Quote:1. I doubt Miami made the offer. Caldwell was allowed to make such an offer himself, he didn't have to sit on his hands and hope that some other team would call. He himself said that he won't initiate a trade down, the request has to come from the other team. So opportunities are missed, and will continue to be missed.
2. I have no idea who the Jags would have taken at 12 had the trade been made. I just plugged in the best two of the next three picks that year. Caldwell has been a very good judge of talent, so it's reasonable to think he'd pick a good player in that scenario.
3. I like Caldwell and have been very impressed with his drafting. But he's not a shrewd trader, and has never traded down. In the end, picking the right guy is a lot more important than getting top value. I just believe he could have done even better.
(Numbering and emphasis added)
1. Question: is every failure to trade down representative of an opportunity missed? Are there instances where a trade down is not warranted, or where the failure t trade down does not represent an opportunity missed?
2. Caldwell has been an outstanding judge of talent. However, have you considered the possibility that in building a team, Caldwell believes in using first round picks on the marquee positions of QB, LT, DE, and CB?
3. Is part of being a shrewd trader knowing when to make and when not to make a trade up or down? When he did not trade down in 2014, ensuring the Jaguars would get the chance to draft Bortles, was that evidence of a shrewd trader or a missed opportunity? What about this year's refusal to trade down when offered picks by teams looking to draft Jalen Ramsey? Caldwell was also tempted to move back up into the first round this year in order to guarantee Myles Jack, but he did not want to trade away the team's 4th round pick to do it. Instead, he waited until Jack fell to the 2nd and traded a 5th round pick to move up two spots to get the same guy talked about at 5. Was that shrewd or not?
Quote:Obviously there are times when it doesn't pay to trade down. I was specifically talking about the pick used on Joeckel. Joeckel was not an elite talent, and the Jags had a very good (at the time anyway) LT. There was talk of filling the hole at RT, but Joeckel did not (and still does not) fit the mold of an NFL RT.
Don't try to put up a false equivalence between taking an elite talent who fills a need like Ramsey with picking Joeckel. The equivalent scenario would have been the Jags drafting Tunsil rather than trading down had Ramsey, Jack, and Bosa already been taken.
Joeckel was any elite tackle prospect. Many felt he was the best tackle prospect since Joe Thomas, sometimes players just dont pan out
Joeckel was a top ten level talent at the time he was drafted, just like Ramsey.
Both Joeckel and Ramsey were totally unproven as NFL players.
No false equivalency here.
Some prefer to love/live hindsight than be pragmatic and take a holistic view.
With Monroe, it was time... regardless of how well the replacement turned out.
What we got in return as a whole, was measurably greater in the larger view.
Quote:Joeckel was any elite tackle prospect. Many felt he was the best tackle prospect since Joe Thomas, sometimes players just dont pan out
The best OT prospect since Joe Thomas was passed over for Eric Fisher? Really? That's your position?
Joeckel was the consensus #1 overall pick that year, but he wasn't considered to be an elite LT.
Quote:Joeckel was a top ten level talent at the time he was drafted, just like Ramsey.
Both Joeckel and Ramsey were totally unproven as NFL players.
No false equivalency here.
The need factor is the false equivalency. Monroe was coming off a top-ten NFL LT season in 2012 when they drafted Joeckel. Drafting Ramsey made sense from a need perspective.
Prince Amukamara is not a top 20 CB.
I might add that the dropoff from Joeckel to later picks in the first round was not nearly as steep as the dropoff from Ramsey (Bosa, Tunsil, Jack, Buckner, ... Elliot?) to later picks in round 1 this year. Look at the picks from #6 on, the only players rated among the elite players in the draft who were available later were Buckner and Tunsil, two positions where the Jags were overloaded with starters.
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/ye.../draft.htm
While in 2013 several of the later 1st round picks were mentioned as possible #1 overall picks before the draft.
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/ye.../draft.htm
"top 10"
Doesn't pass the logic test, sorry.
By any measure, it was time to move on. Unfortunately Baltimore knows that now, too. Sure they would pass if given the chance to do over.