If this happens, it's all the more reason to arm yourself...... The 2nd amendment was written for just that reason other than to keep the government in check.......
Democrats Want to Abolish Prisons
Following the midterm elections, Democrats gained two new members who have already been outspoken in their progressive beliefs.
Rep.-elect Summer Lee (D-PA) has openly advocated for socialist policies.
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/saraharnol...4zIAKrjqEU
Relax. They will either just rename prisons or redefine abolish.
...“Instead of 'thanking' Black women, Black voters, and especially, Black organizers... give us the investments we need and deserve, redistribute wealth,...
'Earn' is not in their vocabulary.
To be fair, I don't think most of us could "earn" in some of the same situations black folks face in the inner city. The infrastructure is not there for them to succeed. These women have legitimate complaints. I just think they have the wrong solution.
(12-09-2022, 11:20 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]To be fair, I don't think most of us could "earn" in some of the same situations black folks face in the inner city. The infrastructure is not there for them to succeed. These women have legitimate complaints. I just think they have the wrong solution.
Agree, but nothing is keeping them in the inner city. If they're living in a place that offers no opportunity, then move. People do it all the time. Just look at our southern border.
That's hard to do, man. You need context, motive, and opportunity. Context is the most important of those three, and it's virtually non-existent in that culture. How do you move to something you've never known without some kind of force pushing you in that direction?
(12-09-2022, 11:39 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]That's hard to do, man. You need context, motive, and opportunity. Context is the most important of those three, and it's virtually non-existent in that culture. How do you move to something you've never known without some kind of force pushing you in that direction?
My wife fled a military coup in Peru in 1971. She came here by herself with nothing. Barely knew English. Found an ESL program thru a church where she learned over a two month period, then got a job. Then enrolled in JR college. Worked her way thru. Eventually earned two college degrees. 52 years later, she's about to retire from her 30 career as a Physician Assistant. Now, you're telling me that minority inner-city Americans, already in this country, who already know the language, and in this day and age have many many more advantages than my wife did can't do the same? Bull. They don't lack opportunity, they lack motivation.
Exceptionality is not the norm, and it's naive to expect that attribute in others. Your wife sounds like a remarkable woman, but what was driving her? Do you think that trait is common in everyone? Why isn't everyone in Peru an middle class American now? Do they just lack the motivation to move to America? Where does one get motivation?
Why isn't everyone a banker? I mean... it's great pay. All you need to do is bootstraps, right? Why aren't we all millionaires? The opportunity is there. We just have to work harder, right? What are we complaining about the government for if it's all that easy?
The more I learn about this Scott Maxwell Frost guy the less I like. He's the next district over so I didn't learn about him during the election. But the local news was really fawning over, "Look how young! And Bernie likes him!"
Didn't bother to tell us he started at Valencia and never finished. When I turned 26 I had two degrees. And I don't consider that enough to be qualified as a Congressman. This guy has nothing but classes towards an AA degree and an arrest record.
(12-09-2022, 12:08 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]Exceptionality is not the norm, and it's naive to expect that attribute in others. Your wife sounds like a remarkable woman, but what was driving her? Do you think that trait is common in everyone? Why isn't everyone in Peru an middle class American now? Do they just lack the motivation to move to America? Where does one get motivation?
Why isn't everyone a banker? I mean... it's great pay. All you need to do is bootstraps, right? Why aren't we all millionaires? The opportunity is there. We just have to work harder, right? What are we complaining about the government for if it's all that easy?
I guess my overall point is that opportunity is there if you work hard. You can make your own luck and create your own opportunity, you can aspire to something greater. And of course not everyone is going to succeed. I wasn't implying that. But the quote by Representative Lee is that there is no opportunity without it being given to you free via wealth distribution by the government. And that's simply not true. Plenty of people have excelled in life without the help of the government and its poverty enabling give-away policies.
(12-09-2022, 12:15 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]The more I learn about this Scott Maxwell Frost guy the less I like. He's the next district over so I didn't learn about him during the election. But the local news was really fawning over, "Look how young! And Bernie likes him!"
Didn't bother to tell us he started at Valencia and never finished. When I turned 26 I had two degrees. And I don't consider that enough to be qualified as a Congressman. This guy has nothing but classes towards an AA degree and an arrest record.
College is overrated, especially today.
That being said, I see a political meltdown in that guy's future.
We could eliminate about half the prison population just by giving the death penalty to a bunch of lifers we're keeping around for no reason.
(12-09-2022, 12:19 PM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ] (12-09-2022, 12:08 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]Exceptionality is not the norm, and it's naive to expect that attribute in others. Your wife sounds like a remarkable woman, but what was driving her? Do you think that trait is common in everyone? Why isn't everyone in Peru an middle class American now? Do they just lack the motivation to move to America? Where does one get motivation?
Why isn't everyone a banker? I mean... it's great pay. All you need to do is bootstraps, right? Why aren't we all millionaires? The opportunity is there. We just have to work harder, right? What are we complaining about the government for if it's all that easy?
I guess my overall point is that opportunity is there if you work hard. You can make your own luck and create your own opportunity, you can aspire to something greater. And of course not everyone is going to succeed. I wasn't implying that. But the quote by Representative Lee is that there is no opportunity without it being given to you free via wealth distribution by the government. And that's simply not true. Plenty of people have excelled in life without the help of the government and its poverty enabling give-away policies.
(12-09-2022, 12:15 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]The more I learn about this Scott Maxwell Frost guy the less I like. He's the next district over so I didn't learn about him during the election. But the local news was really fawning over, "Look how young! And Bernie likes him!"
Didn't bother to tell us he started at Valencia and never finished. When I turned 26 I had two degrees. And I don't consider that enough to be qualified as a Congressman. This guy has nothing but classes towards an AA degree and an arrest record.
College is overrated, especially today.
That being said, I see a political meltdown in that guy's future.
I think there are plenty of people born into poor inner city families in the US who end up having the drive and success that your wife had. It's just not many of them. Just like most Latin American immigrants don't end up in high paying careers, even though some, like your wife, do.
We just have this illusion over decades that the inner city always sucks and always has degenerates, and we don't see the churn that some people pull up out of that life while others fall in.
(12-09-2022, 11:39 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]That's hard to do, man. You need context, motive, and opportunity. Context is the most important of those three, and it's virtually non-existent in that culture. How do you move to something you've never known without some kind of force pushing you in that direction?
Force works and in two directions, pushing and pulling.
Sure. And I don't disagree that there are individuals who will be born with the right intrinsic motivators, that also got the right leads in life, and make it out of the ghetto by making different choices. That said, the same can be true for people moving from middle class to upper middle class. The opportunities are there, but it's not easy to completely buck everything you know, adopt completely countercultural views and practices, and discipline yourself into a different class. You have to completely go against the grain of your entire experience, and that is VERY difficult. If it wasn't, you'd see a lot more people moving into upper class, and that doesn't happen, either. Unless the people in those board were able to do that, it seems a bit shortsighted to condemn others who aren't able to overcome a very similar set of circumstances.
(12-09-2022, 11:51 AM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ] (12-09-2022, 11:39 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]That's hard to do, man. You need context, motive, and opportunity. Context is the most important of those three, and it's virtually non-existent in that culture. How do you move to something you've never known without some kind of force pushing you in that direction?
My wife fled a military coup in Peru in 1971. She came here by herself with nothing. Barely knew English. Found an ESL program thru a church where she learned over a two month period, then got a job. Then enrolled in JR college. Worked her way thru. Eventually earned two college degrees. 52 years later, she's about to retire from her 30 career as a Physician Assistant. Now, you're telling me that minority inner-city Americans, already in this country, who already know the language, and in this day and age have many many more advantages than my wife did can't do the same? Bull. They don't lack opportunity, they lack motivation.
Most black women are oppressed by their own. Victim mentality is a real thing. You don't necessarily see a lack of.... powerful or influential black women because their industry suppresses them, it's that they're never told it's a choice. Or they're raised by parents who never instilled a work ethic or encouraged them to succeed in anything.
There's a lot that goes into shaping how a person acts and reacts to life situations and opportunities. Especially women. Your wife sounds like an exceptional woman and good for her that she accomplished what she has but not every woman is built that way mentally. Not all men are either.
For reasons I can't talk about here I was never told college or trade school or anything like that was an option. I was never encouraged to succeed or excel at anything. I was never taught to set goals or how attain them. The only reason I knew how to write checks or knew about balancing a checkbook was from classes we had to take in high school back in the day like Home Economics. I was 200% unprepared for even the basics of life skills after I left home. The Army saved me from being a completely useless person in society. I joined because it's what I always wanted to do and I had no idea it would seriously save me from being a useless human being.
(12-09-2022, 10:10 PM)americus 2.0 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-09-2022, 11:51 AM)NewJagsCity Wrote: [ -> ]My wife fled a military coup in Peru in 1971. She came here by herself with nothing. Barely knew English. Found an ESL program thru a church where she learned over a two month period, then got a job. Then enrolled in JR college. Worked her way thru. Eventually earned two college degrees. 52 years later, she's about to retire from her 30 career as a Physician Assistant. Now, you're telling me that minority inner-city Americans, already in this country, who already know the language, and in this day and age have many many more advantages than my wife did can't do the same? Bull. They don't lack opportunity, they lack motivation.
Most black women are oppressed by their own. Victim mentality is a real thing. You don't necessarily see a lack of.... powerful or influential black women because their industry suppresses them, it's that they're never told it's a choice. Or they're raised by parents who never instilled a work ethic or encouraged them to succeed in anything.
There's a lot that goes into shaping how a person acts and reacts to life situations and opportunities. Especially women. Your wife sounds like an exceptional woman and good for her that she accomplished what she has but not every woman is built that way mentally. Not all men are either.
For reasons I can't talk about here I was never told college or trade school or anything like that was an option. I was never encouraged to succeed or excel at anything. I was never taught to set goals or how attain them. The only reason I knew how to write checks or knew about balancing a checkbook was from classes we had to take in high school back in the day like Home Economics. I was 200% unprepared for even the basics of life skills after I left home. The Army saved me from being a completely useless person in society. I joined because it's what I always wanted to do and I had no idea it would seriously save me from being a useless human being.
Similar to my situation. My father was an alcoholic who never put any priority on providing for his family. My mother was ground down from years of struggling to raise kids with a crippled hand, an abusive husband and no money. However, my father wasn't a complete bastard. He was highly intelligent, college educated and instilled an appreciation of reading, learning and critical thinking skills into us kids. He was highly capable of earning a good living but along with his alcoholism was inflicted with a deep sense of antipathy towards responsibility and what people would consider a normal life. I only ever remember him working a regular tax-paying job when I was very young. He hadn't filed a tax return in decades and never considered registering a car or keeping a current driver's license. We always existed on the edge of society.
College was a fairy tale. However, I always knew there was a better life out there. Like you, I had little knowledge of life skills until I joined the Navy. It was the best thing that ever happened to me and I have to thank my brother who came home on leave, took one look at me and said, "We need to go talk to the recruiter." I figured why not, with no intention of joining, and came home that afternoon with a 6-year enlistment contract. They got me good. Lol.
(12-09-2022, 02:33 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]Sure. And I don't disagree that there are individuals who will be born with the right intrinsic motivators, that also got the right leads in life, and make it out of the ghetto by making different choices. That said, the same can be true for people moving from middle class to upper middle class. The opportunities are there, but it's not easy to completely buck everything you know, adopt completely countercultural views and practices, and discipline yourself into a different class. You have to completely go against the grain of your entire experience, and that is VERY difficult. If it wasn't, you'd see a lot more people moving into upper class, and that doesn't happen, either. Unless the people in those board were able to do that, it seems a bit shortsighted to condemn others who aren't able to overcome a very similar set of circumstances.
I don't know if you're intending it, but when you talk about moving middle class moving to upper middle class, even if every single person can, by definition most will not, otherwise the term upper middle has no meaning when compared to middle. Just like only 1% of us can ever be in the top 1%.
When you talk about moving out of the ghetto, that's probably an objective achievement. Ghettos can be eliminated and redeveloped. But if you talk about moving out of the bottom 10%, by mathematical definition someone else is moving in while you're moving out, even if both of your lives are improving.
Overall this stuff is hard to talk about, But it's much easier for the Reagan type rhetoric of "a rising tide lifts all boats" to reach the masses than the Obama type rhetoric of "let's spread the wealth." Which is good. Neither motto tells the whole story but Reagan's gets closer to the truth.
You're missing the point again. It's an equivalent analogy. It's the reason you would be quick to claim that Trump wasn't self-made. It can happen and does happen that middle class move into upper middle/upper class every day. It's not evidence that everyone can do it. It takes the right set of circumstances and those do not exist in the inner city. I blame failed democratic policies for that, but you just keep believing.
All you need to do is buy low and sell high, right? That's it?
As usual, the headline is false. Democrats don't want to abolish prisons. It's like saying, "Republicans admire Hitler." I'm sure you can find one or two, but it would still be false to say Republicans admire Hitler.
Can't we have little more honesty around here?
(12-09-2022, 11:27 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (12-09-2022, 02:33 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]Sure. And I don't disagree that there are individuals who will be born with the right intrinsic motivators, that also got the right leads in life, and make it out of the ghetto by making different choices. That said, the same can be true for people moving from middle class to upper middle class. The opportunities are there, but it's not easy to completely buck everything you know, adopt completely countercultural views and practices, and discipline yourself into a different class. You have to completely go against the grain of your entire experience, and that is VERY difficult. If it wasn't, you'd see a lot more people moving into upper class, and that doesn't happen, either. Unless the people in those board were able to do that, it seems a bit shortsighted to condemn others who aren't able to overcome a very similar set of circumstances.
I don't know if you're intending it, but when you talk about moving middle class moving to upper middle class, even if every single person can, by definition most will not, otherwise the term upper middle has no meaning when compared to middle. Just like only 1% of us can ever be in the top 1%.
When you talk about moving out of the ghetto, that's probably an objective achievement. Ghettos can be eliminated and redeveloped. But if you talk about moving out of the bottom 10%, by mathematical definition someone else is moving in while you're moving out, even if both of your lives are improving.
Overall this stuff is hard to talk about, But it's much easier for the Reagan type rhetoric of "a rising tide lifts all boats" to reach the masses than the Obama type rhetoric of "let's spread the wealth." Which is good. Neither motto tells the whole story but Reagan's gets closer to the truth.
A ghetto is just a physical location, and the underlying problem is far more complex. Moving a person out of the "hood", doesn't take the "hood" out of the person. Aaron Hernandez is a great example.