(03-25-2023, 06:21 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]You always bring up his arm length when thats the least of mybworries for a DT. If he busts ill change my opinion on arm length for DTs and I was wrong. If he turns out to be good it's clear you were wrong. We will come back to this
Arm length isn't brought up for no reason, it's legit. I'm a fan of undersized 3 Techs, because low man wins in the trenches. However, everybody that Kancey compares to who have been great as undersized iDLs, don't have arm lengths as short as his.
He compares to undersized guys that you brought up in Donald and Randle, but also guys you left out like Warren Sapp and Geno Atkins. All undersized, but dominated as 3 Techs. The main difference is and yes you guessed it, their arm length. Shocker right?
Donald 32 5/8" arm length
Sapp 32.75" arm length
Atkins 32" arm length
Randle I couldn't find his arm length off a quick search, but I'd put money down that it's definitely over 32"
Kancey 30 5/8" arm length
One of these are clearly not like the others in an area that does matter when it comes to trench play.
And yes, there's more that comes into play than arm length alone, but there's a reason why there's basically never been an iDL player who has been good with an arm length like Kancey's. Maybe he can buck the trend, but history isn't on his side.
I think Kancey is closer to Ed Oliver as a prospect than any of the above and even then Oliver still has more than a 1" arm length on Kancey.
We also don't know how strong Kancey is because he didn't bench. People with short arms are favored in the bench, yet he didn't do it. If he's nursing an injury that didn't allow him to bench, that's fine, if not he's weak and that's why he didn't bench. Which would be another negative for somebody his size. All those others guys I listed above put up 30+ reps on the bench with longer arms.
(03-26-2023, 04:56 AM)Eric1 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-25-2023, 06:21 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]You always bring up his arm length when thats the least of mybworries for a DT. If he busts ill change my opinion on arm length for DTs and I was wrong. If he turns out to be good it's clear you were wrong. We will come back to this
Arm length isn't brought up for no reason, it's legit. I'm a fan of undersized 3 Techs, because low man wins in the trenches. However, everybody that Kancey compares to who have been great as undersized iDLs, don't have arm lengths as short as his.
He compares to undersized guys that you brought up in Donald and Randle, but also guys you left out like Warren Sapp and Geno Atkins. All undersized, but dominated as 3 Techs. The main difference is and yes you guessed it, their arm length. Shocker right?
Donald 32 5/8" arm length
Sapp 32.75" arm length
Atkins 32" arm length
Randle I couldn't find his arm length off a quick search, but I'd put money down that it's definitely over 32"
Kancey 30 5/8" arm length
One of these are clearly not like the others in an area that does matter when it comes to trench play.
And yes, there's more that comes into play than arm length alone, but there's a reason why there's basically never been an iDL player who has been good with an arm length like Kancey's. Maybe he can buck the trend, but history isn't on his side.
I think Kancey is closer to Ed Oliver as a prospect than any of the above and even then Oliver still has more than a 1" arm length on Kancey.
We also don't know how strong Kancey is because he didn't bench. People with short arms are favored in the bench, yet he didn't do it. If he's nursing an injury that didn't allow him to bench, that's fine, if not he's weak and that's why he didn't bench. Which would be another negative for somebody his size. All those others guys I listed above put up 30+ reps on the bench with longer arms.
Kancey needs a lot of things to go right for him to be a good DT in the NFL.
One of those things, like you mentioned, is to be the first successful DT with arms that short. I have a hard team being so confident in a player to be the first to do something.
(03-26-2023, 04:56 AM)Eric1 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-25-2023, 06:21 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]You always bring up his arm length when thats the least of mybworries for a DT. If he busts ill change my opinion on arm length for DTs and I was wrong. If he turns out to be good it's clear you were wrong. We will come back to this
Arm length isn't brought up for no reason, it's legit. I'm a fan of undersized 3 Techs, because low man wins in the trenches. However, everybody that Kancey compares to who have been great as undersized iDLs, don't have arm lengths as short as his.
He compares to undersized guys that you brought up in Donald and Randle, but also guys you left out like Warren Sapp and Geno Atkins. All undersized, but dominated as 3 Techs. The main difference is and yes you guessed it, their arm length. Shocker right?
Donald 32 5/8" arm length
Sapp 32.75" arm length
Atkins 32" arm length
Randle I couldn't find his arm length off a quick search, but I'd put money down that it's definitely over 32"
Kancey 30 5/8" arm length
One of these are clearly not like the others in an area that does matter when it comes to trench play.
And yes, there's more that comes into play than arm length alone, but there's a reason why there's basically never been an iDL player who has been good with an arm length like Kancey's. Maybe he can buck the trend, but history isn't on his side.
I think Kancey is closer to Ed Oliver as a prospect than any of the above and even then Oliver still has more than a 1" arm length on Kancey.
We also don't know how strong Kancey is because he didn't bench. People with short arms are favored in the bench, yet he didn't do it. If he's nursing an injury that didn't allow him to bench, that's fine, if not he's weak and that's why he didn't bench. Which would be another negative for somebody his size. All those others guys I listed above put up 30+ reps on the bench with longer arms.
Probably because there have only been like 4 players that have had as short arms as Kancey's. So the odds are most definitely against it. Kancey is better pass rusher than Oliver was imo. Atkins is heavier and Sapp has always looked heavier as well and both played at 300 lbs. I don't see Kancey ever playing at 300 lbs. Like i said, we will see how important arm length is for a DT when Kancey gets drafted. If he's a bust I'll change my opinion on it.
For some reason I still think we take Bresee lol. High risk high reward player. If we do take Bresee though and we hit on that pick I think he will be a perennial Pro Bowler and will fill the biggest need on this team, interior pass rusher. Not many players have the upside as Bresee does in this draft. He wouldn't be as much of a project as Bryan was. Bryan was never good imo and I'm a Florida fan. I hated that pick. I'm 50/50 on the Bresee pick. Another Bryan at DT, just hopefully he pans out
Drafting Bresse or Kancey would allow us to move on from Fatukasi contract next year
(03-26-2023, 10:29 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (03-26-2023, 08:54 AM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]For some reason I still think we take Bresee lol. High risk high reward player. If we do take Bresee though and we hit on that pick I think he will be a perennial Pro Bowler and will fill the biggest need on this team, interior pass rusher. Not many players have the upside as Bresee does in this draft. He wouldn't be as much of a project as Bryan was. Bryan was never good imo and I'm a Florida fan. I hated that pick. I'm 50/50 on the Bresee pick. Another Bryan at DT, just hopefully he pans out
https://www.duvalpride.com/showthread.ph...pid1184652
What does that post have to do with what i just said? I had hope for him like I do every Jags player but it doesn't change the fact that I hated the pick. He was never good at Florida and was a workout warrior. He had the athletic tools and traits but just couldn't ever pit it together.
(03-26-2023, 11:08 AM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]You're the one that expected him to get pressures at a 7% clip and a 11 to 1 pressure to sack ratio lol
https://www.duvalpride.com/showthread.ph...ight=Bryan
Hahaha
He, ummm, did not do that. LOL
I was calling for 50 pressures. What magical teal koolaid was I high on?
I think he got 12 pressures that season.
(03-26-2023, 08:54 AM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]For some reason I still think we take Bresee lol. High risk high reward player. If we do take Bresee though and we hit on that pick I think he will be a perennial Pro Bowler and will fill the biggest need on this team, interior pass rusher. Not many players have the upside as Bresee does in this draft. He wouldn't be as much of a project as Bryan was. Bryan was never good imo and I'm a Florida fan. I hated that pick. I'm 50/50 on the Bresee pick. Another Bryan at DT, just hopefully he pans out
We have enough project picks already. Pick someone who can come in and play.
(03-30-2023, 10:40 AM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ] (03-30-2023, 10:03 AM)Newton Wrote: [ -> ]We have enough project picks already. Pick someone who can come in and play.
Like who?
Walker and Chaison just to name a couple.
(03-30-2023, 11:00 AM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ] (03-30-2023, 10:40 AM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Like who?
Walker and Chaison just to name a couple.
I was asking him who he thinks we should pick that could come in and play right away. Torrence I think could step in day 1 and be a nice upgrade on the oline
(03-30-2023, 11:15 AM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ] (03-30-2023, 11:00 AM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ]Walker and Chaison just to name a couple.
I was asking him who he thinks we should pick that could come in and play right away. Torrence I think could step in day 1 and be a nice upgrade on the oline
Torrence or any of the top OTs could be day one starters.
(03-30-2023, 12:28 PM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ] (03-30-2023, 11:15 AM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]I was asking him who he thinks we should pick that could come in and play right away. Torrence I think could step in day 1 and be a nice upgrade on the oline
Torrence or any of the top OTs could be day one starters.
I'm not sure if Bresse would be a project or not. He was All ACC his freshman year and I think could possibly be good day 1. So you think we should go oline in the first?
(03-30-2023, 12:53 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ] (03-30-2023, 12:28 PM)Dimson Wrote: [ -> ]Torrence or any of the top OTs could be day one starters.
I'm not sure if Bresse would be a project or not. He was All ACC his freshman year and I think could possibly be good day 1. So you think we should go oline in the first?
My top 2 for day 1 is skoronski or totrence, however I highly expect them to be taken before our turn
(03-30-2023, 04:19 PM)StrayaJag Wrote: [ -> ] (03-30-2023, 12:53 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not sure if Bresse would be a project or not. He was All ACC his freshman year and I think could possibly be good day 1. So you think we should go oline in the first?
My top 2 for day 1 is skoronski or totrence, however I highly expect them to be taken before our turn
My top offensive line pick would be Broderick Jones. He could play guard for 1 season prior to moving to right tackle. Skoronski would be my 2nd choice. While it's unlikely that either player will be available, I've seen Jones drop as low as the high teens in mock drafts- so who knows. Skoronski's short arms and less than ideal measureables could drop him to the 20's despite the fact most mocks have him going much higher. Torrence would be a solid pick and day 1 starter.
If the Jaguars don't go with an offensive lineman in round 1, they couldn't go wrong with either Deonte Banks or Brian Branch for the secondary. Branch may not be the "sexiest" pick, but the guy can play anywhere in the secondary and never misses a tackle. His blitzing ability would be something Mike Caldwell could utilize often. I have a gut feeling Branch will drop due to his 40 time as well as primarily playing nickel or safety. In my opinion, any team getting him in the mid-20's would possibly end up with the steal of this draft.
(03-30-2023, 04:48 PM)jaglou53 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-30-2023, 04:19 PM)StrayaJag Wrote: [ -> ]My top 2 for day 1 is skoronski or totrence, however I highly expect them to be taken before our turn
My top offensive line pick would be Broderick Jones. He could play guard for 1 season prior to moving to right tackle. Skoronski would be my 2nd choice. While it's unlikely that either player will be available, I've seen Jones drop as low as the high teens in mock drafts- so who knows. Skoronski's short arms and less than ideal measureables could drop him to the 20's despite the fact most mocks have him going much higher. Torrence would be a solid pick and day 1 starter.
If the Jaguars don't go with an offensive lineman in round 1, they couldn't go wrong with either Deonte Banks or Brian Branch for the secondary. Branch may not be the "sexiest" pick, but the guy can play anywhere in the secondary and never misses a tackle. His blitzing ability would be something Mike Caldwell could utilize often. I have a gut feeling Branch will drop due to his 40 time as well as primarily playing nickel or safety. In my opinion, any team getting him in the mid-20's would possibly end up with the steal of this draft.
I have a hunch the Jags really like Branch