Quote:Nothing about Brock worries me. Frankly, I love that they went so hard to sign him. He's just another "ok" QB imo. Nothing wrong w/ that. You can make a great, lucrative career being an "Ok" QB in the NFL.
Hopkins is what matters. Put up 100+ with 4 different QBs last year. Just didn't matter at ALL who was throwing him the ball.
I'm pretty sure even I could play QB get get him 100 yards at this point.
I just don't see Brock as that significant of an upgrade over Hoyer or Mallet. An upgrade, yes, but nothing significant.
As for not meeting him prior to signing him, man... that just shows the desperation. They knew they had to get it agreed to and get him out of Denver ASAP and that's taking a huge risk handing the Franchise over to someone you haven't even had a conversation with. Sure, his physical attributes aren't going to change based on that meeting, but getting a feeling for his intelligence, his ability to understand and execute your scheme, if he's even going to get along with his head coach... There's so much more to it than being able to throw a ball, and that's a HUGE risk imo.
He's not even okay, he just was available, and the texans were desperate.
Like I said before, if he were a franchise level guy the broncos would have franchised him instead of Miller.
Congratulations to the texans on winning the sweepstakes for the 2016 version of Matt Flynn.
Brock is serviceable at QB. The Texans almost have everything except for a QB. They went 9-7 without a good QB. Add a serviceable QB and they could easily go 10-6 or better. We just need to make sure we beat them twice to stay up in the division.
Quote:He's not even okay, he just was available, and the texans were desperate.
Like I said before, if he were a franchise level guy the broncos would have franchised him instead of Miller.
Congratulations to the texans on winning the sweepstakes for the 2016 version of Matt Flynn.
You keep saying that.
You do realize it would have costs the broncos $19.8 million to franchise Brock for one year right?
Quote: You keep saying that.
You do realize it would have costs the broncos $19.8 million to franchise Brock for one year right?
Yes, what about what I said makes you think I don't understand how the franchise tag works?
If they thought he was an actual franchise level passer they'd have made a way to pay him, or just signed him to a long term deal. Teams don't let actual franchise level passers just walk. Plus he was almost as bad throwing down the field as Mariota was, and he didn't even have the excuse of having a crappy team around him.
Quote:Yes, what about what I said makes you think I don't understand how the franchise tag works?
If they thought he was an actual franchise level passer they'd have made a way to pay him, or just signed him to a long term deal. Teams don't let actual franchise level passers just walk. Plus he was almost as bad throwing down the field as Mariota was, and he didn't even have the excuse of having a crappy team around him.
The broncos are in cap heck and they couldnt afford him,and they'd already tagged Von Miller because they thought they could bring Brock in cheap.
They misplayed their hand.
Quote: The broncos are in cap heck and they couldnt afford him,and they'd already tagged Von Miller because they thought they could bring Brock in cheap.
They misplayed their hand.
We'll find out in a few months.
Quote:Yes, what about what I said makes you think I don't understand how the franchise tag works?
If they thought he was an actual franchise level passer they'd have made a way to pay him, or just signed him to a long term deal. Teams don't let actual franchise level passers just walk. Plus he was almost as bad throwing down the field as Mariota was, and he didn't even have the excuse of having a crappy team around him.
I haven't bought into Brock Osweiler myself. I have no idea if he's going to be any better than any of the guys we've had playing for us the last couple of years.
But when the Broncos are asking the 49ers to pay $5M of Kaepernick's 2016 money & asking Kaepernick to take $14M less over the next two years, I'm more inclined to think they have money issues & didn't plan on getting into a bidding war over Brock.
Still, knowing that we have one guy who is going to be the guy is going to help us in & of itself. Instead of jerking the offense around every time we start a new QB, we can actually work to getting better week after week.
Quote:I haven't bought into Brock Osweiler myself. I have no idea if he's going to be any better than any of the guys we've had playing for us the last couple of years.
But when the Broncos are asking the 49ers to pay $5M of Kaepernick's 2016 money & asking Kaepernick to take $14M less over the next two years, I'm more inclined to think they have money issues & didn't plan on getting into a bidding war over Brock.
Still, knowing that we have one guy who is going to be the guy is going to help us in & of itself. Instead of jerking the offense around every time we start a new QB, we can actually work to getting better week after week.
He's around Ryan Mallet level but without the attitude problem. Going into last year you were convinced having "the guy" was going to help you. too.
All of that said Matt Flynn is probably better than Ryan Mallet, and that's what it looks like you guys got, a guy that is a little better than Ryan Mallet.
Quote:He's around Ryan Mallet level but without the attitude problem. Going into last year you were convinced having "the guy" was going to help you. too.
Yeah, last year I was convinced Mallett was the guy, but O'Brien had something for Hoyer. I can't explain that. Had O'Brien got over whatever it was he didn't like about Mallett I'm sure we'd have had a better season.
Hoyer was benched week 1 because he was obviously she'll shocked. I still don't know why Mallett was benched a few weeks later. He took a breather instead of taking a time out & O'Brien didn't let him back in.
Then Mallett the headcase started showing up more & more.
Again, it doesn't bother me you don't have high hopes for Osweiler. I don't either.
I don't even remember which QBs beat you last season. I wouldn't doubt Jacksonville wasn't a notch on Hoyer's belt, meaning we probably could have beat you with Chad Henne.
Next year... we'll see. I hope Osweiler is as good as Mallett. That would be a step in the right direction.
Quote:Yeah, last year I was convinced Mallett was the guy, but O'Brien had something for Hoyer. I can't explain that. Had O'Brien got over whatever it was he didn't like about Mallett I'm sure we'd have had a better season.
Hoyer was benched week 1 because he was obviously she'll shocked. I still don't know why Mallett was benched a few weeks later. He took a breather instead of taking a time out & O'Brien didn't let him back in.
Then Mallett the headcase started showing up more & more.
Again, it doesn't bother me you don't have high hopes for Osweiler. I don't either.
I don't even remember which QBs beat you last season. I wouldn't doubt Jacksonville wasn't a notch on Hoyer's belt, meaning we probably could have beat you with Chad Henne.
Next year... we'll see. I hope Osweiler is as good as Mallett. That would be a step in the right direction.
It's not saying much to lay claim to beating the Jaguars regardless of the starting QB under center. Teams aren't measured by whether they can beat teams as poorly led as the Jaguars have been the last few years, teams are measured by how they do against other good teams. I seem to recall the texans looking pretty weak against Alex Smith and the Chiefs last year, and I don't think having Osweiler would have changed that outcome.
Quote:It's not saying much to lay claim to beating the Jaguars regardless of the starting QB under center. Teams aren't measured by whether they can beat teams as poorly led as the Jaguars have been the last few years, teams are measured by how they do against other good teams. I seem to recall the texans looking pretty weak against Alex Smith and the Chiefs last year, and I don't think having Osweiler would have changed that outcome.
The Texans defense actually looked pretty good in that game IMO. The problem was that every time they stopped the Chiefs, Hoyer would just give it right back to them (he had like 5 or 6 turnovers that game I think). Plus the opening kickoff return for a TD did not help the situation either.
The Texans got humiliated in that game almost solely due to the QB play (Hoyer).
If Osweiler can just manage games and not be a turnover machine, the Texans may be in good shape (altough, as a Jags fan I hope not).
Quote:The Texans defense actually looked pretty good in that game IMO. The problem was that every time they stopped the Chiefs, Hoyer would just give it right back to them (he had like 5 or 6 turnovers that game I think). Plus the opening kickoff return for a TD did not help the situation either.
The Texans got humiliated in that game almost solely due to the QB play (Hoyer).
If Osweiler can just manage games and not be a turnover machine, the Texans may be in good shape (altough, as a Jags fan I hope not).
So you're saying if they got a game manager they might be able to not get humiliated?
I'd say they should already be humiliated for signing a game manager to such a massive contract, but I also disagree with you, Hoyer is a game manager, they weren't winning that game, and if they'd have just handed the ball off on every down it wouldn't have helped them, either.
In any case I'm not worried about the texans, all of the Jaguars problems facing that team have been on our own sideline. Give the Jaguars a real head coach and I guarantee the texans will be getting repeatedly swept just like they used to against the Manning led colts.
Quote:So you're saying if they got a game manager they might be able to not get humiliated?
I'd say they should already be humiliated for signing a game manager to such a massive contract, but I also disagree with you, Hoyer is a game manager, they weren't winning that game, and if they'd have just handed the ball off on every down it wouldn't have helped them, either.
In any case I'm not worried about the texans, all of the Jaguars problems facing that team have been on our own sideline. Give the Jaguars a real head coach and I guarantee the texans will be getting repeatedly swept just like they used to against the Manning led colts.
In their games last season when Hoyer (or Mallett) wasn't turning the ball over repeatedly, the Texans looked pretty good. Are they one of the top-tier, elite teams? Definitely not.
But, with that defense (as long as it continues to play very tough) combined with an offense that doesn't give the ball away 2 to 6 times a game, they can compete.
We've seen it time and again, even recently, where a team with a tough defense and an offense that doesn't turn the ball over can win and even go far (i.e. last year's Broncos, Panthers, Seahawks). Heck, even the Vikings with the epitome of a game manager QB and a tough defense was very good last year. They only lost their playoff game to the Seahawks by a chip-shot shank FG which would've won it.
Anyway, yes, the Texans can be a tough team if their defense stays very good and Osweiler manages some turnover-free games.
Just my opinion.
Quote:In their games last season when Hoyer (or Mallett) wasn't turning the ball over repeatedly, the Texans looked pretty good. Are they one of the top-tier, elite teams? Definitely not.
But, with that defense (as long as it continues to play very tough) combined with an offense that doesn't give the ball away 2 to 6 times a game, they can compete.
We've seen it time and again, even recently, where a team with a tough defense and an offense that doesn't turn the ball over can win and even go far (i.e. last year's Broncos, Panthers, Seahawks). Heck, even the Vikings with the epitome of a game manager QB and a tough defense was very good last year. They only lost their playoff game to the Seahawks by a chip-shot shank FG which would've won it.
Anyway, yes, the Texans can be a tough team if their defense stays very good and Osweiler manages some turnover-free games.
Just my opinion.
We'll just have to disagree. The texans managed to win a really terrible division with a game manager, but game managers get exposed against good teams. They never looked good unless you were comparing them against the Gus Bus here in Jacksonville, against which pretty much every team looks good.
You're barking up the wrong tree with the Broncos/Panthers/Seahawks stuff. All three of those teams had strong QBs, with Peyton being the weakest, but still obviously a guy that knew what he was doing under center.
Quote:We'll just have to disagree. The texans managed to win a really terrible division with a game manager, but game managers get exposed against good teams. They never looked good unless you were comparing them against the Gus Bus here in Jacksonville, against which pretty much every team looks good.
I think we're all saying the same thing here.
Brian Hoyer wasn't a very good game manager. Sure, he looked fine against the Jags, but not so good against avg & above avg defenses.
Tj Yates & Brandon Weeden proved to be better game managers beating NFL caliber defenses in the Bengals & Jets.
It would suck if Osweiler turns out to be nothing more than a game manager. We'll have to wait & see.
Jury is still out on Brock, but I think it's silly to consider him a game manager at this point. He went toe to toe against the Patriots and ended up winning in overtime.
Sure...vaunted Denver defense won.....but dig a little deeper and you will see Brady repeatedly score on that defense, only for Brock to even it up with a score of his own.
It's still too early to label the guy, but I dont see him as a game manager. He will either be boom or bust. He has a knack for being a "gunslinger" and that could be good or bad depending on his true skill set.
That Broncos defense allowed 24 points to the Patriots in regulation.
That's not defense winning a game. That's defense doing it's part. But the offense still had to score 24 points in regulation, then had to score in OT. The defense did it's part, but the offense did as well.
Quote:Jury is still out on Brock, but I think it's silly to consider him a game manager at this point. He went toe to toe against the Patriots and ended up winning in overtime.
Sure...vaunted Denver defense won.....but dig a little deeper and you will see Brady repeatedly score on that defense, only for Brock to even it up with a score of his own.
It's still too early to label the guy, but I dont see him as a game manager. He will either be boom or bust. He has a knack for being a "gunslinger" and that could be good or bad depending on his true skill set.
I think it was CJ Anderson who won that game. He went off on the Pats. Breaking tackles everywhere.