Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

(09-25-2023, 11:14 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-25-2023, 10:50 AM)The Drifter Wrote: [ -> ]In my area, builders PAY the local officials to NOT have to build/offer affordable housing/apartments. That's the major problem here.........

That's obviously not good.  Does the money go to the local government or to the officials?

In my neck of the woods, who the hell knows.........

Could give them all ghillie suits and let them blend in..

Where's that smell coming from?

(09-23-2023, 09:06 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]Many big cities have a problem with homeless people all over the place, camping on the sidewalk, doing drugs, wandering around acting crazy, and generally being a nuisance and health hazard.  

If you were king, what would you do about it?  

I would pass a law making it illegal to panhandle, loiter, camp, or sleep on public property, and I'd build homeless shelters away from the city center.  

Anything wrong with that?

Let me qualify my question below by stating I thought of the same scenario as you provided above (shelters outside of the city) but it does come with some issues as people could take advantage of the system.  With that being said .....

Question:  What is the living arrangements in your homeless shelter concept?   I mean, can anyone simply declare themselves homeless and get free room and board in your shelters away from the city?   I mean, why work if someone is going to give you free rent and food throughout ones lifetime.   I foresee a really nice hostel in your scenario, which a lot of college grads simply declaring themselves homeless.  Any chance you can provide free transportation as well?

(09-25-2023, 11:30 AM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-23-2023, 09:06 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]Many big cities have a problem with homeless people all over the place, camping on the sidewalk, doing drugs, wandering around acting crazy, and generally being a nuisance and health hazard.  

If you were king, what would you do about it?  

I would pass a law making it illegal to panhandle, loiter, camp, or sleep on public property, and I'd build homeless shelters away from the city center.  

Anything wrong with that?

Let me qualify my question below by stating I thought of the same scenario as you provided above (shelters outside of the city) but it does come with some issues as people could take advantage of the system.  With that being said .....

Question:  What is the living arrangements in your homeless shelter concept?   I mean, can anyone simply declare themselves homeless and get free room and board in your shelters away from the city?   I mean, why work if someone is going to give you free rent and food throughout ones lifetime.   I foresee a really nice hostel in your scenario, which a lot of college grads simply declaring themselves homeless.  Any chance you can provide free transportation as well?

There is one Shelter in my town. The rule stated is that you're allowed 90 days only. However, if you're working and can prove that you're saving for a place, they'll let you extend the time. Now, I did a little bit of snooping around and found out that a few of the people there, that don't work or on any kind of assistance like SSDI, have been there for 3 years or more. They'll eat breakfast/lunch at the mission 2 blocks away and dinner at the community center then use the shelter for a crash pad. That to me, is abusing the system and keeping people who may only be in the situation for temporary, from getting a bed and getting out of the situation sooner. There will always be people like that, I have no idea what the solution might be other than throw them out on their [BLEEP] after the time limit is reached......

(09-25-2023, 11:40 AM)The Drifter Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-25-2023, 11:30 AM)HURRICANE!!! Wrote: [ -> ]Let me qualify my question below by stating I thought of the same scenario as you provided above (shelters outside of the city) but it does come with some issues as people could take advantage of the system.  With that being said .....

Question:  What is the living arrangements in your homeless shelter concept?   I mean, can anyone simply declare themselves homeless and get free room and board in your shelters away from the city?   I mean, why work if someone is going to give you free rent and food throughout ones lifetime.   I foresee a really nice hostel in your scenario, which a lot of college grads simply declaring themselves homeless.  Any chance you can provide free transportation as well?

There is one Shelter in my town. The rule stated is that you're allowed 90 days only. However, if you're working and can prove that you're saving for a place, they'll let you extend the time. Now, I did a little bit of snooping around and found out that a few of the people there, that don't work or on any kind of assistance like SSDI, have been there for 3 years or more. They'll eat breakfast/lunch at the mission 2 blocks away and dinner at the community center then use the shelter for a crash pad. That to me, is abusing the system and keeping people who may only be in the situation for temporary, from getting a bed and getting out of the situation sooner. There will always be people like that, I have no idea what the solution might be other than throw them out on their [BLEEP] after the time limit is reached......

This is quite insightful and definitely aligns with the fact that most really good humanitarian efforts are made complicated by people taking advantage of the system.  As such, they get shut down or never get off the ground.   Your example above probably only accounts for the homeless population that have real adversities in life.  Just imagine if we build compounds to house thousands of people outside of various cities ..... we'd probably have people claiming to be homeless to live rent free in those places, especially if food is included.

It's all by design, " you'll own nothing and be happy"

(09-25-2023, 09:41 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-25-2023, 07:51 AM)Sneakers Wrote: [ -> ]Great plan Einstien.  What happens when their lights go out and the toilets won't flush?  Oh, wait, toilets won't be a problem because the water supply has already dried up.

If you knew anything about development, you would know how critical infrastructure is.  The solution is not quite so simple.  While some municipal and state regulatory bodies are overly restrictive (depending on one's point of view) their involvement is absolutely necessary.

I basically work for developers.
I am intimately aware of the process.  Utility companies quote prices to developers for any infrastructure upgrade that a proposed new development needs.  Roads are more complicated aspect because the city council / County commission get involved, but roads, water and electricity are usually solved quickly.  Stormwater too.  The engineers tell you what to build and you build it.  
The holdup is usually at the zoning level, and not related to infrastructure at all, just related to the biases of the existing residents and their desire to keep everything the same.  All of the engineering problems can be solved with more money.  The zoning problems are usually unsolvable. 
In unincorporated parts of Florida, this is usually not a problem, but it is a problem in certain parts of certain cities.  In California, it's a problem in pretty much every city.
As far as water running out, sure, in Phoenix and Vegas that's a concern, but most places no. Again, stop assuming you know more than me.  At least be nice if you're going to disagree.

Opinions such as you've expressed, "Local governments just need to get out of the way.", doesn't suggest a great deal of knowledge or experience.   

For development to occur, not only must zoning allow it, but infrastructure must also be able to support it.  If you know anything, you should know sewer is the key to density.  Major upgrades to municipal systems for increased capacity can be a HUGE deal, involving public hearings, bond votes and possibly approval and/or coordination with the State.  Roads, likewise, can also require State approval in addition to local.  I'm currently involved in a mixed-use development project that can support in excess of 300 residential units, in addition to commercial space.  Municipal zoning is very favorable, and the Town is receptive, but the State is opposed to the upgrade of an existing non-signalized intersection to signalized.  I don't want this local government ''out of the way", I want them standing right next to me when I'm up against the State.  I'm not expecting the solution to this problem be quick, easy or inexpensive. 
The need for State approvals can also be triggered by number of dwelling units, acreage of disturbed soils, vehicle trips, wetlands, shoreline impact, animal habitat, natural resources on the property, archeological artifacts, etc.  It's a long list.  Problems like these are not solved as easily as you appear to believe and State regulations can often be more restrictive than local.  

You also are ignoring (or are unaware of) the complications development faces with other local public services.  For example, the developer must demonstrate the project will not overly burden police, fire and school services.  Another project I delt with a few years ago was partially halted because of a moratorium on residential development over concerns about limited school capacity.  16 building lots in an approved PUD were frozen for two and a half years!  
The 5 and 6 story buildings you suggest sound like an easy stimulant, but does the local fire department have the equipment to handle a rescue from that height?  Many smaller towns do not.  Don't you agree it would be irresponsible for a municipality to approve residential construction that it lacks the emergency services to support?  

Local zoning problems are not "usually unsolvable" and can sometimes be overcome far more easily than engineering challenges.  It all comes down to the mindset and political will of the governing body.

A lot of the problem is the closure of mental health institutions. We have a mental health problem and it shows itself in addictions, transgenderism, and violence.

(09-25-2023, 09:05 PM)Sneakers Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-25-2023, 09:41 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]I basically work for developers.
I am intimately aware of the process.  Utility companies quote prices to developers for any infrastructure upgrade that a proposed new development needs.  Roads are more complicated aspect because the city council / County commission get involved, but roads, water and electricity are usually solved quickly.  Stormwater too.  The engineers tell you what to build and you build it.  
The holdup is usually at the zoning level, and not related to infrastructure at all, just related to the biases of the existing residents and their desire to keep everything the same.  All of the engineering problems can be solved with more money.  The zoning problems are usually unsolvable. 
In unincorporated parts of Florida, this is usually not a problem, but it is a problem in certain parts of certain cities.  In California, it's a problem in pretty much every city.
As far as water running out, sure, in Phoenix and Vegas that's a concern, but most places no. Again, stop assuming you know more than me.  At least be nice if you're going to disagree.

Opinions such as you've expressed, "Local governments just need to get out of the way.", doesn't suggest a great deal of knowledge or experience.   

For development to occur, not only must zoning allow it, but infrastructure must also be able to support it.  If you know anything, you should know sewer is the key to density.  Major upgrades to municipal systems for increased capacity can be a HUGE deal, involving public hearings, bond votes and possibly approval and/or coordination with the State.  Roads, likewise, can also require State approval in addition to local.  I'm currently involved in a mixed-use development project that can support in excess of 300 residential units, in addition to commercial space.  Municipal zoning is very favorable, and the Town is receptive, but the State is opposed to the upgrade of an existing non-signalized intersection to signalized.  I don't want this local government ''out of the way", I want them standing right next to me when I'm up against the State.  I'm not expecting the solution to this problem be quick, easy or inexpensive. 
The need for State approvals can also be triggered by number of dwelling units, acreage of disturbed soils, vehicle trips, wetlands, shoreline impact, animal habitat, natural resources on the property, archeological artifacts, etc.  It's a long list.  Problems like these are not solved as easily as you appear to believe and State regulations can often be more restrictive than local.  

You also are ignoring (or are unaware of) the complications development faces with other local public services.  For example, the developer must demonstrate the project will not overly burden police, fire and school services.  Another project I delt with a few years ago was partially halted because of a moratorium on residential development over concerns about limited school capacity.  16 building lots in an approved PUD were frozen for two and a half years!  
The 5 and 6 story buildings you suggest sound like an easy stimulant, but does the local fire department have the equipment to handle a rescue from that height?  Many smaller towns do not.  Don't you agree it would be irresponsible for a municipality to approve residential construction that it lacks the emergency services to support?  

Local zoning problems are not "usually unsolvable" and can sometimes be overcome far more easily than engineering challenges.  It all comes down to the mindset and political will of the governing body.

Sounds like our experiences are similar.
For the purposes of this discussion, from the perspective of someone who just needs an affordable place to live, the level of government is not relevant.  They don't care if it's the school board or the water management district or the county commission or the state.  
From the perspective of each of those levels, and from the persepectice of folks like us that try to get these things built, yes, sometimes one entity says "here's an ideal place to build" and the other says, "actually there's a big problem there." But they are supposed to cooperate and figure it out, and in Florida they usually do.  It's in California where they usually don't.  Have you tried building anything on the west coast? My family has, and so have my job contacts.
As for your question of a smaller town not having the fire equipment to service a 6 story apartment, don't be dense man.  Stop assuming I'm wrong.  Stop jumping to that conclusion. If you think I'm wrong, think about how I could be right.  Obviously we're not trying to build a 5 over 1 in Keystone Heights.  No.  We are trying to infill and upgrade areas that are already incorporated to or adjacent to cities that have tall buildings.  They will have most everything like that already.  In Florida this is relatively easy.  In most other states it is very hard.

This is how you start with the military veteran community. 

Veteran's Community Project

They are tiny house communities that help homeless veterans transition from the street or shelter to their own apartment. While they're living in the tiny home they're also working with different agencies to get them self sufficient. 

I've been following the Kansas City VCP for several years now on Instagram and it's been wonderful to watch veterans come into the program and the transformation from homeless and all that entails to being able to leave and live a quality life.

(09-25-2023, 10:11 PM)americus 2.0 Wrote: [ -> ]This is how you start with the military veteran community. 

Veteran's Community Project

They are tiny house communities that help homeless veterans transition from the street or shelter to their own apartment. While they're living in the tiny home they're also working with different agencies to get them self sufficient. 

I've been following the Kansas City VCP for several years now on Instagram and it's been wonderful to watch veterans come into the program and the transformation from homeless and all that entails to being able to leave and live a quality life.

Sounds like a great program.  Is there sufficient data about their circumstances to possibly identify common factors leading to their homelessness and develop preventive assistance?

(09-25-2023, 11:11 PM)Sneakers Wrote: [ -> ]

(09-25-2023, 10:11 PM)americus 2.0 Wrote: [ -> ]This is how you start with the military veteran community. 

Veteran's Community Project

They are tiny house communities that help homeless veterans transition from the street or shelter to their own apartment. While they're living in the tiny home they're also working with different agencies to get them self sufficient. 

I've been following the Kansas City VCP for several years now on Instagram and it's been wonderful to watch veterans come into the program and the transformation from homeless and all that entails to being able to leave and live a quality life.

Sounds like a great program.  Is there sufficient data about their circumstances to possibly identify common factors leading to their homelessness and develop preventive assistance?

I don't know that information but this has always been a problem for combat veterans, especially OEF/OIF combat veterans who were deployed repeatedly, specifically due to post traumatic stress. The VA is a black hole when it comes to treatment of any kind and definitely for PTS. Many vets don't even seek assistance for it for various reasons.

If you want to know what PTS does to a combat veteran feel free to read up on it.