(12-06-2022, 02:36 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (12-06-2022, 02:14 PM)Mandeezee Wrote: [ -> ]Because it's still Caldwells scheme. And it's why there's only a "mild" rebellion. The players haven't gone full renegade, there's still hope lol.
My source is a few people who work at the stadium and rub elbows with a few players.
That doesn't make any sense.
It's easy to imagine a GM telling a DC who to put on the field and who to take off. Very hard to imagine a GM telling the DC what each player's assignment will be for each play.
You underestimate him. He did similar control things before so it could be true.
We are going to have to wait until the year ends to find out.
Whoever is fired will open up and Allen is losing money so you know he will have to give an explanation on why his numbers are down.
Hopefully it's not too bad but it could get worse if the Titans blow them out. It's a huge stretch but if they lose out, I wouldn't totally be shocked if all the coaches walk away if Baalke is really the issue.
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The more I go back and look at his film and Walker's film. The more aggravated I get with Mike Caldwell, Trent Baalke and this coaching staff. Lloyd had over 300 snaps as an edge rusher during his tenure at Utah. Had 17 career sacks. Walker is clearly a guy that needs to be playing with his hands in the dirt and his [BLEEP] up in the air to where he can use his power, which comes from your waist down.
[BLEEP] pissing away raw talent by playing them at positions they're virtually raw at. If you knew you had plans with them outside of what they had already flashed coming out of [BLEEP] college? And you thought it was a great idea to take the 1st and 27th overall selections to play them out of position? What did you see evaluation wise? I really want to hear from Baalke and his scouting team.
You take players at positions that they can help you at from day one. Instead of Walker. You could have went with Gardner. Instead of Lloyd. You could have went with Pickens.
These should be things that coaches and front offices are not only willing to openly admit that they [BLEEP] up on, but, it's fixable. I don't want to hear you can't make these types of changes with five weeks left to play. Sure you [BLEEP] can. When something isn't working. You change it the [BLEEP] up. Adapt or die. That's the nature of all sports. Put your aces in their places.
Walker should be moved inside, right in between the tackle and guard or guard and center so he can use his strength to overpower and just "go". Playing upright doesn't look comfortable nor natural to him. Lageman made a point to call that out with Hutchinson in Detroit. Detroit moved him to a more comfortable role and guess what? Plays started happening in his direction. Two interceptions, more sacks, etc.
I find it hard to believe that a GM who is neither a former coach or player is directing the DC or attempting to. The DC reports to the HC. I find it more difficult to believe that a HC of Pederson's pedigree would come into a situation where the GM was allowed to bark orders at his DC. Or in the case that he didn't know what he was getting into when he signed his contract, would not then just shut this crap down immediately once it started. This sounds awfully made up to capitalize on the worst loss of the season and to specifically be fed to the rabid anti-Baalke crowd.
(12-07-2022, 10:01 AM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ]I find it hard to believe that a GM who is neither a former coach or player is directing the DC or attempting to. The DC reports to the HC. I find it more difficult to believe that a HC of Pederson's pedigree would come into a situation where the GM was allowed to bark orders at his DC. Or in the case that he didn't know what he was getting into when he signed his contract, would not then just shut this crap down immediately once it started. This sounds awfully made up to capitalize on the worst loss of the season and to specifically be fed to the rabid anti-Baalke crowd.
This is where I am at. I need to hear from all parties involved. What was the logic or rationale behind taking Walker and Lloyd and then making the decision to play them outside of their natural positions coming out of college. None of it's adding up.
It's not adding up flow chart wise and it's literally not adding up on the stat sheet. There's a disconnect somewhere and everybody has been pretty much mum about who is responsible for what. Pederson basically took an easy way out of this situation on defense by stating he stays out of it.
Does this mean Caldwell has complete freedom and quality control with his personnel or is something in the way of that? Somebody had to have sat down with these guys and asked or got the greenlight to draft Walker and draft Lloyd and confidently state they could coach them into different roles at the highest level of this sport.
What bothers me, is that, twelve weeks in, we've seen a continued decline from these players and not enough flashes of talent or plays being made to warrant any hope for their futures. It was there earlier in the season and now it feels like they've left this team at the altar with cold feet since September.
What's stopping or preventing Walker and Lloyd from simply moving over into their more natural positions they exceled at during their college careers? That's the $1M question and somebody has an answer for that [BLEEP] in that building.
(12-07-2022, 10:01 AM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ]I find it hard to believe that a GM who is neither a former coach or player is directing the DC or attempting to. The DC reports to the HC. I find it more difficult to believe that a HC of Pederson's pedigree would come into a situation where the GM was allowed to bark orders at his DC. Or in the case that he didn't know what he was getting into when he signed his contract, would not then just shut this crap down immediately once it started. This sounds awfully made up to capitalize on the worst loss of the season and to specifically be fed to the rabid anti-Baalke crowd.
Given Baalke’s history, I do find it plausible. He drove Harbaugh away with his meddling
(12-07-2022, 09:38 AM)Caldrac Wrote: [ -> ]The more I go back and look at his film and Walker's film. The more aggravated I get with Mike Caldwell, Trent Baalke and this coaching staff. Lloyd had over 300 snaps as an edge rusher during his tenure at Utah. Had 17 career sacks. Walker is clearly a guy that needs to be playing with his hands in the dirt and his [BLEEP] up in the air to where he can use his power, which comes from your waist down.
[BLEEP] pissing away raw talent by playing them at positions they're virtually raw at. If you knew you had plans with them outside of what they had already flashed coming out of [BLEEP] college? And you thought it was a great idea to take the 1st and 27th overall selections to play them out of position? What did you see evaluation wise? I really want to hear from Baalke and his scouting team.
You take players at positions that they can help you at from day one. Instead of Walker. You could have went with Gardner. Instead of Lloyd. You could have went with Pickens.
These should be things that coaches and front offices are not only willing to openly admit that they [BLEEP] up on, but, it's fixable. I don't want to hear you can't make these types of changes with five weeks left to play. Sure you [BLEEP] can. When something isn't working. You change it the [BLEEP] up. Adapt or die. That's the nature of all sports. Put your aces in their places.
Walker should be moved inside, right in between the tackle and guard or guard and center so he can use his strength to overpower and just "go". Playing upright doesn't look comfortable nor natural to him. Lageman made a point to call that out with Hutchinson in Detroit. Detroit moved him to a more comfortable role and guess what? Plays started happening in his direction. Two interceptions, more sacks, etc.
I keep reading this. Over and over.
(12-06-2022, 02:36 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (12-06-2022, 02:14 PM)Mandeezee Wrote: [ -> ]Because it's still Caldwells scheme. And it's why there's only a "mild" rebellion. The players haven't gone full renegade, there's still hope lol.
My source is a few people who work at the stadium and rub elbows with a few players.
That doesn't make any sense.
It's easy to imagine a GM telling a DC who to put on the field and who to take off. Very hard to imagine a GM telling the DC what each player's assignment will be for each play.
seriously.
what's more, expecting a coach like Doug (who actively defied management at his last stop) to just roll with a GM trying to submarine his team over positional designations on the field.
(12-07-2022, 10:01 AM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ]I find it hard to believe that a GM who is neither a former coach or player is directing the DC or attempting to. The DC reports to the HC. I find it more difficult to believe that a HC of Pederson's pedigree would come into a situation where the GM was allowed to bark orders at his DC. Or in the case that he didn't know what he was getting into when he signed his contract, would not then just shut this crap down immediately once it started. This sounds awfully made up to capitalize on the worst loss of the season and to specifically be fed to the rabid anti-Baalke crowd.
....or Anti-Caldwell crowd for not having the stones to stand up and put players where they'd be earning fat contracts with better on-field production.
it scream of baloney to me, although I didn't want to type baloney.
(12-07-2022, 02:13 PM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ] (12-06-2022, 02:36 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]That doesn't make any sense.
It's easy to imagine a GM telling a DC who to put on the field and who to take off. Very hard to imagine a GM telling the DC what each player's assignment will be for each play.
seriously.
what's more, expecting a coach like Doug (who actively defied management at his last stop) to just roll with a GM trying to submarine his team over positional designations on the field.
Doug came here because he needed a job and it's probably the best of the bottom jobs as there is a long leash from the owner. As far as we know, everyone had issues with Baalke but Doug still said he would take the job. I'm guessing there had to be some agreement that if there were issues Baalke is done. Khan does what he always does and kept Baalke longer than he should have because he likes him (or has some blackmail). After the failed year and terrible defense for the money spent, maybe Khan is being forced to move on from Baalke.
The fact that the report says he may still have some type of job with the Jags just screams Khan is an idiot.
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(12-08-2022, 01:41 AM)p_rushing Wrote: [ -> ] (12-07-2022, 02:13 PM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ]seriously.
what's more, expecting a coach like Doug (who actively defied management at his last stop) to just roll with a GM trying to submarine his team over positional designations on the field.
Doug came here because he needed a job and it's probably the best of the bottom jobs as there is a long leash from the owner. As far as we know, everyone had issues with Baalke but Doug still said he would take the job. I'm guessing there had to be some agreement that if there were issues Baalke is done. Khan does what he always does and kept Baalke longer than he should have because he likes him (or has some blackmail). After the failed year and terrible defense for the money spent, maybe Khan is being forced to move on from Baalke.
The fact that the report says he may still have some type of job with the Jags just screams Khan is an idiot.
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That's Khan's M.O. Since the first wave of hiring and firing people. Maybe it's the Wayne Weaver curse. He made him keep Gene Smith for another year I believe as apart of the agreement to purchase the team.
At any rate. He's never had a full on, complete sweep. Always a holdover or bridge that's maintained while everybody else is laid to waste. It's like being on a ship with a few people that have the plague. He throws the one's over that look the most sickly, but, the one's who have a mild cough, raspy voice, etc. He holds onto them a little bit longer. Even though we all know exactly how it's fixing to shake out in another year.
(12-08-2022, 01:41 AM)p_rushing Wrote: [ -> ] (12-07-2022, 02:13 PM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ]seriously.
what's more, expecting a coach like Doug (who actively defied management at his last stop) to just roll with a GM trying to submarine his team over positional designations on the field.
Doug came here because he needed a job and it's probably the best of the bottom jobs as there is a long leash from the owner. As far as we know, everyone had issues with Baalke but Doug still said he would take the job. I'm guessing there had to be some agreement that if there were issues Baalke is done. Khan does what he always does and kept Baalke longer than he should have because he likes him (or has some blackmail). After the failed year and terrible defense for the money spent, maybe Khan is being forced to move on from Baalke.
The fact that the report says he may still have some type of job with the Jags just screams Khan is an idiot.
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Doug came here for the same reason Urban did. Trevor Lawrence.
(12-08-2022, 09:43 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (12-08-2022, 01:41 AM)p_rushing Wrote: [ -> ]Doug came here because he needed a job and it's probably the best of the bottom jobs as there is a long leash from the owner. As far as we know, everyone had issues with Baalke but Doug still said he would take the job. I'm guessing there had to be some agreement that if there were issues Baalke is done. Khan does what he always does and kept Baalke longer than he should have because he likes him (or has some blackmail). After the failed year and terrible defense for the money spent, maybe Khan is being forced to move on from Baalke.
The fact that the report says he may still have some type of job with the Jags just screams Khan is an idiot.
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Doug came here for the same reason Urban did. Trevor Lawrence.
nah, it's gotta be that he needed to pay his light bill, and chose a pain in the tush GM and impotent owner as the place he wanted to make his living.
Has to be.
Maybe the Jags are actively sabotaging these rookies’ on their 2nd contract.
Purposely put them in positions where they underperform, then re-sign them to a minimum contract. Then finally turn them lose and they wreak havok without breaking the bank, just in time when the Tlaw has developed and the offense is improved
I’m just spitballing here, but the Jags do love playing the long game
(12-06-2022, 01:52 PM)Mandeezee Wrote: [ -> ]There's a mild rebellion happening on the team between Baalke, Caldwell, Lloyd, Allen, Griffin, and some other players. Walker is trying to stay positive.
Firstly, Baalke won't allow Caldwell to do what he want with the players. Meaning even if Caldwell wanted to move Walker inside, when Caldwell was hired it was specified to him he didn't have the power to switch positions.
The players, led by Lloyd and Allen, don't buy Caldwells scheme. Lloyd is in the doghouse and their riding with Muma cause Muma is a "I'll do whatever you tell me coach" type guy.
Allen is clearly pouting and playing half [BLEEP] and Walker is being influenced. We thought Griffin was mad at fans...he's mad at Caldwells scheme too.
Where is the bolded coming from ??
Sounds like complete horse [BLEEP] to me
I'm no fan of Baalke - but I'd bet a crisp G right now Pederson isn't letting that happen.
Teams just don't operate that way
(12-08-2022, 12:18 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (12-06-2022, 01:52 PM)Mandeezee Wrote: [ -> ]There's a mild rebellion happening on the team between Baalke, Caldwell, Lloyd, Allen, Griffin, and some other players. Walker is trying to stay positive.
Firstly, Baalke won't allow Caldwell to do what he want with the players. Meaning even if Caldwell wanted to move Walker inside, when Caldwell was hired it was specified to him he didn't have the power to switch positions.
The players, led by Lloyd and Allen, don't buy Caldwells scheme. Lloyd is in the doghouse and their riding with Muma cause Muma is a "I'll do whatever you tell me coach" type guy.
Allen is clearly pouting and playing half [BLEEP] and Walker is being influenced. We thought Griffin was mad at fans...he's mad at Caldwells scheme too.
Where is the bolded coming from ??
Sounds like complete horse [BLEEP] to me
I'm no fan of Baalke - but I'd bet a crisp G right now Pederson isn't letting that happen.
Teams just don't operate that way
I talk to a guy that works in the stadium, some type of contractor who works in a office right next to where they have meetings. He says they often sit over there and listen to what's going on. He can hear Ballke in his office on phone conversations. And apparently he talks to alot of the coaches regularly.
Ohhh...I forgot too. His brother is a WR on the team.
He talked about a lot of the inner workings of the team. He knows what he's talking about. Even broke down what happened with Shenault and I eat crow for being mad of them trading him now lol.
(12-07-2022, 10:01 AM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ]I find it hard to believe that a GM who is neither a former coach or player is directing the DC or attempting to. The DC reports to the HC. I find it more difficult to believe that a HC of Pederson's pedigree would come into a situation where the GM was allowed to bark orders at his DC. Or in the case that he didn't know what he was getting into when he signed his contract, would not then just shut this crap down immediately once it started. This sounds awfully made up to capitalize on the worst loss of the season and to specifically be fed to the rabid anti-Baalke crowd.
I can be wrong, but wasn't Ballke involved in the hiring process? I can't remember. I know his title is GM, but isn't it like he's someone Shad really values? From what the guy I talk to says, I can see Ballke as having positioned himself. He is often the last one to leave, putting in 20 hour days. While the owner only rarely makes an appearance.
As someone who knows how to politic myself...lol...that's a great way to win the owner over and get points lol. Because my guy says Ballke really is a good guy. He is moody sometimes, but he does speak regularly.
Any rate, isn't Ballke the reason Leftwich wouldn't come? They say Leftwich was coming with a full staff. He had a DC (and it wasn't Caldwell).
If I remember correctly, Pederson didn't have a full staff. It's been a week so I may be wrong or forgot, but I seem to remember him making it seem like the Caldwell hiring...I can't remember how to put it. I'll try: It's like Caldwell was recommended to Pederson and Pederson was ok with it. So Pederson isn't really "tied" to Caldwell per say.
I think Caldwell is gone unless the defense turns the corner the last couple of games
(12-08-2022, 04:53 PM)Mandeezee Wrote: [ -> ] (12-08-2022, 12:18 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Where is the bolded coming from ??
Sounds like complete horse [BLEEP] to me
I'm no fan of Baalke - but I'd bet a crisp G right now Pederson isn't letting that happen.
Teams just don't operate that way
I talk to a guy that works in the stadium, some type of contractor who works in a office right next to where they have meetings. He says they often sit over there and listen to what's going on. He can hear Ballke in his office on phone conversations. And apparently he talks to alot of the coaches regularly.
Ohhh...I forgot too. His brother is a WR on the team.
He talked about a lot of the inner workings of the team. He knows what he's talking about. Even broke down what happened with Shenault and I eat crow for being mad of them trading him now lol.
What happened to Shenault?
(12-08-2022, 05:44 PM)Newton Wrote: [ -> ]I think Caldwell is gone unless the defense turns the corner the last couple of games
Agreed. He has five games to get this defense corrected. The offense has been steadily improving and relatively playing turnover free since London. The biggest point will be whether or not they keep Henry in check twice, Pierce in check, Pollard & Elliot in check and the Jets are a bit of a wildcard right now with Mike White airing it out.
However, the money spent on defense went towards run defenders for the most part. Which is understandable because you play in a run first division. If they [BLEEP] go 1 - 5 in this division or 2 - 4 it's a complete failure on Baalke's evaluating and a complete failure on Caldwell's coaching. They both should be on the hot seat the rest of the way.
(12-08-2022, 04:53 PM)Mandeezee Wrote: [ -> ] (12-08-2022, 12:18 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Where is the bolded coming from ??
Sounds like complete horse [BLEEP] to me
I'm no fan of Baalke - but I'd bet a crisp G right now Pederson isn't letting that happen.
Teams just don't operate that way
I talk to a guy that works in the stadium, some type of contractor who works in a office right next to where they have meetings. He says they often sit over there and listen to what's going on. He can hear Ballke in his office on phone conversations. And apparently he talks to alot of the coaches regularly.
Ohhh...I forgot too. His brother is a WR on the team.
He talked about a lot of the inner workings of the team. He knows what he's talking about. Even broke down what happened with Shenault and I eat crow for being mad of them trading him now lol.
I've known ppl in the building over the years and they talk, but it's likely no one you are describing knows the first thing about what Baalke does or does not do in terms of micro-managing coaches.
I don't buy it. Not at all.
The thought that Pederson would have signed on with that type of authority from the GM is almost comical to me.
It's bizarre if true. And I think it's untrue.
(12-08-2022, 05:15 PM)Mandeezee Wrote: [ -> ] (12-07-2022, 10:01 AM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ]I find it hard to believe that a GM who is neither a former coach or player is directing the DC or attempting to. The DC reports to the HC. I find it more difficult to believe that a HC of Pederson's pedigree would come into a situation where the GM was allowed to bark orders at his DC. Or in the case that he didn't know what he was getting into when he signed his contract, would not then just shut this crap down immediately once it started. This sounds awfully made up to capitalize on the worst loss of the season and to specifically be fed to the rabid anti-Baalke crowd.
I can be wrong, but wasn't Ballke involved in the hiring process? I can't remember. I know his title is GM, but isn't it like he's someone Shad really values? From what the guy I talk to says, I can see Ballke as having positioned himself. He is often the last one to leave, putting in 20 hour days. While the owner only rarely makes an appearance.
As someone who knows how to politic myself...lol...that's a great way to win the owner over and get points lol. Because my guy says Ballke really is a good guy. He is moody sometimes, but he does speak regularly.
Any rate, isn't Ballke the reason Leftwich wouldn't come? They say Leftwich was coming with a full staff. He had a DC (and it wasn't Caldwell).
If I remember correctly, Pederson didn't have a full staff. It's been a week so I may be wrong or forgot, but I seem to remember him making it seem like the Caldwell hiring...I can't remember how to put it. I'll try: It's like Caldwell was recommended to Pederson and Pederson was ok with it. So Pederson isn't really "tied" to Caldwell per say.
Pederson and Caldwell both worked under Andy Reid. And they both worked together under him for a couple of years.
This - again - sounds like you are being told some tall tales my friend.