Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

(06-22-2022, 08:20 PM)surfon Wrote: [ -> ]Wentz looked at the schexule and said sweet.  I get to go on  Ir week one and collect that paycheck the rest of the year.  Who is their backup qb.

This made me laugh

(06-24-2022, 10:32 PM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-24-2022, 08:06 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ]Because I can point to maybe 2 games last year that our offense looked competent. Carson Wentz failed horrendously to us in week 18, but overall had a decent season and only slightly missed the playoffs.

If we played them in week 10-18 I might have a different opinion, but as of right now I have no reason to believe we got that much better until I see the new players, the new scheme by Doug and co. and until I see Handsome Squidward play good football.

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This is a very bias ranking. I'm not going to go down the list.. but how can you say week 1 that the team with a QB who went 27 td 7 ints last season is going to be worse off than the one with the guy who had 12 td 17 ints?

And i'm not even remotely saying Wentz will be a better QB than Trevor when it's said and done, i'm just talking about week 1 2022.

It's equally biased when you drag an entire season of stats in when comparing one team to another. Wentz wasnt good against us, average at best. And I said he's the x factor and if he plays average, then the jags prob take the L. What are you complaining about?

It's bias for me to use prior play to predict the outcome in the same way it would be bias to project on players who haven't even played yet, or players who haven't been good yet? .. no

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(06-25-2022, 07:03 AM)MarleyJag Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-24-2022, 08:06 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ]Because I can point to maybe 2 games last year that our offense looked competent. Carson Wentz failed horrendously to us in week 18, but overall had a decent season and only slightly missed the playoffs.

If we played them in week 10-18 I might have a different opinion, but as of right now I have no reason to believe we got that much better until I see the new players, the new scheme by Doug and co. and until I see Handsome Squidward play good football.

Wentz didn't have a good year last year statistically. They only games I watched him play, he looked bottom 3rd of starters. I don't see him suddenly making a jump in a new system but you never know. On the other hand, I suspect our defense is going to be really good.

27 tds 7 ints isn't a bad season. I also don't think he's going to suddenly become a superstar either, but I do think Carson Wentz at this current moment is a more effecient player than Trevor Lawrence. This will likely be a completely different story next year or even deep into this upcoming season but as for week 1 2022, I highly doubt we see the less productive/Younger QB with no real WRs out perform the guy who is going to a team with a real #1 WR, and an all around better offensive talent than our squad and a much better defense than ours currently.

(06-25-2022, 07:42 AM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]I'd give the Commanders the dline and WR edge everything else to the Jags

Let's be honest, they got RB too until we're sure that Etienne is back and Snoop can pick up JRob's slack. Based on experience alone, it may be our weakest unit.

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(06-25-2022, 07:42 AM)TheLeadCommander Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-20-2022, 06:51 AM)nhiverson Wrote: [ -> ]I'd hope Lawrence is better then Wentz ever was this year.

Wentz was in contention for MVP a couple of years ago Trevor is not ready for that just yet...But he has the physical tools to reach that level NO Doubt...

....with his OC as the guy who was coaching him last year, where he looked like a wet fart.

Vince Young was a Rookie of the Year, that award sure proved he had what it took for long term success, too.

(06-27-2022, 08:20 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-25-2022, 07:42 AM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]I'd give the Commanders the dline and WR edge everything else to the Jags

Let's be honest, they got RB too until we're sure that Etienne is back and Snoop can pick up JRob's slack. Based on experience alone, it may be our weakest unit.

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(06-25-2022, 07:42 AM)TheLeadCommander Wrote: [ -> ]Wentz was in contention for MVP a couple of years ago Trevor is not ready for that just yet...But he has the physical tools to reach that level NO Doubt...

....with his OC as the guy who was coaching him last year, where he looked like a wet fart.

Vince Young was a Rookie of the Year, that award sure proved he had what it took for long term success, too.

Wentz had 27 td 7 ints, and was one game away from the playoffs. I find it odd how people on this board will condem a player based on a single game they watched, but refuse to fault Lawrence for a season full of errors.

(06-27-2022, 09:11 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-27-2022, 08:20 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ]Let's be honest, they got RB too until we're sure that Etienne is back and Snoop can pick up JRob's slack. Based on experience alone, it may be our weakest unit.

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....with his OC as the guy who was coaching him last year, where he looked like a wet fart.

Vince Young was a Rookie of the Year, that award sure proved he had what it took for long term success, too.

Wentz had 27 td 7 ints, and was one game away from the playoffs. I find it odd how people on this board will condem a player based on a single game they watched, but refuse to fault Lawrence for a season full of errors.

Well, his own team pretty much did, so what do you expect?  He's still clearly got some skills, but he didn't look like a guy who is capable of taking a team to the next level... Not in the games I saw him in anyway.

And this is a Jaguar site, so we prefer building on hope of the things we've seen from Lawrence and the way he handled things on and off the field during an impossible rookie season.  If you prefer to look at the negative, that's your prerogative, but you won't endear yourself to too many members of this site that way.

(06-19-2022, 06:09 AM)NH3 Wrote: [ -> ]There's no way of knowing which team is better at this point. You'd have to know the roster, not just on paper and their true abilities. For the sake of this topic though, I'd say that we have an better HC.

Time Will Tell.

NH3...

After 3 pages....

This is really all we can say. Heck we have more of an edge with the way JDR was vilified. Good thing we have a bunch of training camp to learn more.

(06-27-2022, 09:26 AM)scottyg Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-27-2022, 09:11 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ]Wentz had 27 td 7 ints, and was one game away from the playoffs. I find it odd how people on this board will condem a player based on a single game they watched, but refuse to fault Lawrence for a season full of errors.

Well, his own team pretty much did, so what do you expect?  He's still clearly got some skills, but he didn't look like a guy who is capable of taking a team to the next level... Not in the games I saw him in anyway.

And this is a Jaguar site, so we prefer building on hope of the things we've seen from Lawrence and the way he handled things on and off the field during an impossible rookie season.  If you prefer to look at the negative, that's your prerogative, but you won't endear yourself to too many members of this site that way.

I speak on truth of what ive seen. I dont prefer to look at the negative or positive based on choice, i look at the facts of the situation and respond accordingly. And i dont know any of these people on this board personally, im not looking to be endeared, i just like talking about my team but i refuse to pander to people against my own beliefs. And yes, Ofcourse they moved on.. Wentz is no franchise QB BUT my point in this thread is, week 1 he has a much better shot at being the superior qb on the field on that specific date.

(06-27-2022, 09:11 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-27-2022, 08:20 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ]Let's be honest, they got RB too until we're sure that Etienne is back and Snoop can pick up JRob's slack. Based on experience alone, it may be our weakest unit.

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....with his OC as the guy who was coaching him last year, where he looked like a wet fart.

Vince Young was a Rookie of the Year, that award sure proved he had what it took for long term success, too.

Wentz had 27 td 7 ints, and was one game away from the playoffs. I find it odd how people on this board will condem a player based on a single game they watched, but refuse to fault Lawrence for a season full of errors.

I have confidence that Lawrence's season was problematic for reasons beyond his own ability, have faith that he can act as a leader of this team going forward, and believe that the changes we've made will reverse last season's course. I can't say ANY of that about ol' red.

YMMV.

(06-27-2022, 09:11 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-27-2022, 08:20 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ]Let's be honest, they got RB too until we're sure that Etienne is back and Snoop can pick up JRob's slack. Based on experience alone, it may be our weakest unit.

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....with his OC as the guy who was coaching him last year, where he looked like a wet fart.

Vince Young was a Rookie of the Year, that award sure proved he had what it took for long term success, too.

Wentz had 27 td 7 ints, and was one game away from the playoffs. I find it odd how people on this board will condem a player based on a single game they watched, but refuse to fault Lawrence for a season full of errors.

For a season full of errors LOLOLOLOLOL

Hilarious

(06-22-2022, 05:07 PM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ]RB - Commanders
QB - Jags
OL - Jags
WR - Commanders
TE - Jags
ST - Jags
DL - Commanders
LB - Commanders
CB - Jags
S - Jags
Coaching - Commanders

these teams look pretty even to me on paper.  I think the X factor is Wentz.  If he plays great, or even average without any TO's, the Commies win.  Bad game from Wentz, and the Jags win.  Either way, it's most likely a close game.

Do we know if Chase Young and Montez Sweat will be 100 percent and ready to go by week 1?  I know both suffered injuries last year.  I think knowing this is key to any analysis between the two teams. Sweat is likely to be okay, and based upon the traditional timetables, Young should be okay, but usually isn't the most improvement a season removed from tearing the ACL?

(06-25-2022, 07:03 AM)MarleyJag Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-24-2022, 08:06 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ]Because I can point to maybe 2 games last year that our offense looked competent. Carson Wentz failed horrendously to us in week 18, but overall had a decent season and only slightly missed the playoffs.

If we played them in week 10-18 I might have a different opinion, but as of right now I have no reason to believe we got that much better until I see the new players, the new scheme by Doug and co. and until I see Handsome Squidward play good football.

Wentz didn't have a good year last year statistically. They only games I watched him play, he looked bottom 3rd of starters. I don't see him suddenly making a jump in a new system but you never know. On the other hand, I suspect our defense is going to be really good.

That was with an offense virtually tailor made to accommodate hi made by Reich, who coached him to his greatest success in Philly.  In Washington, Wentz won't have that going for him, nor will he have the OL or RB going for him like he had with Indy last year   Better receivers?  Yes especially if they get McLaurin into camp   But nothing else going for him compared to last year.

(06-18-2022, 06:01 PM)TheLeadCommander Wrote: [ -> ]At what positions or units are the Jags better then the Commanders that's a game changer that gives them the edge to get the W week 1 I'm struggling to see any...I can't say Trevor is better then Wentz cause Wentz has played at a high level in this league Trevor hasn't yet.....Can I get your feelings on this topic?

My feelings are: 

1) It doesn't matter if Trevor is better than Wentz, or if our defensive line is better than Washington's.  Trevor isn't lining up against Wentz, and our defensive line is not lining up against Washington's defensive line.  

2) In the case of the Jags especially, evaluating any position group is too much of a projection, especially with all the new starters we're going to have out there.  At least half of our starters will be new.  It's a huge roster upgrade, but having that many new starters means they probably won't play very well to start the season.  

3) I think Carson Wentz was scapegoated by Frank Reich in order to deflect blame from Reich for last season's collapse.  When I watch Wentz, I see a decent QB.  The mystery is why this decent QB has now been dumped by two different teams.  Obviously, there's some issue I'm not aware of.

(06-28-2022, 02:34 AM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-22-2022, 05:07 PM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ]RB - Commanders
QB - Jags
OL - Jags
WR - Commanders
TE - Jags
ST - Jags
DL - Commanders
LB - Commanders
CB - Jags
S - Jags
Coaching - Commanders

these teams look pretty even to me on paper.  I think the X factor is Wentz.  If he plays great, or even average without any TO's, the Commies win.  Bad game from Wentz, and the Jags win.  Either way, it's most likely a close game.

Do we know if Chase Young and Montez Sweat will be 100 percent and ready to go by week 1?  I know both suffered injuries last year.  I think knowing this is key to any analysis between the two teams.  Sweat is likely to be okay, and based upon the traditional timetables, Young should be okay, but usually isn't the most improvement a season removed from tearing the ACL?

It sure used to be, but guys are getting back to or close to 100% much more quickly than they used to.  I think Adrian Peterson really broke that mold rushing for 2000 yards after returning to action just 9 or so months after tearing his.

Achilles injuries still seem to work that way though.  I would be more concerned with Robinson's injury if vision wasn't his greatest strength...  He should be still be able to be pretty productive even if he's not quite 100%

(06-28-2022, 05:48 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-18-2022, 06:01 PM)TheLeadCommander Wrote: [ -> ]At what positions or units are the Jags better then the Commanders that's a game changer that gives them the edge to get the W week 1 I'm struggling to see any...I can't say Trevor is better then Wentz cause Wentz has played at a high level in this league Trevor hasn't yet.....Can I get your feelings on this topic?

My feelings are: 

1) It doesn't matter if Trevor is better than Wentz, or if our defensive line is better than Washington's.  Trevor isn't lining up against Wentz, and our defensive line is not lining up against Washington's defensive line.  

2) In the case of the Jags especially, evaluating any position group is too much of a projection, especially with all the new starters we're going to have out there.  At least half of our starters will be new.  It's a huge roster upgrade, but having that many new starters means they probably won't play very well to start the season.  

3) I think Carson Wentz was scapegoated by Frank Reich in order to deflect blame from Reich for last season's collapse.  When I watch Wentz, I see a decent QB.  The mystery is why this decent QB has now been dumped by two different teams.  Obviously, there's some issue I'm not aware of.

People are calling him uncoachable. I don't know how much of it is true but I look forward to how Pederson and Press Taylor will talk about Wentz since they really should know.

(06-28-2022, 02:54 AM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-25-2022, 07:03 AM)MarleyJag Wrote: [ -> ]Wentz didn't have a good year last year statistically. They only games I watched him play, he looked bottom 3rd of starters. I don't see him suddenly making a jump in a new system but you never know. On the other hand, I suspect our defense is going to be really good.

That was with an offense virtually tailor made to accommodate hi made by Reich, who coached him to his greatest success in Philly.  In Washington, Wentz won't have that going for him, nor will he have the OL or RB going for him like he had with Indy last year   Better receivers?  Yes especially if they get McLaurin into camp   But nothing else going for him compared to last year.

I agree. Even with that tailor-made offense, Wentz' stats were pretty pedestrian other than his TD/INT numbers which were better than average. Lawrence actually passed for more yards in spite of going through some tribulations with the coaching staff and strategy. This year is likely not going to be a great year for Wentz whereas most people are expecting Lawrence to take a huge step forward in his second season.

(06-29-2022, 09:50 AM)MarleyJag Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-28-2022, 02:54 AM)Bullseye Wrote: [ -> ]That was with an offense virtually tailor made to accommodate hi made by Reich, who coached him to his greatest success in Philly.  In Washington, Wentz won't have that going for him, nor will he have the OL or RB going for him like he had with Indy last year   Better receivers?  Yes especially if they get McLaurin into camp   But nothing else going for him compared to last year.

I agree. Even with that tailor-made offense, Wentz' stats were pretty pedestrian other than his TD/INT numbers which were better than average. Lawrence actually passed for more yards in spite of going through some tribulations with the coaching staff and strategy. This year is likely not going to be a great year for Wentz whereas most people are expecting Lawrence to take a huge step forward in his second season.

1996 time

(06-27-2022, 03:44 PM)Eric1 Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-27-2022, 09:11 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ]Wentz had 27 td 7 ints, and was one game away from the playoffs. I find it odd how people on this board will condem a player based on a single game they watched, but refuse to fault Lawrence for a season full of errors.

For a season full of errors LOLOLOLOLOL

Hilarious

Theres the group your in, who thinks that the reason our QB couldn't throw a TD for 9 straight games, was missing short passes and making poor decisions was soley based on the players/coaching around him.

And then theres the group i'm in, people with working eye balls who can acknowledge he wasn't in a good position, but can still accept that he made plenty of his own mistakes. And most of his mistakes were the same issues he had at Clemson where he had better talent/coaching than 99% of the teams he played against.

You, and the other few people who wont let go of this argument with me have a combined football IQ of Blaine Gabbert out of 0.

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(06-28-2022, 05:48 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-18-2022, 06:01 PM)TheLeadCommander Wrote: [ -> ]At what positions or units are the Jags better then the Commanders that's a game changer that gives them the edge to get the W week 1 I'm struggling to see any...I can't say Trevor is better then Wentz cause Wentz has played at a high level in this league Trevor hasn't yet.....Can I get your feelings on this topic?

My feelings are: 

1) It doesn't matter if Trevor is better than Wentz, or if our defensive line is better than Washington's.  Trevor isn't lining up against Wentz, and our defensive line is not lining up against Washington's defensive line.  

2) In the case of the Jags especially, evaluating any position group is too much of a projection, especially with all the new starters we're going to have out there.  At least half of our starters will be new.  It's a huge roster upgrade, but having that many new starters means they probably won't play very well to start the season.  

3) I think Carson Wentz was scapegoated by Frank Reich in order to deflect blame from Reich for last season's collapse.  When I watch Wentz, I see a decent QB.  The mystery is why this decent QB has now been dumped by two different teams.  Obviously, there's some issue I'm not aware of.

Carson Wentz issues are mental imo. In the same way I felt about Blake Bortles for years, he just seems like a regular guy and all of this is a little over his head. He's got the talent to be great, he's shown it. The problem is he continously makes silly errors that make you think he's feeling some sort of pressure that's too much for him.

(06-27-2022, 11:34 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-27-2022, 09:11 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ]Wentz had 27 td 7 ints, and was one game away from the playoffs. I find it odd how people on this board will condem a player based on a single game they watched, but refuse to fault Lawrence for a season full of errors.

I have confidence that Lawrence's season was problematic for reasons beyond his own ability, have faith that he can act as a leader of this team going forward, and believe that the changes we've made will reverse last season's course. I can't say ANY of that about ol' red.

YMMV.

Lawrence had a coach that didn't help him fix the issues he already had. What you saw last year was 2020 Clemson Trevor Lawrence playing in the big leagues. Coaching can fix him certainly, but to try to pretend that bad play calling, or receivers dropping passes caused him to throw INTs 5 yards down the field into a linebackers hands with no WRs around is absolutely stupid.

(06-30-2022, 04:55 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-27-2022, 11:34 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ]I have confidence that Lawrence's season was problematic for reasons beyond his own ability, have faith that he can act as a leader of this team going forward, and believe that the changes we've made will reverse last season's course. I can't say ANY of that about ol' red.

YMMV.

Lawrence had a coach that didn't help him fix the issues he already had. What you saw last year was 2020 Clemson Trevor Lawrence playing in the big leagues. Coaching can fix him certainly, but to try to pretend that bad play calling, or receivers dropping passes caused him to throw INTs 5 yards down the field into a linebackers hands with no WRs around is absolutely stupid.

You're ridiculous dude.

(06-30-2022, 04:55 AM)ChrisJagBoy Wrote: [ -> ]

(06-27-2022, 11:34 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ]I have confidence that Lawrence's season was problematic for reasons beyond his own ability, have faith that he can act as a leader of this team going forward, and believe that the changes we've made will reverse last season's course. I can't say ANY of that about ol' red.

YMMV.

Lawrence had a coach that didn't help him fix the issues he already had. What you saw last year was 2020 Clemson Trevor Lawrence playing in the big leagues. Coaching can fix him certainly, but to try to pretend that bad play calling, or receivers dropping passes caused him to throw INTs 5 yards down the field into a linebackers hands with no WRs around is absolutely stupid.

This narrative that a whole group of people believe any of those things just because they disagree with you is getting old. In fact most people(actually everyone) recognizes that a lot of the mistakes made last year fall directly on Trevor. 

However most people also recognize that despite the mistakes he also showed a lot of things that were positive and left most of us feeling optimistic that he can evolve into the player that we thought he could be when we drafted him. 

Just because you choose to isolate the negative and allow that to shape how you feel about TL, like what said before, is your prerogative. To say coaching or the lack of talent that this team as whole didn’t contribute to any of Trevor’s struggles last year is just stupid. However, no one is arguing that the sole factor either.

Everyone on here knows you are willing die on that hill, so I don’t know why I’m even bothering with a response. But this belief that no one else saw the problems you saw is just plain wrong.