08-19-2015, 04:35 PM
08-19-2015, 04:39 PM
Quote:I go back and forth on this topic...It is a very solid argument.
For the life of me I can't believe I'm saying this, but I see the validity of jj's argument...
08-19-2015, 04:48 PM
Quote:I go back and forth on this topic...
For the life of me I can't believe I'm saying this, but I see the validity of jj's argument...
Don't worry, we will soon bring you over to the dark side.
08-19-2015, 04:57 PM
Quote:Don't worry, we will soon bring you over to the dark side.there is not enough punch and or pie
08-19-2015, 05:18 PM
Quote:there is not enough punch and or pie
But we have cookies!
08-19-2015, 05:21 PM
Quote:there is not enough punch and or pie
And Beer!
08-19-2015, 05:29 PM
Quote:But we have cookies!
Quote:And Beer!Don't you DARE do this to me!
08-19-2015, 05:48 PM
Just relax.... this is where the healing begins.
08-19-2015, 05:49 PM
Quote:And Beer!
I thought it was understood that all the beer has been allocated to the republican debate thread.
08-19-2015, 07:19 PM
The figures In that article don't make sense.
Also if you are paying more than all your competitors this is likely to happen...Doesn't mean we should race to the bottom on pay scales
Also if you are paying more than all your competitors this is likely to happen...Doesn't mean we should race to the bottom on pay scales
08-19-2015, 07:34 PM
Refusing to artificially inflate pay is not a race to the bottom. I'm all for sensible increases to the minimum wage, and a blanket $15/hr is not sensible.
08-19-2015, 07:36 PM
Come to Australia with a similar minimum wage. People still eat pizza...
08-19-2015, 10:39 PM
08-19-2015, 11:52 PM
Quote:Come to Australia with a similar minimum wage. People still eat pizza...
Well what do you know, $15 Au = $11.02 USD
08-20-2015, 12:39 AM
The minimum wage is more than 15. Also the Aussie dollar Was buying over 1 to 1 not long ago...exchange rates move.
Oops...
Oops...
08-20-2015, 06:15 AM
Quote:Refusing to artificially inflate pay is not a race to the bottom. I'm all for sensible increases to the minimum wage, and a blanket $15/hr is not sensible.
At least we can all agree a blanket $15 minimum wage isn't realistic.
08-20-2015, 07:26 AM
Quote:At least we can all agree a blanket $15 minimum wage isn't realistic.
Here's how I see it... From a small business / middle class worker point of view...
The number 1 employer in the USA is Walmart (I heard this on some news show). Walmart imports most of the goods from overseas in order to keep thier costs low. They also have economies of scale, so when they purchase thier goods for sale, they get a discount that a smaller business could not get... So they have driven their costs down, and have in essence driven out small business competitiors. The only people that can compete with Walmart's prices are the other big chains (Target, Costco, ETC)...
To exaserbate this, we have move to becoming a service based economy, we really don't manufacture that much, except for war materials... So we have no high paying manufacturing jobs available to workes. And even in the service based economy, the major players are generally large conglomerated corporations. So based on our economic policies of little regulation and free trade agreements we've helped the big businesses at the expense of small businesses and middle class workers.
It's time to level the playing field. It's time to put in some rules that even's the costs that small businesses cannot compete with.
I got to get ready for the day... But it's something I'm thinking about in regards to the minimum wage. Consider this: A minimum wage that only affects the consolidated corporations that are traded publicly but does not affect small businesses could potentially help level the playing field and allow small businesses to compete...
At the end of the day, small businesses are would will help our economy. If we concede that manufacturing is never coming back, we should begin to figure out a way to ensure we as educated and skilled middle class workers are not having our wages stagnate. And we should also come up with solutions the level the playing field so that markets are not dominated and taken over by only a few corporations that own all the market share.
08-20-2015, 09:45 AM
Quote:At least we can all agree a blanket $15 minimum wage isn't realistic.
20 may be more appropriate in NYC.
08-20-2015, 11:01 AM
Right now Walmart operates at roughly a 3% profit margin. That's hardly a profiteering glutton. I have a close family friend that used to be involved as as a human resource manager for walmart. one of interesting things about their business model is that they have one of the most liberal promotion policies around. They are very clear about the fact that you can come in as a cashier making 7.25 and as you learn and grow in your knowledge and performance you can become the manager of a profit center or greater.
Now, let me tell you the sad part. When he would do interviews for managerial promotions he had a hallmark question that he asked everyone "what have you done outside work in the last six months to improve your skill set" He never really got a satisfactory answer to that question.
When you have a situation where individuals are given an open door to advance and for whatever reason don't invest in themselves, i don't think we as a society should use the power of government to artificially raise wages just so we can pay higher prices.
Also, just because a company is publicly traded doesn't mean its just going gang busters. My wife works in photography. Here company is going through constant restructuring because in the last few years they have been breaking even or posting losses. In this are forcing that kind of increase could cause them to fire people or shutter their doors. I'm self employed, the contributions they make to the health insurance that we use doesn't count to her hourly wage so if the cost of keeping her at a higher hourly rate meant they scrapped her health care coverage is that really a win for us?
The infinite amount of details about any one given economic decision is why historically Central Economic Planning and wage/price controls DON'T WORK!
Now, let me tell you the sad part. When he would do interviews for managerial promotions he had a hallmark question that he asked everyone "what have you done outside work in the last six months to improve your skill set" He never really got a satisfactory answer to that question.
When you have a situation where individuals are given an open door to advance and for whatever reason don't invest in themselves, i don't think we as a society should use the power of government to artificially raise wages just so we can pay higher prices.
Also, just because a company is publicly traded doesn't mean its just going gang busters. My wife works in photography. Here company is going through constant restructuring because in the last few years they have been breaking even or posting losses. In this are forcing that kind of increase could cause them to fire people or shutter their doors. I'm self employed, the contributions they make to the health insurance that we use doesn't count to her hourly wage so if the cost of keeping her at a higher hourly rate meant they scrapped her health care coverage is that really a win for us?
The infinite amount of details about any one given economic decision is why historically Central Economic Planning and wage/price controls DON'T WORK!
08-20-2015, 01:09 PM
If you go back to the article, you'll note that the minimum wage in San Fran is already $12.25 as of May 2015.
The economy in the Bay Area has not collapsed. In fact, it's advancing as hard as ever. But that's not my point.
The pizza joint increased their minimum wage to $15. If they'd started out at $12.25, a 20% increase is $2.45.
$12.25 + $2.45 = $14.70
So in reality, these guys increased their employees wages by 30 cents an hour and eliminated the tips, which in Berkley/Emeryville are near 20%.
The restaurant is learning the important lesson that most have when trying to eliminate tips - it's a hard sell to the American consumer.
The economy in the Bay Area has not collapsed. In fact, it's advancing as hard as ever. But that's not my point.
The pizza joint increased their minimum wage to $15. If they'd started out at $12.25, a 20% increase is $2.45.
$12.25 + $2.45 = $14.70
So in reality, these guys increased their employees wages by 30 cents an hour and eliminated the tips, which in Berkley/Emeryville are near 20%.
The restaurant is learning the important lesson that most have when trying to eliminate tips - it's a hard sell to the American consumer.