(01-17-2024, 12:06 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ]Hey all. Dint usually venture down here but just wanted to ask a question. What's the actual thoughts and support for Trump like this time around? The only thing we really get over here is all the court cases and shady things he has done.
I know he seemed like a breath of fresh air the first time but after that first term and the whole rigged election stuff, just don't know what the actual feelings are about him by regular people like you guys (well some of you 
)
There's a lot of anger and boredom here.
The anger causes people to push back when you present logical reasons to not vote for Trump, they just want to vote for Trump even more. They fully identify with him and feel personally attacked by anyone who attacks Trump.
The boredom causes people to want to break stuff and watch stuff get broken, regardless of who does the breaking and why. The boredom can sometimes be expressed as conspiracy theories and highly divergent world views, but people don't come up with this stuff all by themselves. They dive down the rabbit holes because they are bored and the simple and true explanations are too boring for them.
(01-17-2024, 12:06 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ]Hey all. Dint usually venture down here but just wanted to ask a question. What's the actual thoughts and support for Trump like this time around? The only thing we really get over here is all the court cases and shady things he has done.
I know he seemed like a breath of fresh air the first time but after that first term and the whole rigged election stuff, just don't know what the actual feelings are about him by regular people like you guys (well some of you )
If you're tired of not knowing who's in charge, vote Trump
If you're tired of the uniparty, vote Trump
If you're tired of paying high gas prices, vote Trump
If you're tired of high inflation, vote Trump
If you're tired of DEI, vote Trump
If you're tired of electoral cheating, vote Trump
If you're tired of your high grocery bill, vote Trump
If you're tired of giving our money to other countries when we have our own financial emergencies in THIS country, vote Trump
If you're tired of the pedophiles in Congress (Clinton Foundation funded child sex trafficking), vote Trump
If you're tired of seeing the lawlessness and barrage of riots and mass looting, vote Trump
If you're tired of the democratic party leaving our borders open to flood the country with illegals, vote Trump
If you want more of the same of the last 3+ years, vote Democrat..
(01-17-2024, 12:17 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (01-17-2024, 12:06 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ]Hey all. Dint usually venture down here but just wanted to ask a question. What's the actual thoughts and support for Trump like this time around? The only thing we really get over here is all the court cases and shady things he has done.
I know he seemed like a breath of fresh air the first time but after that first term and the whole rigged election stuff, just don't know what the actual feelings are about him by regular people like you guys (well some of you )
He's the most divisive figure in American politics in my lifetime.
A strong percentage of conservatives love him. A smaller percentage of conservatives hold their nose and support him hoping his policy will swing most toward their ideology. A smaller still percentage of conservatives just can't stomach a grifting-raping-con-artist-insurrectionest-criminal as a viable candidate.
Liberal/progressive leaning Americans came out of the woodwork to register and vote in record numbers to keep him out of office in the last election. Remains to be seen if they can do that again. I suspect they will.
You've also got the female conservative vote that will split on him to some degree due to his view of women in general as well as reproductive rights. Maybe 10-15% of them will praise him in public and quietly vote against him at the polls.
(In 2020 - women outvoted men and 57% of them voted against Trump)
90% of black voters despise him passionately.
Latin voters are split because of hard line immigration policy vs his anti-abortion stance resonating with a largely catholic community.
Thanks. The people who support him seem very passionate and think he's the answer to everything. The attitude over here with politicians is that they are all out for themselves and don't care about making things better for people and all the main parties are the same, that's why a lot of people are going more to outside parties but you guys don't really have that option. It feels the same feeling with the US and I got people giving Trump the benefit of the doubt the first time, especially going against Hillary who represented that not caring attitude.
From the outside, he didn't seem to do too much differently or shake things up in his time in office which kind of makes his whole strategy seem a bit off when he's claiming he'll fix everything. The guys ego is straight ridiculous.
Your getting a lot of the political talking heads over here saying there's now way Trump will win the nomination and definitely no way he could win the election but Biden doesn't seem the kind of guy you run out to vote for but like you say, someone people can hold their nose and vote for.
It's going to be a crazy year and I fear whatever happens it will cause problems. You just know if Trump doesn't get the nomination or loses the election then this whole cycle probably repeats itself.
(01-17-2024, 12:27 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (01-17-2024, 12:06 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ]Hey all. Dint usually venture down here but just wanted to ask a question. What's the actual thoughts and support for Trump like this time around? The only thing we really get over here is all the court cases and shady things he has done.
I know he seemed like a breath of fresh air the first time but after that first term and the whole rigged election stuff, just don't know what the actual feelings are about him by regular people like you guys (well some of you )
There's a lot of anger and boredom here.
The anger causes people to push back when you present logical reasons to not vote for Trump, they just want to vote for Trump even more. They fully identify with him and feel personally attacked by anyone who attacks Trump.
The boredom causes people to want to break stuff and watch stuff get broken, regardless of who does the breaking and why. The boredom can sometimes be expressed as conspiracy theories and highly divergent world views, but people don't come up with this stuff all by themselves. They dive down the rabbit holes because they are bored and the simple and true explanations are too boring for them.
Yeah I really get that and that's a strong feeling over here. It feels things are just getting worse and worse but people feel hopless to change things for the better or have no trust in politicians so it creates this break and burn everything which just makes things even worse. Thar seems to create this split which entrenched people on either side and blame the other side for everything wrong.
That attitude has certainly opened the door to the more extreme ends of the spectrum that say they can offer the real change that will fix things but usually it doesn't and they are out for themselves too.
I mean we had Brexit which was promised to make the country better, richer and everyone would be doing great. 4 years later and it's a disaster. But instead of having a sensible debate about the best way forwards its both sides blaming the other.
(01-17-2024, 01:26 PM)WingerDinger Wrote: [ -> ] (01-17-2024, 12:06 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ]Hey all. Dint usually venture down here but just wanted to ask a question. What's the actual thoughts and support for Trump like this time around? The only thing we really get over here is all the court cases and shady things he has done.
I know he seemed like a breath of fresh air the first time but after that first term and the whole rigged election stuff, just don't know what the actual feelings are about him by regular people like you guys (well some of you )
If you're tired of not knowing who's in charge, vote Trump
If you're tired of the uniparty, vote Trump
If you're tired of paying high gas prices, vote Trump
If you're tired of high inflation, vote Trump
If you're tired of DEI, vote Trump
If you're tired of electoral cheating, vote Trump
If you're tired of your high grocery bill, vote Trump
If you're tired of giving our money to other countries when we have our own financial emergencies in THIS country, vote Trump
If you're tired of the pedophiles in Congress (Clinton Foundation funded child sex trafficking), vote Trump
If you're tired of seeing the lawlessness and barrage of riots and mass looting, vote Trump
If you're tired of the democratic party leaving our borders open to flood the country with illegals, vote Trump
If you want more of the same of the last 3+ years, vote Democrat..
Ah I see. The usual approach of the guys not in power. All the things you hate or don't like can be fixed if you vote for me but when they get in power it stays the same. Nothing easier in politics than making promises.
I do think these are the kind of things though that cause the distrust and anger, you overpromise to get people to vote for you so you can get into power, even knowing you can't do all those things but if you do it you'll probably get peoples vote as who votes to keep things bad. But then when you don't do all those things people say your just like the rest. I think people would respond to someone who was honest and said i can fix these 2-3 things and start working on more and actually achieve that.
But then people time and again vote for the person making the bold promises....
(01-17-2024, 02:05 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ] (01-17-2024, 01:26 PM)WingerDinger Wrote: [ -> ]If you're tired of not knowing who's in charge, vote Trump
If you're tired of the uniparty, vote Trump
If you're tired of paying high gas prices, vote Trump
If you're tired of high inflation, vote Trump
If you're tired of DEI, vote Trump
If you're tired of electoral cheating, vote Trump
If you're tired of your high grocery bill, vote Trump
If you're tired of giving our money to other countries when we have our own financial emergencies in THIS country, vote Trump
If you're tired of the pedophiles in Congress (Clinton Foundation funded child sex trafficking), vote Trump
If you're tired of seeing the lawlessness and barrage of riots and mass looting, vote Trump
If you're tired of the democratic party leaving our borders open to flood the country with illegals, vote Trump
If you want more of the same of the last 3+ years, vote Democrat..
Ah I see. The usual approach of the guys not in power. All the things you hate or don't like can be fixed if you vote for me but when they get in power it stays the same. Nothing easier in politics than making promises.
I do think these are the kind of things though that cause the distrust and anger, you overpromise to get people to vote for you so you can get into power, even knowing you can't do all those things but if you do it you'll probably get peoples vote as who votes to keep things bad. But then when you don't do all those things people say your just like the rest. I think people would respond to someone who was honest and said i can fix these 2-3 things and start working on more and actually achieve that.
But then people time and again vote for the person making the bold promises....
You don't have to believe me.. You're used to diagnosing football on the main forum.
Use the eye test.. Compare what you're being told to what you see. You'll come up with your own opinion.
(01-17-2024, 02:05 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ] (01-17-2024, 01:26 PM)WingerDinger Wrote: [ -> ]If you're tired of not knowing who's in charge, vote Trump
If you're tired of the uniparty, vote Trump
If you're tired of paying high gas prices, vote Trump
If you're tired of high inflation, vote Trump
If you're tired of DEI, vote Trump
If you're tired of electoral cheating, vote Trump
If you're tired of your high grocery bill, vote Trump
If you're tired of giving our money to other countries when we have our own financial emergencies in THIS country, vote Trump
If you're tired of the pedophiles in Congress (Clinton Foundation funded child sex trafficking), vote Trump
If you're tired of seeing the lawlessness and barrage of riots and mass looting, vote Trump
If you're tired of the democratic party leaving our borders open to flood the country with illegals, vote Trump
If you want more of the same of the last 3+ years, vote Democrat..
Ah I see. The usual approach of the guys not in power. All the things you hate or don't like can be fixed if you vote for me but when they get in power it stays the same. Nothing easier in politics than making promises.
I do think these are the kind of things though that cause the distrust and anger, you overpromise to get people to vote for you so you can get into power, even knowing you can't do all those things but if you do it you'll probably get peoples vote as who votes to keep things bad. But then when you don't do all those things people say your just like the rest. I think people would respond to someone who was honest and said i can fix these 2-3 things and start working on more and actually achieve that.
But then people time and again vote for the person making the bold promises....
No offense, man, but if you only marginally follow US politics, you can't be equipped with the background of why that makes sense. You're trying, so there's that. Part of what ingratiates Trump to the people is that the establishment (in the US, that's the media, Hollywood, three letter agencies, corporations and their billionaire investors) all hate the dude. That's pretty much the bat signal for a growing number of disenfranchised folks that are beginning to look at the establishment like greedy crooks. That same hatred by the establishment, also gives Trump a pass for what he fails to accomplish (fair or not) because he's literally up against the most powerful interests in the world.
The goal is to bring the establishment back under the heel of the American people. People are putting a lot of hope in Trump.... not so much because he cares about them, but because he shows the strength of resolve to fight back against the monolith that is killing the American dream. For some, Trump is a savior. For people like me, the enemy of my enemy is my friend.
Policy over the person.. ALWAYS!!
If Vivek was to be the nominee, he'd have my vote instead.
I'd like to make an amendment to the list above.
If you're tired of Republicans as well..
Because they're just as crooked and corrupt as the democrats.
(01-17-2024, 02:21 PM)WingerDinger Wrote: [ -> ] (01-17-2024, 02:05 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ]Ah I see. The usual approach of the guys not in power. All the things you hate or don't like can be fixed if you vote for me but when they get in power it stays the same. Nothing easier in politics than making promises.
I do think these are the kind of things though that cause the distrust and anger, you overpromise to get people to vote for you so you can get into power, even knowing you can't do all those things but if you do it you'll probably get peoples vote as who votes to keep things bad. But then when you don't do all those things people say your just like the rest. I think people would respond to someone who was honest and said i can fix these 2-3 things and start working on more and actually achieve that.
But then people time and again vote for the person making the bold promises....
You don't have to believe me.. You're used to diagnosing football on the main forum.
Use the eye test.. Compare what you're being told to what you see. You'll come up with your own opinion.
No I get you and I know a lot of people see it that way. People who like Trump think that is the case, people who don't use that as a reason he's lying. Just not sure how effective it is in getting/losing votes, especially when you have a term to compare it to.
It's not like Biden has been great and has had plenty of moments that make you worried about his health and stuff.
Like NYC said, a lot of people came out last election to vote against Trump, will they do the same again.
(01-17-2024, 02:24 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ] (01-17-2024, 02:05 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ]Ah I see. The usual approach of the guys not in power. All the things you hate or don't like can be fixed if you vote for me but when they get in power it stays the same. Nothing easier in politics than making promises.
I do think these are the kind of things though that cause the distrust and anger, you overpromise to get people to vote for you so you can get into power, even knowing you can't do all those things but if you do it you'll probably get peoples vote as who votes to keep things bad. But then when you don't do all those things people say your just like the rest. I think people would respond to someone who was honest and said i can fix these 2-3 things and start working on more and actually achieve that.
But then people time and again vote for the person making the bold promises....
No offense, man, but if you only marginally follow US politics, you can't be equipped with the background of why that makes sense. You're trying, so there's that. Part of what ingratiates Trump to the people is that the establishment (in the US, that's the media, Hollywood, three letter agencies, corporations and their billionaire investors) all hate the dude. That's pretty much the bat signal for a growing number of disenfranchised folks that are beginning to look at the establishment like greedy crooks. That same hatred by the establishment, also gives Trump a pass for what he fails to accomplish (fair or not) because he's literally up against the most powerful interests in the world.
The goal is to bring the establishment back under the heel of the American people. People are putting a lot of hope in Trump.... not so much because he cares about them, but because he shows the strength of resolve to fight back against the monolith that is killing the American dream. For some, Trump is a savior. For people like me, the enemy of my enemy is my friend.
No I get your point. That was Trumps big point was he was fighting for the average American against the crooked establishment that works against them. It's a very attractive proposition for any voter and I think people across the world feel their governments aren't working to help or make their lives better and are only interested in making the rich richer.
The main reason I wanted to know what people's opinions and how the attitude is in the US with Trump is he made the same promises the first time and some would argue he didn't really fight the establishment. Now some will argue that's the power of the establishment and they're trying to take him down. I'm just curious if his fighting the establishment position was still winning people over.
For the record I agree that the super rich have way too much power and influence over politics and have corrupted the whole system. I'm just not sold that a millionaire/billionaire that's existed in that circle all their life is the person that will change that.
(01-17-2024, 03:36 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ] (01-17-2024, 02:21 PM)WingerDinger Wrote: [ -> ]You don't have to believe me.. You're used to diagnosing football on the main forum.
Use the eye test.. Compare what you're being told to what you see. You'll come up with your own opinion.
No I get you and I know a lot of people see it that way. People who like Trump think that is the case, people who don't use that as a reason he's lying. Just not sure how effective it is in getting/losing votes, especially when you have a term to compare it to.
It's not like Biden has been great and has had plenty of moments that make you worried about his health and stuff.
Like NYC said, a lot of people came out last election to vote against Trump, will they do the same again.
If you're really interested in some of the topics that I've posted, do your own research. That's the best way to form your own opinion.. Party politics is pretty much dead. You have Republicans & Democrats working together behind closed doors, conceiving a plan to ultimately screw you. It's been that way forever and The People are finally tired of it. It's way past time to expose DC corruption.
Ever wonder how and why you have a Mayor in DC who's anual salary is $200k, and after a year or two, her worth is over $5-10 Million?
That's a taste of what people are pissed about.
(01-17-2024, 03:46 PM)WingerDinger Wrote: [ -> ] (01-17-2024, 03:36 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ]No I get you and I know a lot of people see it that way. People who like Trump think that is the case, people who don't use that as a reason he's lying. Just not sure how effective it is in getting/losing votes, especially when you have a term to compare it to.
It's not like Biden has been great and has had plenty of moments that make you worried about his health and stuff.
Like NYC said, a lot of people came out last election to vote against Trump, will they do the same again.
If you're really interested in some of the topics that I've posted, do your own research. That's the best way to form your own opinion.. Party politics is pretty much dead. You have Republicans & Democrats working together behind closed doors, conceiving a plan to ultimately screw you. It's been that way forever and The People are finally tired of it. It's way past time to expose DC corruption.
Ever wonder how and why you have a Mayor in DC who's anual salary is $200k, and after a year or two, her worth is over $5-10 Million?
That's a taste of what people are pissed about.
This type of corruption is pervasive in this country.
It is laughable how many pieces the liberal media has written about Trump's corruption, when you know they aren't digging into this stuff, about how people like Feinstein and Pelosi become tens of millionaires.
However it is equally laughable for you to cite this as a reason to support Trump. Trump is every bit as much on the take as your typical Democrat, if not more.
(01-17-2024, 06:34 PM)WingerDinger Wrote: [ -> ] (01-17-2024, 06:21 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]This type of corruption is pervasive in this country.
It is laughable how many pieces the liberal media has written about Trump's corruption, when you know they aren't digging into this stuff, about how people like Feinstein and Pelosi become millionaires.
However it is equally laughable for you to cite this as a reason to support Trump. Trump is every bit as much on the take as your typical Democrat, if not more.
It's not just the reason.. Just one of many.
On the take lolol
I literally said "a" not "the"
(01-17-2024, 07:27 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (01-17-2024, 06:34 PM)WingerDinger Wrote: [ -> ]It's not just the reason.. Just one of many.
On the take lolol
I literally said "a" not "the"
I have a confession to make..
I totally ignore most of what you talk about on here, but in that brief occurrence when I do answer your question, I kinda speed read through your word salad/[BLEEP] soup.. And I suck at speed reading. So bare with me..
(01-17-2024, 03:44 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ] (01-17-2024, 02:24 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]No offense, man, but if you only marginally follow US politics, you can't be equipped with the background of why that makes sense. You're trying, so there's that. Part of what ingratiates Trump to the people is that the establishment (in the US, that's the media, Hollywood, three letter agencies, corporations and their billionaire investors) all hate the dude. That's pretty much the bat signal for a growing number of disenfranchised folks that are beginning to look at the establishment like greedy crooks. That same hatred by the establishment, also gives Trump a pass for what he fails to accomplish (fair or not) because he's literally up against the most powerful interests in the world.
The goal is to bring the establishment back under the heel of the American people. People are putting a lot of hope in Trump.... not so much because he cares about them, but because he shows the strength of resolve to fight back against the monolith that is killing the American dream. For some, Trump is a savior. For people like me, the enemy of my enemy is my friend.
No I get your point. That was Trumps big point was he was fighting for the average American against the crooked establishment that works against them. It's a very attractive proposition for any voter and I think people across the world feel their governments aren't working to help or make their lives better and are only interested in making the rich richer.
The main reason I wanted to know what people's opinions and how the attitude is in the US with Trump is he made the same promises the first time and some would argue he didn't really fight the establishment. Now some will argue that's the power of the establishment and they're trying to take him down. I'm just curious if his fighting the establishment position was still winning people over.
For the record I agree that the super rich have way too much power and influence over politics and have corrupted the whole system. I'm just not sold that a millionaire/billionaire that's existed in that circle all their life is the person that will change that.
I think the telltale sign that Trump is not part of the establishment is their persecution of him. They HATE him. My take is that he's a full-blown narcissist, and he wants America to look like the country it was when he grew up. He sees it as HIS country and he wants it to be the best, just like he wants his house to be the best or his wife to look the prettiest. I don't think for one second that he cares about the people, but he does want to be loved by them. That happens to benefit me, which is why I think this is why he clashes with the establishment. They have a vision, but he is unyielding. He sees himself as part of that circle, but they reject him, and, because he's a narcissist, he looks for other ways to assert his dominance.
He would ABSOLUTELY take a deal that benefited him, so long as it fits with the mold of him being top dog and also having the best things. If they kissed his [BLEEP], they could get Trump to do whatever they wanted, but the thing is, they are also full-blown narcissists. They just have way more power and influence.
The more he fights them, the more it gets exposed, even if he doesn't get anything done. This, in a weird way, is as important as actually making solid reform.
(01-17-2024, 06:37 PM)EricC85 Wrote: [ -> ]I still don't understand how people buy the lie that Trump of all people is an anti-establishment outsider, here's just a list of how established this guy is;
Trump at the world economic forum ( one of the most establishment meetings)
https://trumpwhitehouse.archives.gov/bri...itzerland/
Trump sent his son-in-law to the Bilderberg meeting while president
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/05/28/kushner-...eting.html
Trumps economic team was loaded with wall street executives he selected Gary Cohn while he was still president of Golden Sachs
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Cohn
Trump has funded both sides of the political spectrum but damn he sure does love some establishment politicians
https://ballotpedia.org/History_of_Donal..._donations
See the post above. He's not an insider. Every President attends the G20 meetings now. People who don't think he does stuff for himself are drinking the Kool-Aid, but I don't care so long as the corruption keeps becoming more and more obvious. You're not going to get that with Haley. She is as insider as they come, and anyone voting for her still doesn't realize the problem. I'm on the fence with DeSantis. He's governed well here.
(01-17-2024, 09:14 PM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ] (01-17-2024, 03:44 PM)JagFan81 Wrote: [ -> ]No I get your point. That was Trumps big point was he was fighting for the average American against the crooked establishment that works against them. It's a very attractive proposition for any voter and I think people across the world feel their governments aren't working to help or make their lives better and are only interested in making the rich richer.
The main reason I wanted to know what people's opinions and how the attitude is in the US with Trump is he made the same promises the first time and some would argue he didn't really fight the establishment. Now some will argue that's the power of the establishment and they're trying to take him down. I'm just curious if his fighting the establishment position was still winning people over.
For the record I agree that the super rich have way too much power and influence over politics and have corrupted the whole system. I'm just not sold that a millionaire/billionaire that's existed in that circle all their life is the person that will change that.
I think the telltale sign that Trump is not part of the establishment is their persecution of him. They HATE him. My take is that he's a full-blown narcissist, and he wants America to look like the country it was when he grew up. He sees it as HIS country and he wants it to be the best, just like he wants his house to be the best or his wife to look the prettiest. I don't think for one second that he cares about the people, but he does want to be loved by them. That happens to benefit me, which is why I think this is why he clashes with the establishment. They have a vision, but he is unyielding. He sees himself as part of that circle, but they reject him, and, because he's a narcissist, he looks for other ways to assert his dominance.
He would ABSOLUTELY take a deal that benefited him, so long as it fits with the mold of him being top dog and also having the best things. If they kissed his [BLEEP], they could get Trump to do whatever they wanted, but the thing is, they are also full-blown narcissists. They just have way more power and influence.
The more he fights them, the more it gets exposed, even if he doesn't get anything done. This, in a weird way, is as important as actually making solid reform.
(01-17-2024, 06:37 PM)EricC85 Wrote: [ -> ]I still don't understand how people buy the lie that Trump of all people is an anti-establishment outsider, here's just a list of how established this guy is;
Trump at the world economic forum ( one of the most establishment meetings)
https://trumpwhitehouse.archives.gov/bri...itzerland/
Trump sent his son-in-law to the Bilderberg meeting while president
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/05/28/kushner-...eting.html
Trumps economic team was loaded with wall street executives he selected Gary Cohn while he was still president of Golden Sachs
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Cohn
Trump has funded both sides of the political spectrum but damn he sure does love some establishment politicians
https://ballotpedia.org/History_of_Donal..._donations
See the post above. He's not an insider. Every President attends the G20 meetings now. People who don't think he does stuff for himself are drinking the Kool-Aid, but I don't care so long as the corruption keeps becoming more and more obvious. You're not going to get that with Haley. She is as insider as they come, and anyone voting for her still doesn't realize the problem. I'm on the fence with DeSantis. He's governed well here.
Haley got rich from the war machine. She sucks