Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Quote:In this pass happy league, the d-linemen that get paid are guys that get after the QB.

 

And there were 15 guys that play the same role as him that took the QB down more than him.

Quote:Yea there's one minor difference in Jacksonville & Miami's situation, it's about $66million dollars in cap space, it could be a lot more if/when the Jags decide to cut some of the dead weight on this roster.

 

Yeah, and then when you give Bortles over $20 million and ARob $14 or $15 million and then you realized you wasted half of your remaining space on a DE/DT that splits his time and gets 4 or 5 sacks what will the difference between Jacksonville and Miami be?

Quote:And there were 15 guys that play the same role as him that took the QB down more than him.

 

We'll just have to agree to disagree, if your argument was "the Jags should pass on Jackson because this draft is rich on the interior of the DL" I would agree with you. But you're acting as if he doesn't deserve $15-18M a year, I disagree. Halfway effective (Vinny Curry) pass rushers are breaking bank, Malik Jackson will get paid big bucks because that's what the market dictates.

Quote:1.) hes a 3 4 end.


2.) youre right. Why in hell would u pay an interior lineman like an elite edge rusher?


50 million guarenteed 84 million over 6 years for bleeping hurries?


Miami is already trying to restructure suh because they realize how stupid this is.


If marks comes back healthy hell be the most overpaid backup in history

 

Google "inflation" and "salary cap increase".

 

Hope that helps!

Quote:Yeah, and then when you give Bortles over $20 million and ARob $14 or $15 million and then you realized you wasted half of your remaining space on a DE/DT that splits his time and gets 4 or 5 sacks what will the difference between Jacksonville and Miami be?

Thats why you front load the contract so by year one or two the contract is re-adjusted to market value. That way if they need to cut them its all good and if they keep producing then you have a good players for less than their true value in years 3-5.

Quote:Dude you gotta wake up. Players like Dalton are getting 100 million dollar contracts. I just showed you Currys stats and he's getting 9.5 mil. Vernon almost doubled his production. I would put that around 15-18 mil. I did say range because we have seen instances where one team will completely out and over bid other team (e.g. Murray last year).


I understand you assigned a value to these guys. I was hoping we could get Vernon for like 10-12 a year and Curry for like 6 a year as a thrid rotational guy and be set. When i saw what Curry got that automatically adjusted my expectaions for Vernons salary. Not because i though he was worth more but because the market changed. Curry isnt worth 9.5 but that what he's getting now. Guys who effect the qb come a premium. You either draft them then pay em. Or pay them. Either way your gonna pay.



Its not about what you assign there value as. Its about do you feel comfortable giving them that much. If you get a quality player then in my mind it shouldnt matter within reason. Im cool with paying him 14 espcially with the state of defense is in and our healthy cap situation going forward. The situation we currently in makes me fine with bending my own rules of over paying guys because 1) we suck and 2) the cap space we have is amazing coupled with how the structure contracts now. Our contract department is doing a good job with contract structure.



Im not saying you are wrong. I did think like that not to long ago but once it set in how much we really have and that we really dont have to re-sign anybody for at least 2 years we are beyond good. Thats not counting anyone we may draft who becomes a better cheap replacement in that time frame.

 

Vinny Curry getting $9.5 million was absolutely dumb and if your model for how things should be done is what the Eagles have done the last few years then there in lies the rub.  The Eagles have repeatedly given dumb, overpriced contract after dumb, overpriced contract and regret them all.  

 

Like I've mentioned so many times before, the cap went up 8%... You don't suddenly double players' salaries, which is what you are proposing will happen to every player this year.  

 

Derek Wolfe, essentially his equal in Denver, just got a $9 million dollar contract so you should use that as a barometer instead of someone grossly overpaid by a franchise that likes to grossly overpay like the Eagles.

Quote:If Odrick made $8.5 last year and is the 2nd highest paid LDE in the league, $9 million is obviously a reasonable estimate.  The $14 million contract is what is being brandied about by other posters as saying what they would like to pay for Malik.  Show me what makes Jackson over $6 million dollars better than Jared Odrick.  Please justify it.

I re-read the thread. Guess who the first person to type $14 million was.


I've already explained twice how I justify paying him that much. The team that knows him better than any other has already set his floor at $10 million right now. If they'll pay $10 million, we can pay $12 million to get him here.

Apparently FreeAgent01 is an advocate of only signing Free Agents on D to cheap contracts.

Quote:We'll just have to agree to disagree, if your argument was "the Jags should pass on Jackson because this draft is rich on the interior of the DL" I would agree with you. But you're acting as if he doesn't deserve $15-18M a year, I disagree. Halfway effective (Vinny Curry) pass rushers are breaking bank, Malik Jackson will get paid big bucks because that's what the market dictates.

 

My argument is two-fold:

 

1.) Absolutely he does not deserve $15-18M per year.  He doesn't deserve the $10-11 million I feel should be his actual market value.

 

2.) We don't have any urgent need for a player in his role to be paying that kind of money.

 

Consider this:

 

Only 3 pass rushers in the entire NFL even make more than $11 million dollars per year entering free agency.  Three.  And you want to pay him like JJ Watt, Justin Houston, and Robert Quinn.  No.  Just no.

Quote:Apparently FreeAgent01 is an advocate of only signing Free Agents on D to cheap contracts.

 

it just baffles me how any Jag fan would be opposed to paying a player of Jackson's caliber big bucks, the Jags cap situation is unreal, almost infinite. We should sign as many defensive playmakers as we can get.

Quote:Google "inflation" and "salary cap increase".

 

Hope that helps!

 

Now go pay $100,000 for a new Camry because of inflation.

Quote:Now go pay $100,000 for a new Camry because of inflation.

 

Well if that's what the market dictates...

Quote: 

Only 3 pass rushers in the entire NFL even make more than $11 million dollars per year entering free agency.  Three.  And you want to pay him like JJ Watt, Justin Houston, and Robert Quinn.  No.  Just no.

Completely wrong.

Quote:I re-read the thread. Guess who the first person to type $14 million was.


I've already explained twice how I justify paying him that much. The team that knows him better than any other has already set his floor at $10 million right now. If they'll pay $10 million, we can pay $12 million to get him here.

 

Go read the FA Wishlist thread and that's where I first picked it up.  Plus reading the interwebs I've seen rumors of $14 million.  Just a few posts ago someone proposted $15-18 million for Malik freaking Jackson....

Quote:Well if that's what the market dictates...

 

Does it?

Quote:Completely wrong.

 

Not wrong at all.  Go look it up.  I did.  I omitted contracts like Mario Williams who will be cut, but its absolutely true.

Quote:Go read the FA Wishlist thread and that's where I first picked it up.  Plus reading the interwebs I've seen rumors of $14 million.  Just a few posts ago someone proposted $15-18 million for Malik freaking Jackson....

 

Does the "per year" salary matter? It's all about the guaranteed money.

Quote:Vinny Curry getting $9.5 million was absolutely dumb and if your model for how things should be done is what the Eagles have done the last few years then there in lies the rub. The Eagles have repeatedly given dumb, overpriced contract after dumb, overpriced contract and regret them all.


Like I've mentioned so many times before, the cap went up 8%... You don't suddenly double players' salaries, which is what you are proposing will happen to every player this year.


Derek Wolfe, essentially his equal in Denver, just got a $9 million dollar contract so you should use that as a barometer instead of someone grossly overpaid by a franchise that likes to grossly overpay like the Eagles.

You are missing the point. It doesnt matter what you believe the value to be. The reality is that these guys are gonna be over paid. Curry set the market. The agents are now saying if Curry got that much with 16 sacks my guy with 20 sacks needs more. And guess what its gonna happen. This happens every year and will continue to happen. The difference is we have enough money to where it would not hurt us if we got in on that action. Guys will get over paid this year just like they did last year and the year before.



Were in agrement that it possibly is dumb but we need players and we are in a positon to over pay to get them and it not hurt us going forward. It sounds like Caldwell wont over pay any way so this is a non issue anymore. Im just saying we shouldnt be scared to pay guys espcially if it wont hurt us going forward.

Quote:Does it?

 

Come on man, pass rushers are at a premium, especially young pass rushers as they never make it to FA. The salary cap is up, and multiple teams are flushed with cap space. You answer the question.

Quote:Does the "per year" salary matter? It's all about the guaranteed money.

Thank you for logic.