(08-01-2023, 06:50 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]They really do want a civil war.
Lol .... need to wait for those idiots of Jan 6 to get out of jail first, prior to proceeding with any civil war. They are probably clamoring for their safe space by now ...
(08-01-2023, 10:17 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Full indictment doc here:
https://www.democracydocket.com/wp-conte...ment-1.pdf
Perhaps you should read the first sentence of the 3rd paragraph in the introduction.
"3. The Defendant had a right, like every American, to speak publicly about the election and even to claim, falsely, that there had been outcome-determinative fraud during the election and that he had won."
The defense moves for summary judgement.
(08-02-2023, 09:50 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]The judges for these federal cases are selected randomly.
https://www.axios.com/2023/08/01/trump-i...ya-chutkan
I think Trump is in deep deep trouble with this case, and this judge.
Trump posts a racist attack on the judge in 3...2...1...
Does Trump regularly post racist attacks?
(08-02-2023, 10:11 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (08-02-2023, 09:50 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]The judges for these federal cases are selected randomly.
https://www.axios.com/2023/08/01/trump-i...ya-chutkan
I think Trump is in deep deep trouble with this case, and this judge.
Trump posts a racist attack on the judge in 3...2...1...
Does Trump regularly post racist attacks?
OK, I withdraw that sentence in an effort to avoid diverting the thread.
Did you read the indictment? It's pretty devastating.
(08-02-2023, 10:14 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (08-02-2023, 10:11 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]Does Trump regularly post racist attacks?
OK, I withdraw that sentence in an effort to avoid diverting the thread.
Did you read the indictment? It's pretty devastating.
Do you not want to divert the thread or can you not back up your emotive assertion?
Of course the indictment sounds devastating. Did you think politically motivated DAs would indict him solely on charges that he’s a mean tweeting poopy head? Now let’s see if they can prove it in a court of law. My guess is the end result will be muted.
(08-01-2023, 06:50 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]They really do want a civil war.
So I am genuinely curious. How do you think a Civil War would happen in this country? What would it look like?
(08-02-2023, 10:24 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (08-02-2023, 10:14 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]OK, I withdraw that sentence in an effort to avoid diverting the thread.
Did you read the indictment? It's pretty devastating.
Do you not want to divert the thread or can you not back up your emotive assertion?
Of course the indictment sounds devastating. Did you think politically motivated DAs would indict him solely on charges that he’s a mean tweeting poopy head? Now let’s see if they can prove it in a court of law. My guess is the end result will be muted.
No, I don't want to go 15 pages on "is Trump a racist" when that's really off-topic. I'll admit it was a smart [BLEEP] remark. But I do expect him to attack the judge momentarily.
(08-02-2023, 09:50 AM)Sneakers Wrote: [ -> ] (08-01-2023, 10:17 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Full indictment doc here:
https://www.democracydocket.com/wp-conte...ment-1.pdf
Perhaps you should read the first sentence of the 3rd paragraph in the introduction.
"3. The Defendant had a right, like every American, to speak publicly about the election and even to claim, falsely, that there had been outcome-determinative fraud during the election and that he had won."
The defense moves for summary judgement.
Free speech ends when it incites others to commit crimes.
"I wish my wife were dead," - protected speech.
"You need to kill my wife for me, or bad things will happen to you." - not protected.
(08-02-2023, 10:44 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-02-2023, 09:50 AM)Sneakers Wrote: [ -> ]Perhaps you should read the first sentence of the 3rd paragraph in the introduction.
"3. The Defendant had a right, like every American, to speak publicly about the election and even to claim, falsely, that there had been outcome-determinative fraud during the election and that he had won."
The defense moves for summary judgement.
Free speech ends when it incites others to commit crimes.
"I wish my wife were dead," - protected speech.
"You need to kill my wife for me, or bad things will happen to you." - not protected.
What did Trump say to incite others to commit crimes?
(08-02-2023, 10:50 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (08-02-2023, 10:44 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Free speech ends when it incites others to commit crimes.
"I wish my wife were dead," - protected speech.
"You need to kill my wife for me, or bad things will happen to you." - not protected.
What did Trump say to incite others to commit crimes?
All of it, Katie. The entire Stop the Steal rally.
But these charges are more on the fraud angle, where the actions of others don't matter. The fact that he knew he was lying is what matters. Knowingly lying is also not protected speech.
(08-02-2023, 11:04 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (08-02-2023, 11:01 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]All of it, Katie. The entire Stop the Steal rally.
But these charges are more on the fraud angle, where the actions of others don't matter. The fact that he knew he was lying is what matters. Knowingly lying is also not protected speech.
You’re deflecting again.
From what? Make the point you think I'm avoiding.
Unlike probably a lot of you, I have read the indictment, all 45 pages, and it largely seems to hinge on the idea that Trump knew he was lying about election fraud. Hence all the citations of when his closest advisors told him there was no evidence of election fraud. I assume all those people will be called as witnesses to the fact that they told him he was wrong.
His only defense to that seems to be that he continued to believe what he was saying, in spite of what he was being told in private. Which leads to a defense strategy of painting Trump as either an idiot or that he is insane. Or both.
Here's what blew me away at the time. Trump told his supporters not to vote by mail, and instead vote on election day. The Democrats were encouraging mail-in voting. Several states passed laws that they could not start counting mail in votes until the polls closed on election day. So anyone with any sense at all knew that there was a good chance Trump would have the lead on election night, but Biden would take the lead when the mail in votes were actually counted. But when that happened, Trump went on TV and whined about how he didn't understand how he could have had the lead on election night but Biden would then pull ahead when the mail in votes were counted. I was flabbergasted at that statement. Either he was incredibly stupid, or he was telling yet another bald-faced lie.
(08-02-2023, 11:11 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-02-2023, 11:04 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]You’re deflecting again.
From what? Make the point you think I'm avoiding.
What did Trump say to incite others to commit crimes?
(08-02-2023, 08:48 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]It's interesting to me that the same people who claim Trump is a clinical narcissist also believe all of his intentions are Machiavellian. He is an ego-driven narcissist. Even if what you claimed was true, that the election was on the up and up (which I believe is the real lie), an ego-driven narcissist will be in complete denial about the results. All of the "intent" is manufactured. I'm happy to be proven wrong. I honestly couldn't care less about Trump, and my ego is not attached to his success.
So that's his defense? That he can't distinguish truth from falsehood? I admit, it's an interesting defense. "I throw myself on the mercy of the court because I am bat-[BLEEP] crazy."
(08-02-2023, 11:19 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (08-02-2023, 11:11 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]From what? Make the point you think I'm avoiding.
What did Trump say to incite others to commit crimes?
Quote:And again, most people would stand there at 9 o'clock in the evening and say I want to thank you very much, and they go off to some other life. But I said something's wrong here, something is really wrong, can have happened.
And we fight. We fight like hell. And if you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore.
Our exciting adventures and boldest endeavors have not yet begun. My fellow Americans, for our movement, for our children, and for our beloved country.
And I say this despite all that's happened. The best is yet to come.
So we're going to, we're going to walk down Pennsylvania Avenue. I love Pennsylvania Avenue. And we're going to the Capitol, and we're going to try and give.
The Democrats are hopeless — they never vote for anything. Not even one vote. But we're going to try and give our Republicans, the weak ones because the strong ones don't need any of our help. We're going to try and give them the kind of pride and boldness that they need to take back our country.
So let's walk down Pennsylvania Avenue.
But this is all digression - these are not Jack Smith's charges, so I went off topic and I apologize.
(08-02-2023, 11:19 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (08-02-2023, 11:11 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]From what? Make the point you think I'm avoiding.
What did Trump say to incite others to commit crimes?
He said to peacefully and patriotically march.. Just horrible. He also participated in 20+ phone calls on his son's business deals.. 10% to The Big Guy!!
That's how Trump became so wealthy!!