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Quote:PFF did overrate McCray. As another poster said, why go McCray's way if the middle of the defense and other corners are easy pickings. McCray's ranking was biased, but still supports the eye test that he is a good player. Just not great yet.

I agree with this to a point. He wasn't overrated that much by pff however he did benefit. Let's not forget he was lined up against nr 1 receivers a lot though which pushes it down the other way.


I agree he's not great yet, however people on here are talking about him not even being good in what they say, I think saying Colvin had a better year than McCray is ridiculous, yes Colvin made more plays, but as I said McCray is a shutdown type, and Colvin is a ballhawk type.

Quote:Did PFF overrate McCray aswel because he was the 4th best cb in the league for yards allowed per snap behind only Sherman, Norman and Chris Harris for Cbs with more than 300 snaps.


But yeah I guess we're all overrating him.

<a class="bbc_url" href='https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2015/02/13/sig-stats-ypcs-cornerbacks/'>https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2015/02/13/sig-stats-ypcs-cornerbacks/</a>

According to that article it was based on Yards Per Cover Snap (YPCS) which measures the yardage conceded when a player is in primary coverage, on a per snap basis.  I think you didn't read the article fully because it had Allen Ball as the 4th according to the best on each team which they had Ball rated better than Revis so yes PFF did a bad job at judging CBs in my opinion the YPCS was wrong.

Of course GM & HC let Ball go to FA so if he was rated better by PFF why didn't they listen?  lol

 

 

Colvin appears to be outplaying Demetrius McCray opposite Davon House. A 2014 fourth-round pick, Colvin redshirted most of his rookie year on the injured reserve-designated for return list after tearing his ACL at the 2014 Senior Bowl. Colvin might have been a first-round pick if healthy last offseason. In nickel, Colvin figures to cover the slot with McCray entering outside. Aug 8 - 11:11 PM - Rotoworld

Quote:According to that article it was based on Yards Per Cover Snap (YPCS) which measures the yardage conceded when a player is in primary coverage, on a per snap basis. I think you didn't read the article fully because it had Allen Ball as the 4th according to the best on each team which they had Ball rated better than Revis so yes PFF did a bad job at judging CBs in my opinion the YPCS was wrong.

Of course GM & HC let Ball go to FA so if he was rated better by PFF why didn't they listen? lol



Colvin appears to be outplaying Demetrius McCray opposite Davon House. A 2014 fourth-round pick, Colvin redshirted most of his rookie year on the injured reserve-designated for return list after tearing his ACL at the 2014 Senior Bowl. Colvin might have been a first-round pick if healthy last offseason. In nickel, Colvin figures to cover the slot with McCray entering outside. Aug 8 - 11:11 PM - Rotoworld

If you'd of read what I put I put over 300snaps which Indicates they played a lot of the teams snaps. You could quite easily see ball did not play 300 snaps.


But you know what, you're right the website that dedicates itself to statistics by meticulously studying game film and recording the information MUST of got its stats wrong because they don't fit with your opinion.

Quote:

Why are we even arguing between McCray and Colvin. Everything I've seen is that they both look like starting CB's to me.


I hope House isn't getting inserted as a starter just because he was brought in during FA for a good amount of money. Maybe House should come off the bench when Colvin bumps inside on nickel downs. Can we let the guys have true competition and let the best guys be the "starters." Even though they will all play plenty.

I agree with the bolded. Considering the D will be in nickel 70% of the time you can consider House/Colvin/McCray all starters regardless of fan sentiment or guaranteed FA money.

I am more worried about the Safeties and if they will be at least average compared to the league. 

Quote:I am more worried about the Safeties and if they will be at least average compared to the league.

Bortles and our WR should be able to take advantage of that secondary

Quote:I am more worried about the Safeties and if they will be at least average compared to the league. 

 

Our corners will be about average this year I believe.  Our safeties are still bottom 5 units in the league.  

Quote:I really like McCray as well.


Here's a question... It's early in the morning, so I must be missing something.. but why not have colvin starting on one side and McCray on the other side?

 

 

My thoughts precisely reading this thread. I definitely rank McCray over House at this point.

Quote:So then you have House as your nickel? 

 

 

No... Colvin would move inside in nickel packages with House taking over outside. But at no point do you not have McCray starting outside as their top CB.

Quote:My thoughts precisely reading this thread. I definitely rank McCray over House at this point.

Based on what?

Quote:No... Colvin would move inside in nickel packages with House taking over outside. But at no point do you not have McCray starting outside as their top CB.

 

 

I'll let the coaches decide and whatever they think will be good enough for me.  Colvin and House or Colvin and McCray.

Yeah....  um, I don't think they paid Davon House 24 mil  (10 guaranteed)  to come in and be the third CB on the depth chart. 

 

They did it because they believe House is equal to or better than those guys.  He's also the #1 CB on the depth chart that came out three days ago because they still believe the above to be true. 

 

Will be fun to watch it shake out. They are all young and ascending.  Could be a great trio for this secondary for years to come. 

 

Right now it's :

 

House

McCray / Colvin

Gratz

Harris

Campbell

Marshall

Quote:Cornerback is the one position in the nfl where stats is misleading. Just look at Darrele Revis his int/game isn't great his ff/fr per game isn't nor his tackles. But his undoubtedly the best corner in the game, the reason why his stats are so low? People don't throw his way.


On stats alone Sherman is night and day ahead of revis, but do stats take Into account how much zone Sherman plays where's he's facing the cb to make the pick? No? Do they take into account he only plays one side? No.


McCrays potentially if he develops upon last year is as a shutdown corner.


Colvins is as a ballhawk.

cc

2 different type of corners completely. I for one would love them both to start..

 

 

Exactly. Colvin reminds me of Aaron Beasley who was an absolute beast in zone coverage whereas McCray has simply been shutting down his side of the field even against great WRs. Granted McCray needs some more big plays on his resume, but remember he's still developing. That's his next step.


 

At this point I won't compare him to the game's elite CBs like Revis, but I might compare him to a borderline top 10 CB like Desmond Trufant, Josh Norman or Stephen Gilmore. McCray just needs a couple INTs to receive as much acclaim.

Quote:No... Colvin would move inside in nickel packages with House taking over outside. But at no point do you not have McCray starting outside as their top CB.

 

Not according to the coaches and the depth chart.

 

The plan is Colvin and House outside, with McCray subbing in when Colvin moves inside on 3rd down/nickel.

 

McCray is our third best corner.  That's not a bad thing.  It's a good thing.

Quote:Based on what?

 

 

My eyes.


 

Besides, it's not like House is an INT machine. The guy only has 1 INT in each of the past two seasons, and zero over his first two seasons. McCray also has far more starts on his resume to go along with more tackles and passes defensed. Why should House rank higher? Because he makes more money?

Quote:Not according to the coaches and the depth chart.

 

The plan is Colvin and House outside, with McCray subbing in when Colvin moves inside on 3rd down/nickel.

 

McCray is our third best corner.  That's not a bad thing.  It's a good thing.

 

 

Show me the quote from any coach saying House is better than McCray. The depth chart lists both CBs as starters which puts them on an equal footing so I don't know what you're talking about there. Colvin is listed as the nickel. Simply put, McCray is our best shutdown CB, and this is a good thing.

Quote:Yeah....  um, I don't think they paid Davon House 24 mil  (10 guaranteed)  to come in and be the third CB on the depth chart. 

 

They did it because they believe House is equal to or better than those guys.  He's also the #1 CB on the depth chart that came out three days ago because they still believe the above to be true.

 

 

Indeed House is listed as a #1 CB... and so is McCray. Nothing about the depth chart gives either player precedence.


 

As for the money, that's a typical contract for a FA CB. You simply can't get a decent one for less, and his contract says nothing whatsoever about the other players on the roster.


 

I don't know why you're all going ga ga over House. I haven't heard a peep from coaches or the media about House just shutting down players in practice or anything else. I'm sure he's a good one or Caldwell wouldn't have picked him up, but these assumptions about him being better than McCray are just that...assumptions.

Quote:Indeed House is listed as a #1 CB... and so is McCray. Nothing about the depth chart gives either player precedence.


 

As for the money, that's a typical contract for a FA CB. You simply can't get a decent one for less, and his contract says nothing whatsoever about the other players on the roster.


 

I don't know why you're all going ga ga over House.
I haven't heard a peep from coaches or the media about House just shutting down players in practice or anything else. I'm sure he's a good one or Caldwell wouldn't have picked him up, but these assumptions about him being better than McCray are just that...assumptions.

 

Huh? 

 

didn't happen

Quote:Why are we even arguing between McCray and Colvin. Everything I've seen is that they both look like starting CB's to me.


I hope House isn't getting inserted as a starter just because he was brought in during FA for a good amount of money. Maybe House should come off the bench when Colvin bumps inside on nickel downs. Can we let the guys have true competition and let the best guys be the "starters." Even though they will all play plenty.

 

 

Quote:That's the thing. I completely agree with that.


Regardless of who's the "starters" House and McCray will play outside when Colvin is at Nickel. And he'll probably play there a lot, I'm going to assume he'll be at nickel most of the time since we'll regularly have 3 DBs out there

 

 

Totally agree. Well said.

I was wondering if there was some myterious depth chart I'm not seeing listing House and Colvin as starters given some of the above responses. The official one lists McCray and House as starters with Colvin in a separate starting spot by himself which I assume is suggesting nickel. So I looked back at Oesher's article where he talks about the depth chart being released. He has one comment about the starting CBs where he says...


 

<p style="margin-left:40px;">*Cornerback, where Demetrius McCray and Aaron Colvin were listed as co-starters. Colvin has worked at outside and nickel corner during camp, and could play both roles during the regular season.

<p style="margin-left:40px;"> 

So I ask again... Where is this assumption that House is somehow above McCray on the depth chart coming from?