another reason Shenault was included.
I believe Oesher posted something about Shenault along the lines that he had been dealing with a minor injury of some sort that cost him some reps recently as well.
When I saw Agnew in person at the scrimmage he was just on a different level of speed and acceleration than any other player on the field. He glides with every stride with such a burst of acceleration.
It was unbelievable. If he breaks into the open field he’s gone to the house. You won’t catch him from behind.
He absolutely should be included as a weapon for Trevor Lawrence. He can put a lot of pressure on a defense and cause problems.
(06-14-2022, 10:34 AM)scottyg Wrote: [ -> ] (06-14-2022, 10:28 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Lots of discussion on this in other threads. Probably good to have one dedicated to the topic.
I tend to think his value as a returner is so high that he's best to be relegated to a package of plays on offense and not over utilized in the passing game. (I'm thinking between 3 or 4 targets par game unless the package presents a major problem to the opposition and more touches are warranted)
That's just me taking sort of an old school approach to return specialist usage though. Many ways to skin this cat and this staff seems creative about that stuff. He may be more integral than I anticipate. He's looking like a playmaker more and more.
I tend to think Shenault's involvement in the return drills is about helping him add value, getting his confidence up, and maybe take him above the cut bubble safely in case he has the drop issue again. (all reports are that he's catching everything coming his way in OTAs BTW)
Also - they've had big numbers working as returners so they simply have options there due to Agnew's injury recovery and any potential setback.
Hip injuries can be tricky - and guys who take hard hits like returners can have setbacks.
That's another reason Shenault was included.
I believe Oesher posted something about Shenault along the lines that he had been dealing with a minor injury of some sort that cost him some reps recently as well.
Confirmed:
https://twitter.com/Demetrius82/status/1...38LDEeDMsw
The problem is keeping him healthy if he plays a lot of wr. Also he did drop a touch down if I remember correctly. Hes not as bad at dropping as others, but it remains to be seen if he can be reliable .
I would keep Agnew as the KR and as a backup WR with a special package of plays. I would limit his reps to maximize his productivity. IMO Leviksha needs to be used in a slash like capacity similar to the way Cordarelle Paterson. Leviksha lacks the flexibility in his lower body to run 35+ routes a game.
I don't expect him to be used in the red zone. If it's 2nd and 1 then he can be on the field to force the other team to respect his speed.
(06-15-2022, 01:17 PM)CanDoBetter Wrote: [ -> ]I don't expect him to be used in the red zone. If it's 2nd and 1 then he can be on the field to force the other team to respect his speed.
They may not need to respect his speed but they will have to respect his quickness.
(06-15-2022, 06:29 PM)Predator Wrote: [ -> ] (06-15-2022, 01:17 PM)CanDoBetter Wrote: [ -> ]I don't expect him to be used in the red zone. If it's 2nd and 1 then he can be on the field to force the other team to respect his speed.
They may not need to respect his speed but they will have to respect his quickness.
Agnew ran 4.4 when he was drafted, so they may need to respect both. The guy was fast as heck last year, hope his hip healed up good.
I wouod love to see him at WE
Agnew is a must have on the field. Total catalyst.
(06-14-2022, 10:28 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Lots of discussion on this in other threads. Probably good to have one dedicated to the topic.
I tend to think his value as a returner is so high that he's best to be relegated to a package of plays on offense and not over utilized in the passing game. (I'm thinking between 3 or 4 targets par game unless the package presents a major problem to the opposition and more touches are warranted)
That's just me taking sort of an old school approach to return specialist usage though. Many ways to skin this cat and this staff seems creative about that stuff. He may be more integral than I anticipate. He's looking like a playmaker more and more.
I tend to think Shenault's involvement in the return drills is about helping him add value, getting his confidence up, and maybe take him above the cut bubble safely in case he has the drop issue again. (all reports are that he's catching everything coming his way in OTAs BTW)
Also - they've had big numbers working as returners so they simply have options there due to Agnew's injury recovery and any potential setback.
Hip injuries can be tricky - and guys who take hard hits like returners can have setbacks.
That's another reason Shenault was included.
That is the old school wisdom, but I think it's faulty.
Didn't Jimmy Smith start as a kick returner for the Jags?
He was good at it. But then he became too valuable as a WR.
Which would you rather have on your team? The best WR in the game or the best punt returner in the game?
Not saying Agnew is either, but the same logic applies if the man is best at both positions or 10th best at both.
(06-15-2022, 01:17 PM)CanDoBetter Wrote: [ -> ]I don't expect him to be used in the red zone. If it's 2nd and 1 then he can be on the field to force the other team to respect his speed.
Right, he doesn't offer as much in tight quarters.
(06-20-2022, 11:15 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (06-14-2022, 10:28 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Lots of discussion on this in other threads. Probably good to have one dedicated to the topic.
I tend to think his value as a returner is so high that he's best to be relegated to a package of plays on offense and not over utilized in the passing game. (I'm thinking between 3 or 4 targets par game unless the package presents a major problem to the opposition and more touches are warranted)
That's just me taking sort of an old school approach to return specialist usage though. Many ways to skin this cat and this staff seems creative about that stuff. He may be more integral than I anticipate. He's looking like a playmaker more and more.
I tend to think Shenault's involvement in the return drills is about helping him add value, getting his confidence up, and maybe take him above the cut bubble safely in case he has the drop issue again. (all reports are that he's catching everything coming his way in OTAs BTW)
Also - they've had big numbers working as returners so they simply have options there due to Agnew's injury recovery and any potential setback.
Hip injuries can be tricky - and guys who take hard hits like returners can have setbacks.
That's another reason Shenault was included.
That is the old school wisdom, but I think it's faulty.
Didn't Jimmy Smith start as a kick returner for the Jags?
He was good at it. But then he became too valuable as a WR.
Which would you rather have on your team? The best WR in the game or the best punt returner in the game?
Not saying Agnew is either, but the same logic applies if the man is best at both positions or 10th best at both.
Obviously the best WR in the league is far more valuable than the best kick returner in the league. That's not really the question here though.... The question we should be asking is - is the best kick returner in the league more valuable than the 75th best WR in the league (or wherever Agnew might fall in the WR rankings)? At that point you have to try to predict how many game changing plays he might have at either position - how often will he switch the field on a return vs how often he might make a big play at WR. In addition, if he builds on what he did last year at WR, does he become someone that the opponent's defense has to account for when he's at WR? Hopefully this coaching staff is asking themselves these questions - I'm excited for the upcoming season (but as a Jag fan, I've been excited for EVERY season, and found a way to convince myself that there's a path to being good that year lol).
(06-21-2022, 11:22 AM)Dewboy01 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-20-2022, 11:15 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]That is the old school wisdom, but I think it's faulty.
Didn't Jimmy Smith start as a kick returner for the Jags?
He was good at it. But then he became too valuable as a WR.
Which would you rather have on your team? The best WR in the game or the best punt returner in the game?
Not saying Agnew is either, but the same logic applies if the man is best at both positions or 10th best at both.
Obviously the best WR in the league is far more valuable than the best kick returner in the league. That's not really the question here though.... The question we should be asking is - is the best kick returner in the league more valuable than the 75th best WR in the league (or wherever Agnew might fall in the WR rankings)? At that point you have to try to predict how many game changing plays he might have at either position - how often will he switch the field on a return vs how often he might make a big play at WR. In addition, if he builds on what he did last year at WR, does he become someone that the opponent's defense has to account for when he's at WR? Hopefully this coaching staff is asking themselves these questions - I'm excited for the upcoming season (but as a Jag fan, I've been excited for EVERY season, and found a way to convince myself that there's a path to being good that year lol).
Maybe a league perspective is the wrong way to think about the question.
Just look at one team only. You're the coach of that team, and you have a player who is good enough to be your leading receiver, or your best kick returner. Where do you play him?
(06-15-2022, 09:44 PM)Jag149 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-15-2022, 06:29 PM)Predator Wrote: [ -> ]They may not need to respect his speed but they will have to respect his quickness.
Agnew ran 4.4 when he was drafted, so they may need to respect both. The guy was fast as heck last year, hope his hip healed up good.
He is one of those players that doesn’t slow down any when the pads go on. He’s gotta be one of the quickest players in the league.
(06-21-2022, 11:56 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (06-21-2022, 11:22 AM)Dewboy01 Wrote: [ -> ]Obviously the best WR in the league is far more valuable than the best kick returner in the league. That's not really the question here though.... The question we should be asking is - is the best kick returner in the league more valuable than the 75th best WR in the league (or wherever Agnew might fall in the WR rankings)? At that point you have to try to predict how many game changing plays he might have at either position - how often will he switch the field on a return vs how often he might make a big play at WR. In addition, if he builds on what he did last year at WR, does he become someone that the opponent's defense has to account for when he's at WR? Hopefully this coaching staff is asking themselves these questions - I'm excited for the upcoming season (but as a Jag fan, I've been excited for EVERY season, and found a way to convince myself that there's a path to being good that year lol).
Maybe a league perspective is the wrong way to think about the question.
Just look at one team only. You're the coach of that team, and you have a player who is good enough to be your leading receiver, or your best kick returner. Where do you play him?
Are you implying that Agnew is potentially our leading receiver?
(06-21-2022, 03:03 PM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ] (06-21-2022, 11:56 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Maybe a league perspective is the wrong way to think about the question.
Just look at one team only. You're the coach of that team, and you have a player who is good enough to be your leading receiver, or your best kick returner. Where do you play him?
Are you implying that Agnew is potentially our leading receiver?
Yes. Potentially. It's good that they signed Zay Jones and Christian Kirk, but I'm more excited about what Agnew might do. But I'm just a fan. If I had a chance to see a few closed doors practices my opinion might change.
(06-20-2022, 11:15 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (06-14-2022, 10:28 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Lots of discussion on this in other threads. Probably good to have one dedicated to the topic.
I tend to think his value as a returner is so high that he's best to be relegated to a package of plays on offense and not over utilized in the passing game. (I'm thinking between 3 or 4 targets par game unless the package presents a major problem to the opposition and more touches are warranted)
That's just me taking sort of an old school approach to return specialist usage though. Many ways to skin this cat and this staff seems creative about that stuff. He may be more integral than I anticipate. He's looking like a playmaker more and more.
I tend to think Shenault's involvement in the return drills is about helping him add value, getting his confidence up, and maybe take him above the cut bubble safely in case he has the drop issue again. (all reports are that he's catching everything coming his way in OTAs BTW)
Also - they've had big numbers working as returners so they simply have options there due to Agnew's injury recovery and any potential setback.
Hip injuries can be tricky - and guys who take hard hits like returners can have setbacks.
That's another reason Shenault was included.
That is the old school wisdom, but I think it's faulty.
Didn't Jimmy Smith start as a kick returner for the Jags?
He was good at it. But then he became too valuable as a WR.
Which would you rather have on your team? The best WR in the game or the best punt returner in the game?
Not saying Agnew is either, but the same logic applies if the man is best at both positions or 10th best at both.
(06-15-2022, 01:17 PM)CanDoBetter Wrote: [ -> ]I don't expect him to be used in the red zone. If it's 2nd and 1 then he can be on the field to force the other team to respect his speed.
Right, he doesn't offer as much in tight quarters.
Say what, now?
We're talking about the same 5'9" - 190 pound returner that's just learning to be a receiver, right?
Dude made some eye popping plays last year y'all, but we're looking at a very small sample size to make such wild speculations about and undersized guy with a lot to prove - and he's coming off of injury!