Story I loathe Fox News but it has the story.....
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"WASHINGTON – A proposal in Seattle meant to increase homeownership among Muslims by offering financing compliant with strict Islamic law -- known as Sharia -- is gaining ground in the latest test for local leaders trying to accommodate diverse religious beliefs.
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"We will work to develop new tools for Muslims who are prevented from using conventional mortgage products due to their religious beliefs," Seattle Mayor Ed Murray said during a press conference July 13.
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"Sharia," which comes from the Koran and means "the right path," prohibits the payment of interest -- the primary way lenders earn. Many of Seattle's 30,000 practicing Muslims, therefore, are hard-pressed to find Sharia-compliant financing options when buying homes, making large purchases or starting a business."
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What are your thoughts?
Quote:Story I loathe Fox News but it has the story.....
<p style="font-size:17px;font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;">"WASHINGTON – A proposal in Seattle meant to increase homeownership among Muslims by offering financing compliant with strict Islamic law -- known as Sharia -- is gaining ground in the latest test for local leaders trying to accommodate diverse religious beliefs.
<p style="font-size:17px;font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;">"We will work to develop new tools for Muslims who are prevented from using conventional mortgage products due to their religious beliefs," Seattle Mayor Ed Murray said during a press conference July 13.
<p style="font-size:17px;font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;">"Sharia," which comes from the Koran and means "the right path," prohibits the payment of interest -- the primary way lenders earn. Many of Seattle's 30,000 practicing Muslims, therefore, are hard-pressed to find Sharia-compliant financing options when buying homes, making large purchases or starting a business."
<p style="font-size:17px;font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;">What are your thoughts?
I don't know why you "loathe" FOX News, but that's an entirely different topic.
I personally think that it's a bad idea. If it's what I think it is, it would be government forcing lenders to offer this product. The problem is, traditional mortgages are often done in terms of 15 or 30 years. What were the interest rates 15 years ago and 30 years ago? What are they today? There is no way to determine what the "value" of a loan will be over the course of that much time to a lender.
Also, mortgage lenders are private business. The are free to choose who they will loan money to, how much interest they will charge and the terms that they agree to. They should not be forced to change the way that they do business in order to accommodate someone simply for their religious belief.
Quote:I don't know why you "loathe" FOX News, but that's an entirely different topic.
I personally think that it's a bad idea. If it's what I think it is, it would be government forcing lenders to offer this product. The problem is, traditional mortgages are often done in terms of 15 or 30 years. What were the interest rates 15 years ago and 30 years ago? What are they today? There is no way to determine what the "value" of a loan will be over the course of that much time to a lender.
Also, mortgage lenders are private business. The are free to choose who they will loan money to, how much interest they will charge and the terms that they agree to. They should not be forced to change the way that they do business in order to accommodate someone simply for their religious belief.
I loathe all mainstream media. Sadly it's all there is so I have to deal with it if I want to see news.
And I agree with the bolded area. Sadly it may come down to the same issues private businesses have who don't want to cater to gay folks because of their religious beliefs. You can't discriminate against anyone regardless of their gender, race, religious beliefs, sexual preference, etc.
Quote:I loathe all mainstream media. Sadly it's all there is so I have to deal with it if I want to see news.
And I agree with the bolded area. Sadly it may come down to the same issues private businesses have who don't want to cater to gay folks because of their religious beliefs. You can't discriminate against anyone regardless of their gender, race, religious beliefs, sexual preference, etc.
The thing is, the business isn't discriminating against the customer for anything. They offer a product, and anyone including a Muslim can use their product. If it's against the customer's religious beliefs to use that product, then it's the customer's problem not the business's problem.
Think of it this way. Say my Vulcan belief prohibits me from getting a loan that includes interest. I want to buy a new car. Should my bank or credit union be
forced to give me a loan solely because of my belief? No.
The bank or credit union is going to look at my credit report and determine whether or not I'm an acceptable risk, then they'll set the interest rate based on the perceived risk. If I make my payments on time, then the bank/credit union makes the money that they calculated. If I'm late on a payment or two, then the bank makes more money on my loan. If I pay my loan off early, then the bank/credit union doesn't make as much money.
My point is, the bank/credit union has a policy in place to loan money. That policy is based on my credit score/credit history. It has nothing to do with me being a Vulcan, Christian, black, white Hispanic or otherwise. If a lending institution is forced to alter the way that they do business, it's going to be bad not only for said institution, but also bad for consumers.
Quote:The thing is, the business isn't discriminating against the customer for anything. They offer a product, and anyone including a Muslim can use their product. If it's against the customer's religious beliefs to use that product, then it's the customer's problem not the business's problem.
Think of it this way. Say my Vulcan belief prohibits me from getting a loan that includes interest. I want to buy a new car. Should my bank or credit union be forced to give me a loan solely because of my belief? No.
The bank or credit union is going to look at my credit report and determine whether or not I'm an acceptable risk, then they'll set the interest rate based on the perceived risk. If I make my payments on time, then the bank/credit union makes the money that they calculated. If I'm late on a payment or two, then the bank makes more money on my loan. If I pay my loan off early, then the bank/credit union doesn't make as much money.
My point is, the bank/credit union has a policy in place to loan money. That policy is based on my credit score/credit history. It has nothing to do with me being a Vulcan, Christian, black, white Hispanic or otherwise. If a lending institution is forced to alter the way that they do business, it's going to be bad not only for said institution, but also bad for consumers.
Exactly,
They offer a product (loans with interest) they do not off loans without interest (probably). It's not a product they offer therefore it's not discrimination just like it's not discrimination to go into a Jewish deli and ask for bacon. They don't carry or sell bacon.
Quote:I loathe all mainstream media. Sadly it's all there is so I have to deal with it if I want to see news.
And I agree with the bolded area. Sadly it may come down to the same issues private businesses have who don't want to cater to gay folks because of their religious beliefs. You can't discriminate against anyone regardless of their gender, race, religious beliefs, sexual preference, etc.
This isn't the same thing.
This is absolutely ridiculous. If something like this ever goes through I could see a lot of new Muslims appearing out of nowhere and ultimately higher interest rates for everyone else.
You want a Sharia loan? Fine. Your house will have a 10% processing fee added to the principal balance.
Quote:This isn't the same thing.
Sure it is, it's about the government/community/customer having a say in how a business operates. Just because it's not a typically favored group doesn't mean it's not the same thing.
Perhaps I missed something - was there more to this story than given in the post?
Talk about looking for something to get upset about. Muslim alert!!! Muslim alert!!!
Where is the part about making private lenders do anything? Where is the part that they get special deals for less than you or I would pay?
Perhaps the loans will be for a greater total, i.e., a total that would include what the interest would be over the course of the loan.
Don't hurt your back looking under the bed for the Monster Muslim.
Talk about unfair to people who've paid thousands of dollars in interest because of no other choice.
I don't see any way this thing passes into reality,, unless Principal prices are raised so they in effect pay approximately the same as others that paid interest.
No way anyone should be able to claim that is unfair due to discrimination. To allow much cheaper prices to one group of people (regardless of who they are,,religious/race/gender) is completely unfair to everyone else.
Quote:Perhaps the loans will be for a greater total, i.e., a total that would include what the interest would be over the course of the loan
That's my thinking as well.
Quote:Isn't 10% a little low?
Hypothetical number I threw out there. I figured it was probably very low.
Usually with Fox, there's a key aspect of a story like this that's left out...
So what's the big deal? If a private lender sees an untapped market and is trying to package loans to a group that for whatever reason isn't participating good for the investor. Either they'll figure out how to make money or they won't make very many loans. That's called capitalism, catering services to the market it's what investors are supposed to do.
Now if the state was funding the investment that's a different story but I don't think that's what's going on. They won't call it interest they'll call it fees is my guess. Here's a 200k loan for your house Muhammad each time you make your 1500 payment we're charging a $500 fee and transferring $600 in escrow to pay the taxes and insurance, nope we'll never charge you any interest just the flat fee each payment Muhammad.
Quote:Sure it is, it's about the government/community/customer having a say in how a business operates. Just because it's not a typically favored group doesn't mean it's not the same thing.
I already explained this and for some reason have to keep explaining it. What's so hard to understand about the difference between selling a product you would sell to group a to group b as well and not selling a product you don't currently sell?
Quote:So what's the big deal? If a private lender sees an untapped market and is trying to package loans to a group that for whatever reason isn't participating good for the investor. Either they'll figure out how to make money or they won't make very many loans. That's called capitalism, catering services to the market it's what investors are supposed to do.
Now if the state was funding the investment that's a different story but I don't think that's what's going on. They won't call it interest they'll call it fees is my guess. Here's a 200k loan for your house Muhammad each time you make your 1500 payment we're charging a $500 fee and transferring $600 in escrow to pay the taxes and insurance, nope we'll never charge you any interest just the flat fee each payment Muhammad.
There is really no room for rationality when there is something to freak out about.
Quote:So what's the big deal? If a private lender sees an untapped market and is trying to package loans to a group that for whatever reason isn't participating good for the investor. Either they'll figure out how to make money or they won't make very many loans. That's called capitalism, catering services to the market it's what investors are supposed to do.
Now if the state was funding the investment that's a different story but I don't think that's what's going on. They won't call it interest they'll call it fees is my guess. Here's a 200k loan for your house Muhammad each time you make your 1500 payment we're charging a $500 fee and transferring $600 in escrow to pay the taxes and insurance, nope we'll never charge you any interest just the flat fee each payment Muhammad.
That's what it sounds like to me. The government is trying to break down barriers that would prevent banks from creating loans that would fit with the sincerely held religious beliefs of Sharia Muslims. If this were "Christians" instead of "muslims" I imagine people would be calling this a good thing. But since it's Muslims...
Quote:I already explained this and for some reason have to keep explaining it. What's so hard to understand about the difference between selling a product you would sell to group a to group b as well and not selling a product you don't currently sell?
What's so hard about its not really anyone's business in either case?