Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

So you can't help yourself?

(06-17-2022, 07:45 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]So you can't help yourself?

"Forced" is a pretty simple word and he used it in a way that wasn't accurate in my estimation. It's was a pretty simple question I asked too, but I guess when you got your ax to grind even basics are too much for you.

(06-17-2022, 05:43 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-17-2022, 01:30 AM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ]Glad you're happy. I assume it was your choice. Otherwise, I think all those vaccine forcers are a little nutty.

You were physically restrained and injected?

Of course not. But being forced to quit your job for vaccine refusal is 'forced' in mine and many other people's view. That's not freedom, it's tyranny.

Not anti-vax, btw, I've had a few that have a good track record. Just wasn't a fan of taking this one when there was no clinical data early on supporting it and what data there was was getting manipulated/obscured by the government and pharma. Those are red flags as far as i'm concerned.

(06-17-2022, 10:36 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-17-2022, 07:45 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]So you can't help yourself?

"Forced" is a pretty simple word and he used it in a way that wasn't accurate in my estimation. It's was a pretty simple question I asked too, but I guess when you got your ax to grind even basics are too much for you.

I'm not sure you get basics sometimes.

(06-17-2022, 11:03 AM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-17-2022, 05:43 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]You were physically restrained and injected?

Of course not.  But being forced to quit your job for vaccine refusal is 'forced' in mine and many other people's view.  That's not freedom, it's tyranny.

Not anti-vax, btw, I've had a few that have a good track record.  Just wasn't a fan of taking this one when there was no clinical data early on supporting it and what data there was was getting manipulated/obscured by the government and pharma.  Those are red flags as far as i'm concerned.

Your job is not a right, the idea that it is causes many of the problem we are experiencing as a society. Employment =/= Ownership.

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(06-17-2022, 11:10 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-17-2022, 10:36 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]"Forced" is a pretty simple word and he used it in a way that wasn't accurate in my estimation. It's was a pretty simple question I asked too, but I guess when you got your ax to grind even basics are too much for you.

I'm not sure you get basics sometimes.

Sure I do, that's why I try to keep people honest about the words they use. When we've lost the language we end up with Mikesez-level distortions of reality. No one in this Country was forced, though their choice might've had unpleasant consequences. That is not tyranny unless you think the business owners should've been "forced" to keep employees who refused to acquiesce to their terms of employment.

(06-17-2022, 11:17 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-17-2022, 11:03 AM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ]Of course not.  But being forced to quit your job for vaccine refusal is 'forced' in mine and many other people's view.  That's not freedom, it's tyranny.

Not anti-vax, btw, I've had a few that have a good track record.  Just wasn't a fan of taking this one when there was no clinical data early on supporting it and what data there was was getting manipulated/obscured by the government and pharma.  Those are red flags as far as i'm concerned.

Your job is not a right, the idea that it is causes many of the problem we are experiencing as a society. Employment =/= Ownership.

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(06-17-2022, 11:10 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not sure you get basics sometimes.

Sure I do, that's why I try to keep people honest about the words they use. When we've lost the language we end up with Mikesez-level distortions of reality. No one in this Country was forced, though their choice might've had unpleasant consequences. That is not tyranny unless you think the business owners should've been "forced" to keep employees who refused to acquiesce to their terms of employment.

And they have no 'right' to take it away over refusal of a questionable vaccine.

(06-17-2022, 11:23 AM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-17-2022, 11:17 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Your job is not a right, the idea that it is causes many of the problem we are experiencing as a society. Employment =/= Ownership.

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Sure I do, that's why I try to keep people honest about the words they use. When we've lost the language we end up with Mikesez-level distortions of reality. No one in this Country was forced, though their choice might've had unpleasant consequences. That is not tyranny unless you think the business owners should've been "forced" to keep employees who refused to acquiesce to their terms of employment.

And they have no 'right' to take it away over refusal of a questionable vaccine.

Why not? Why do you get to tell me that I have to keep you employed if you won't agree to my terms? It's your job but it's my company.

Well, by your reasoning, no one is forced to pay taxes.

(06-17-2022, 01:20 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]Well, by your reasoning, no one is forced to pay taxes.

So you make no distinction between government force and property rights. Got it.

No... I'm just not stupid enough to think that governments forcing corporations to create mandates is anything other than compulsion.

(06-17-2022, 05:00 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]No... I'm just not stupid enough to think that governments forcing corporations to create mandates is anything other than compulsion.

Right, no one disagrees with you that they are safer when unvaccinated people aren't working in their businesses, it's all government doing it.

Except the government actually did it. Government-imposed vaccination or you get punished in the form of losing your job or you job gets punished in the form of crippling fines. Tell me which part of that is freedom of choice? Speaking of language.... you're trying awfully hard to spin this.

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I know for a fact that many hospitals waited until the Supreme Court ruling before reluctantly putting that choice in front of their employees. So, who cares if some or even many hospitals WANTED to enforce it. The point is that people were FORCED to make that decision or lose their jobs BY THE GOVERNMENT.

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Just drop the schtick and admit it.

(06-17-2022, 05:17 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]Except the government actually did it. Government-imposed vaccination or you get punished in the form of losing your job or you job gets punished in the form of crippling fines. Tell me which part of that is freedom of choice? Speaking of language.... you're trying awfully hard to spin this.

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I know for a fact that many hospitals waited until the Supreme Court ruling before reluctantly putting that choice in front of their employees. So, who cares if some or even many hospitals WANTED to enforce it. The point is that people were FORCED to make that decision or lose their jobs BY THE GOVERNMENT.

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Just drop the schtick and admit it.

I'm not spinning anything, you don't have a right to a job, you earn the job. If you don't want to abide by the requirement I have for my employees then you didn't lose your job, you chose to leave it. That same as if you chose not to work your assigned shift, or the pay wasn't high enough, or you didn't want to fulfill the job duties. Your freedom of choice is to comply with my requirement or find another job. Why do you hate property rights so much?

(06-17-2022, 11:17 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-17-2022, 11:03 AM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ]Of course not.  But being forced to quit your job for vaccine refusal is 'forced' in mine and many other people's view.  That's not freedom, it's tyranny.

Not anti-vax, btw, I've had a few that have a good track record.  Just wasn't a fan of taking this one when there was no clinical data early on supporting it and what data there was was getting manipulated/obscured by the government and pharma.  Those are red flags as far as i'm concerned.

Your job is not a right, the idea that it is causes many of the problem we are experiencing as a society. Employment =/= Ownership.

---

(06-17-2022, 11:10 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not sure you get basics sometimes.

Sure I do, that's why I try to keep people honest about the words they use. When we've lost the language we end up with Mikesez-level distortions of reality. No one in this Country was forced, though their choice might've had unpleasant consequences. That is not tyranny unless you think the business owners should've been "forced" to keep employees who refused to acquiesce to their terms of employment.

Everything you feel about them on the subject of vaccines, I feel about you on the subject of Trump’s attempts to overturn the Constitution and become a dictator. No one can see what they don't want to see.

(06-17-2022, 06:40 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-17-2022, 11:17 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Your job is not a right, the idea that it is causes many of the problem we are experiencing as a society. Employment =/= Ownership.

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Sure I do, that's why I try to keep people honest about the words they use. When we've lost the language we end up with Mikesez-level distortions of reality. No one in this Country was forced, though their choice might've had unpleasant consequences. That is not tyranny unless you think the business owners should've been "forced" to keep employees who refused to acquiesce to their terms of employment.

Everything you feel about them on the subject of vaccines, I feel about you on the subject of Trump’s attempts to overturn the Constitution and become a dictator. No one can see what they don't want to see.

Lol.

(06-17-2022, 05:43 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-17-2022, 01:30 AM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ]Glad you're happy. I assume it was your choice. Otherwise, I think all those vaccine forcers are a little nutty.

You were physically restrained and injected?

Get the vaccine or get fired.  Pretty close to the same thing when you have a family to feed and bills to pay.  I expect better from you.

(06-17-2022, 07:07 PM)copycat Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-17-2022, 05:43 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]You were physically restrained and injected?

Get the vaccine or get fired.  Pretty close to the same thing when you have a family to feed and bills to pay.  I expect better from you.

Not even close to the same thing. No one is forced to work in any particular job and no one has a right to any job. It's an agreement between two parties and the government as the unwelcome third party at the table. When one party cannot agree on the terms of the agreement then the agreement should terminate. When one party is forced to remain in the agreement past the point that they agree to the terms then we call that tyranny. When an employee does not wish to abide by the employer's terms then the relationship should end. Ownership and employment do not confer the same rights.

I’m with flsprtsgod on this one. You work at the pleasure of your employer. You don’t own your job. No one says you have to like it, but if they require vaccination as a condition of employment, make your decision and move on. Plenty of smaller companies don’t care about vaccination status. Maybe look at it as an opportunity to step away from your corporate slavemasters.

Many of those hospitals implemented that policy because it was mandated by the government. Why are you guys dismissing this point?

(06-18-2022, 12:54 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]Many of those hospitals implemented that policy because it was mandated by the government. Why are you guys dismissing this point?

You assume they wouldn't have otherwise to your detriment. Vaccination is a foundational policy of infection control and SOP almost everywhere.