*Disclaimer* This question might be a little late since we justt signed malik and id say are likely out of the vernon sweepstakes but its still floating so i thought id finally ask.
pretty sure everyone was fine with Dante as the man at LEO last year despite being a rookie (obv) but then he tore his acl and all of a sudden its "we dont know who he is he hasnt played we cant bet on him!"
ACLs just arent that serious anymore so i cant imagine thats enough to need to basically replace him with what a lot of people hoped and are still hoping for in Olivier Vernon.
Im all for depth but i just cant understand this post-malik signing.
secondary disclaimer i feel like the internet adds about 10lbs of condescension but i promise its not im a nice guy
The plan was to get him reps behind Clem. We also hoped for Branch and Smith to turn a corner. Since none of that happened and Fowler torn his ACL in the first practice it became paramount to bring in some Leo help.
I still think Fowler will be a beast but to roll into the season with just him would be crazy.
Your starting 4 are Fowler/ Miller/ Jackson/ Vernon
Passing Downs Fowler/ Odrick/ Jackson/ Vernon
Quote:Your starting 4 are Fowler/ Miller/ Jackson/ Vernon
Passing Downs Fowler/ Odrick/ Jackson/ Vernon
Marks will be in there on passing downs
Quote:The plan was to get him reps behind Clem. We also hoped for Branch and Smith to turn a corner. Since none of that happened and Fowler torn his ACL in the first practice it became paramount to bring in some Leo help.
I still think Fowler will be a beast but to roll into the season with just him would be crazy.
totally but thats why im looking more towards solid depth additions rather than breaking the bank for vernon just cause fowler is a year late on his start. Seems like an overreaction imo.
We just need quality depth at the position... We really just need quality pass rushers
To be fair tho i really havent checked out too many cheap leo options on FA market so there very well could be none worthwhile which pokes a giant whole in what im saying
Quote:totally but thats why im looking more towards solid depth additions rather than breaking the bank for vernon just cause fowler is a year late on his start. Seems like an overreaction imo.
Even if he's a homerun hit we need more outside pass rushers. We're good on the interior, but Fowler is legit our only LEO right now and the only guy who has potential to get very good pressure from the outside. Malik can at the 5T potentially, and Odrick is OK, but we definitely need another good pass rusher on passing downs on the outside opposite Fowler. Right now that'd likely end up being Malik with Odrick/Marks inside. Think we'd be better off with Vernon and Fowler on the outside with Malik and Marks on the inside.
Quote:To be fair tho i really havent checked out too many cheap leo options on FA market so there very well could be none worthwhile which pokes a giant whole in what im saying
Robert Ayers is another solid guy I like. Reports are coming out he wants 8-10M per year though. Would rather pay up for Vernon who has more potential, younger, and probably a better fit.
Nothing changed............
You need 2-3 LEOs, period.
Fowler is basically a rookie, coming off an ACL. There's no need to rush him back, into a full 800-900 snaps role this season. You slowly work him back and keep him in a heavy rotation. We rotate our DL quite a bit anyways, so that's nothing new.
Even if we're able to sign Vernon, I expect another LEO type player to be signed/drafted.
Quote:Robert Ayers is another solid guy I like. Reports are coming out he wants 8-10M per year though. Would rather pay up for Vernon who has more potential, younger, and probably a better fit.
Ayers is a guy ive supported recently, slipped my mind.
I like actually like the fact that hes an older guy. Adds pash rush while still being fully committed to dante for the future, can get out of it when hes aging while dante will be coming along in his progression(ideally) and hes just a good football player.
Quote:Ayers is a guy ive supported recently, slipped my mind.
I like actually like the fact that hes an older guy. Adds pash rush while still being fully committed to dante for the future, can get out of it when hes aging while dante will be coming along in his progression(ideally) and hes just a good football player.
Ayers doesn't have a great track record though. He'd be a solid addition but if Fowler isn't full ready to go this year or struggles getting into things, I want much more than Ayers as reliable options.
We are trying to make the defensive line a strength of this team. Remember in 2007 when the Giants had guys like Strahan, Tuck, and Kiwanuka coming in waves against opposing offenses? I think it's time to do away with the labels of "starters", especially when you have quality depth. I want us to generate the pass rushing waves like the Giants did, where you're not losing talent when Fowler or Marks step off the field, you're only adding to your defensive pressure.
Imagine how much confusion you can cause with Fowler lined up everywhere and Jackson being able to line up at all 4 positions on the line, Odrick being able to play inside and out, Miller spelling them and giving you a different type of pass rush, Vernon coming off the edge beating on the RT, Marks splitting double teams....etc. Now imagine adding additional blitzes like a Telvin or a Jack shooting thru the Guard while he's too busy preoccupied with trying to identify and contain one of Jackson, Vernon, Marks, or Fowler....
Quote:totally but thats why im looking more towards solid depth additions rather than breaking the bank for vernon just cause fowler is a year late on his start. Seems like an overreaction imo.
I think this was the plan all along. Have all this cap to go after the best DTs and Leo in FA. Build the defense from the ground up. Fowler was a pick to build around but i think Caldwell knows it would take more than just him and Marks to makes us contenders in the AFC. Having the money to not only add multiple guys but arguably the best guys available who are also young would be paramount in acheiving that goal.
ok. So DE. Fowler/ Vernon- DT Jackson/ Marks- LB Jack (son!)- Poz- Smith CB House/Claiborne(Cyrus Jones)- FS-Sample (Joseph?) SS- Cyp (gotta fix this- takes tooooo many bad angles).
Quote:Your starting 4 are Fowler/ Miller/ Jackson/ Vernon
Passing Downs Fowler/ Odrick/ Jackson/ Vernon
Our run defense would be terrible. If they had signed Irvin then Fowler would have come off the bench. But now that Irvin isn't coming here I think Fowler is going to start at OTTO (which is what I've always thought would be the most likely outcome before people started talking about us and Irvin last week).
Quote:Your starting 4 are Fowler/ Miller/ Jackson/ Vernon
Passing Downs Fowler/ Odrick/ Jackson/ Vernon
Olivier vernon isn't a strong side end.
Pass rushers in football are like pitchers in baseball. You can never have enough.
Quote:Our run defense would be terrible. If they had signed Irvin then Fowler would have come off the bench. But now that Irvin isn't coming here I think Fowler is going to start at OTTO (which is what I've always thought would be the most likely outcome before people started talking about us and Irvin last week).
Wash surprisingly said that Fowler won't be playing OTTO.
If we get Vernon and Myles Jack then I think your front 7 looks like this:
LEO - Vernon, Fowler, Davis
DT - Malik, Marks, Bennett
NT - Miller, Jones
DE - Odrik, Alualu
WLB - Smith, Tripp
MLB - Poz/Jack
OTTO - Jack, Skuta
Then on 3rd down:
LEO - Vernon
DT - Malik
DT - Marks
LEO - Fowler
WLB - Smith
MLB - Jack
With 5 DBs