Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

This Lawson crap must stop. some ppl don't even like him better than his running mate Dodd, who played way better in the Championship game. Not to mention questions about the shoulder. 

Quote:This Lawson crap must stop. some ppl don't even like him better than his running mate Dodd, who played way better in the Championship game. Not to mention questions about the shoulder. 

The shoulder thing could be a legit problem, but barring something major with that Lawson is far superior to Dodd. 

 

Dodd had a pretty underwhelming career facing crappy college RTs and didn't finally take off until the final month of his career. He is also going to be 24 this year, which is a pretty significant red flag. He didn't really light it up playing against substantially lesser developed physically opponents, and he also won't develop as much physically as someone like Lawson who is only 21 will in the future. 

I don't believe Lawson is a possibility at 5 even if our worst nightmare comes true and Tunsil, Ramsey, Jack, and Bosa go 1-4. In that case, VH would be my pick. 

I hope Buckner goes 3 or 4 leaving us with one player to choose from or two players if a QB goes. We could have Bosa and Jack there to pick from. I would take Jack and take Spence in round 2.

Quote:Odds are yes. Forceplayers has an extremely impressive track record.  

Length, technique, and motor is what equals production in the NFL. You can be as athletic as you want, if you have T-Rex arms and aren't a football player you will still suck. Most of the force players have the above. Last year Olivier Vernon, Jabaal Sheard, and Robert Ayers were three of the best pass rushers in the league and none of them are force players. Why? Because they had length, motor, and technique. 

Quote:Length, technique, and motor is what equals production in the NFL. You can be as athletic as you want, if you have T-Rex arms and aren't a football player you will still suck. Most of the force players have the above. Last year Olivier Vernon, Jabaal Sheard, and Robert Ayers were three of the best pass rushers in the league and none of them are force players. Why? Because they had length, motor, and technique. 

Ayers is hardly among the best pass rushers in the league...but yes Sheard (along with Chandler Jones) are the major outlier non FP that have had great success. Emphasis on outlier. The majority of the great pass rushers in the NFL have superlative athleticism also. 

Quote:This Lawson crap must stop. some ppl don't even like him better than his running mate Dodd, who played way better in the Championship game. Not to mention questions about the shoulder.

Teams are doing there due diligence, Jack is number 1 on my list but he's also not without questions. Plug in the Lawson tape he's pretty impressive, I'm one of the few but I'd rather have him over Bosa.

Quote:Ayers is hardly among the best pass rushers in the league...but yes Sheard (along with Chandler Jones) are the major outlier non FP that have had great success. Emphasis on outlier. The majority of the great pass rushers in the NFL have superlative athleticism also. 

the PFF you love so much has him ranked 7th in the league sooo...

 

And a lot of the nonforce players that were taken highly that failed also happen to have been bummy, unmotivated players. I think way too much stock is put into force player, when it comes down to it all it really is is a measure of how well a player can win on the outside. There is more ways to create pressure than just being able to bend the edge and bullrush. 

Also Sheard, Jones, Vernon, and Ayers are not the only outliers. Tamba Hali and Terrell Suggs likely would have failed as well. There is more to rushing the passer than just how athletic you are.

Quote:If you think Lawson is your guy, the kind of guy who is worth a first round pick, I don't care if he is picked at 5. Who cares if people think that is picking him too high. They said the same thing about Blake

Yeah. They said it about Tyson Alualu and Derrick Harvey too.

If Buckner is the highest rated player on our board, we should take him.  

 

I would never take Shaq Lawson over Buckner.   I don't care about the fact that we have more of a need for Shaq Lawson than for Buckner.   Buckner is a better player.    Take him, and play him at the big end spot, or move Malik Jackson to the big end spot, or change the defense so we can play both Buckner and Malik Jackson at DT.   But for God's sake, don't let the scheme force you to take a lesser player over a better player.  

I think they flagged the shoulder issue to see if he'll fall to the second. But that's highly unlikely even if it's an issue

Quote:

If Buckner is the highest rated player on our board, we should take him.


I would never take Shaq Lawson over Buckner. I don't care about the fact that we have more of a need for Shaq Lawson than for Buckner. Buckner is a better player. Take him, and play him at the big end spot, or move Malik Jackson to the big end spot, or change the defense so we can play both Buckner and Malik Jackson at DT. But for God's sake, don't let the scheme force you to take a lesser player over a better player.

And if Lawson is the highest rated player on our board, they should take him as well. It may not be consensus but that doesn't matter. Dave put the work in scouting him for the past year and if he feels he's the best then pull the trigger.


How many people had Bortles ranked as the top player on their big boards 2 years ago? I think Dave has earned the benefit of the doubt.

Quote:I think they flagged the shoulder issue to see if he'll fall to the second. But that's highly unlikely even if it's an issue

I haven't given thought about this scenario but that could also be a possibility.

I think Lawson will wind up being a good player in the NFL, but for me he has a few too many question marks to be considered in the top 10.


It looks more likely he will fall to the end of Rd 1.


For the jaguars needs and the way the draft is starting to unfold, I still have my eye on Noah Spence with our 2nd rounder, even if that means moving up a few spots to get him.

Quote:If Buckner is the highest rated player on our board, we should take him.


I would never take Shaq Lawson over Buckner. I don't care about the fact that we have more of a need for Shaq Lawson than for Buckner. Buckner is a better player. Take him, and play him at the big end spot, or move Malik Jackson to the big end spot, or change the defense so we can play both Buckner and Malik Jackson at DT. But for God's sake, don't let the scheme force you to take a lesser player over a better player.

But we need pressure off the edge

Quote:Its funny how people always say trade down and grab him. How do you know he will be there to where you trade down to?

 

We get it Gene, you were sure Alualu wasn't gonna be available later LOL, same with Anger!

Quote:We get it Gene, you were sure Alualu wasn't gonna be available later LOL, same with Anger!

Except Lawson plays a premier position and is probably the best prospect at that position

Quote:Except Lawson plays a premier position and is probably the best prospect at that position

I dont think he understands that

I think if you think Lawson has the ability and good chance of becoming a 10+ sack/year guy, draft him.