I was talking to a guy at work about this earlier in the week. I understand Foles has done some great things on a loaded Philly team but the Jags are not loaded offensively. Foles has thrown over 2,200 yards only once in his career- Bortles never less than 2,700, only thrown for double digit TD's twice- B every year, most attempted passes in a season 337- B 403 lowest amount of att, most times sacked in a season 28- B lowest 24 and highest 55, most games started in a year was 11 and he was pretty bad, Foles int/td ratio is skewed because of 1 amazing season. This is not to prop Bortles up but just to show an idea of what Foles brings to the table for a below average offense. If you can get him for a realistic contract, not some Cousins type of contract then by all means pick him up. But if his price is too high and you cannot get Haskins without trading up and please NO KM, then I say trade a 3rd for a guy that was a top 10 pick and has already played one year on the NFL level behind a terrible line. I would hope they are using one of the top 3 round picks on a QB regardless, isn't Rosen a much better option than any of the QB's you are going to pick up in rounds 2 or 3? Personally, I'd prolly even give the second pick for him if that's what it took but that's just me. FA I'd try to get LB CJ Mosley assuming he can play the middle in a 4-3, TE- Jesse James, OL either Mitch Morse, Matt Paradis, or Ja'waun James. Draft TE, OL, RB, DT, FS.

What you are saying here makes a lot of since and I don't completely dis agree with you. But there are some important things to remember when using Bortles' stats as a crutch. First, I have never been one to bang the "garbage time" stats drum. But let's be honest, a lot of BB's production was inflated by putting up numbers late in games that were out of reach against prevent/soft coverage. And we can't say he didn't always have weapons, there was a time we had two receivers who are starting caliber receiver. One of which(hurns) took quite a few thumps over the middle going after BB balls( a lot of recievers take those licks but a lot passes didn't do him any favors). I'm not just trying rip Bortles apart, but coming from someone who defended him through most of his time here in duval, I have to call it like I see it when I look back. Stats may suggest one thing, but I watched every one of his games, they don't tell the whole story.

Then let's look at the biggest factor, at least IMO. The throwing motion/mechanics and decision making/reads. Bortles mechanics are not great( putting it lightly). I remember when back corner fades in the end zone were almost automatic to Robinson. Then it turned into a time where the crowd had a better shot at the ball. His wind up and release are not quick to say the least. His Footwork in the pocket is also not great. Occasionally you see a pass come out that looks like a punt(I remember a time when people were sharing tweets on here that were excited about BB throwing a tight spiral.... really). Couple that with the slow to poor decision makings that forces coordinators to dumb down schemes for him, and you have a yourself a BB. Foles on the other hand doesn't share these same characteristics( at least not to the level of B.B.). On top of that we brought in one of his coaches from his sb run with at philly as a OC.

I'm not saying foles is the best in the league. But he is certainly a upgrade. We don't need a world beater GOAT qb. We just need someone who doesn't put our D in bad positions with ints and quick 3 and outs and demands a little respect in the passing game from opposing Ds so we don't face a stacked box every run. Foles, imo, fits the build quite nicely the more I look.

My main reason for comparing NF v BB is to show that they were not playing the same game, so to speak. The snaps and talent around them were much different and outside of NF one amazing season his stats are really not that special. His one year outside of Philly that he was "the" starter was very pedestrian. All of what I said before and now really are more of a way of saying that I don't really think that NF is going to be much better than BB on this team, without some serious upgrades. Which we could partially have at this point if the Jags hadn't blown last years draft, IMO.
If you are just looking for someone to not turn the ball over and just manage the offense Tyrod Taylor is available for a much cheaper price and has shown he could do that in Buffalo. With that said I do not want TT here as the starter, just saying. I'd even be more inclined to try to get Derek Carr if the Raiders draft a QB in the first than NF. Personally, I am tired of having a QB just to manage a game. I think, for what may only cost a 3rd round pick, you can get first round talent QB that is only 22 I'd go that way.

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Lots of folks contending that we can’t evaluate that Foles is better than Blake because Foles had a better supporting cast around him.


I disagree wholeheartedly.


Nick Foles can throw a football better than Blake Bortles.
Nick Foles makes quicker and more palatable decisions with the football than Blake Bortles.

These things are easily discernible.

There isn’t some magic optic required to evaluate this stuff. And we don’t need to see Foles behind the Jags broken 2018 o-line to know he’s not going to hit his right guard In the back of the head with the football 5 times a year and throw behind his guy on crossers 40% of the time.

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Lots of folks contending that we can’t evaluate that Foles is better than Blake because Foles had a better supporting cast around him.  


I disagree wholeheartedly.


Nick Foles can throw a football better than Blake Bortles.
Nick Foles makes quicker and more palatable decisions with the football than Blake Bortles.

These things are easily discernible.  

There isn’t some magic optic required to evaluate this stuff. And we don’t need to see Foles behind the Jags broken 2018 o-line to know he’s not going to hit his right guard In the back of the head with the football 5 times a year and throw behind his guy on crossers 40% of the time.

I disagree with idea that the highlighted statement is easily discernible. If NF never faced the same amount of pressure, hits, and sacks as BB then you cannot tell whether he makes quicker and more palatable decisions. He certainly didn't in LA which is more comparable to the offensive situation here than the Eagles offense.

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In a heartbeat. Rosen would be my #1 QB in this current draft class. That pwuld be a dream scenario for me. It would negate some of the heartbreak of signing foles. Rosen would be starting by mid year anyway.

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In a heartbeat. Rosen would be my #1 QB in this current draft class. That pwuld be a dream scenario for me. It would negate some of the heartbreak of signing foles. Rosen would be starting by mid year anyway.

I agree. My nephew played with him in high school at Bosco. Kept tabs on him through college. Kid has talent, played behind a worse Oline than ours last year. He's one of those super smart people that isnt afraid to question things but not a bad teammate from everything i've heard from people he played with. Plus how much if any is Foles better considering Rosen would be in his second year? Still on a rookie deal for 3 more years. I'd take Rosen in a heartbeat!

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That would be great for the Jaguars to draft Rosen and then give him weapons like O-Linemen and a receiver to complement a strong run game. The money we save from not grabbing Foles, we could use on Corey Grant, a few linemen, and get our guys back healthy (Cam Robinson and Brandon Linder).

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I would like a 3rd round for Rosen and skipping on Foles who will bust just like 98% of other free agent QBs and then draft Haskins if possible in the 1st. But just all talk.

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Jaguars | Pacers | Purdue | Team USA

 

 

 

Yes, even if it's more than a 3rd.

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What you are saying here makes a lot of since and I don't completely dis agree with you. But there are some important things to remember when using Bortles' stats as a crutch. First, I have never been one to bang the "garbage time" stats drum. But let's be honest, a lot of BB's production was inflated by putting up numbers late in games that were out of reach against prevent/soft coverage. And we can't say he didn't always have weapons, there was a time we had two receivers who are starting caliber receiver. One of which(hurns) took quite a few thumps over the middle going after BB balls( a lot of recievers take those licks but a lot passes didn't do him any favors). I'm not just trying rip Bortles apart, but coming from someone who defended him through most of his time here in duval, I have to call it like I see it when I look back. Stats may suggest one thing, but I watched every one of his games, they don't tell the whole story.

Then let's look at the biggest factor, at least IMO. The throwing motion/mechanics and decision making/reads. Bortles mechanics are not great( putting it lightly). I remember when back corner fades in the end zone were almost automatic to Robinson. Then it turned into a time where the crowd had a better shot at the ball. His wind up and release are not quick to say the least. His Footwork in the pocket is also not great. Occasionally you see a pass come out that looks like a punt(I remember a time when people were sharing tweets on here that were excited about BB throwing a tight spiral.... really). Couple that with the slow to poor decision makings that forces coordinators to dumb down schemes for him, and you have a yourself a BB. Foles on the other hand doesn't share these same characteristics( at least not to the level of B.B.). On top of that we brought in one of his coaches from his sb run with at philly as a OC.

I'm not saying foles is the best in the league. But he is certainly a upgrade. We don't need a world beater GOAT qb. We just need someone who doesn't put our D in bad positions with ints and quick 3 and outs and demands a little respect in the passing game from opposing Ds so we don't face a stacked box every run. Foles, imo, fits the build quite nicely the more I look.

Good post, JoD, I liked the bolded statement.

So...much....THIS.  I believed in Blake for so long.  He broke me last year.  I really thought he was gonna turn a corner in 2017 during the playoffs.  Then he crapped the bed.  I understand SOME of it is due to line/receivers/etc but to miss a dude by straight AIRMAILING a ball.  Nah, thats him.  Foles isn't a world beater, but he can read a defense, thread a ball where it NEEDS to go, and can make the correct calls pre snap.  That should be ENOUGH to turn those one TD losses around to our favor.  That can turn a 5-11 campaign into 9-7/10-6.

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“Motivation alone is not enough.  If you have an idiot and you motivate him,now you have a motivated idiot.” Jim Rohn

 

trade for Rosen or Nick Mullins. Foles seems to be way to expensive

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What you are saying here makes a lot of since and I don't completely dis agree with you. But there are some important things to remember when using Bortles' stats as a crutch. First, I have never been one to bang the "garbage time" stats drum. But let's be honest, a lot of BB's production was inflated by putting up numbers late in games that were out of reach against prevent/soft coverage. And we can't say he didn't always have weapons, there was a time we had two receivers who are starting caliber receiver. One of which(hurns) took quite a few thumps over the middle going after BB balls( a lot of recievers take those licks but a lot passes didn't do him any favors). I'm not just trying rip Bortles apart, but coming from someone who defended him through most of his time here in duval, I have to call it like I see it when I look back. Stats may suggest one thing, but I watched every one of his games, they don't tell the whole story.

Then let's look at the biggest factor, at least IMO. The throwing motion/mechanics and decision making/reads. Bortles mechanics are not great( putting it lightly). I remember when back corner fades in the end zone were almost automatic to Robinson. Then it turned into a time where the crowd had a better shot at the ball. His wind up and release are not quick to say the least. His Footwork in the pocket is also not great. Occasionally you see a pass come out that looks like a punt(I remember a time when people were sharing tweets on here that were excited about BB throwing a tight spiral.... really). Couple that with the slow to poor decision makings that forces coordinators to dumb down schemes for him, and you have a yourself a BB. Foles on the other hand doesn't share these same characteristics( at least not to the level of B.B.). On top of that we brought in one of his coaches from his sb run with at philly as a OC.

I'm not saying foles is the best in the league. But he is certainly a upgrade. We don't need a world beater GOAT qb. We just need someone who doesn't put our D in bad positions with ints and quick 3 and outs and demands a little respect in the passing game from opposing Ds so we don't face a stacked box every run. Foles, imo, fits the build quite nicely the more I look.

My main reason for comparing NF v BB is to show that they were not playing the same game, so to speak. The snaps and talent around them were much different and outside of NF one amazing season his stats are really not that special. His one year outside of Philly that he was "the" starter was very pedestrian. All of what I said before and now really are more of a way of saying that I don't really think that NF is going to be much better than BB on this team, without some serious upgrades. Which we could partially have at this point if the Jags hadn't blown last years draft, IMO.
If you are just looking for someone to not turn the ball over and just manage the offense Tyrod Taylor is available for a much cheaper price and has shown he could do that in Buffalo. With that said I do not want TT here as the starter, just saying.  I'd even be more inclined to try to get Derek Carr if the Raiders draft a QB in the first than NF. Personally, I am tired of having a QB just to manage a game. I think, for what may only cost a 3rd round pick, you can get first round talent QB that is only 22 I'd go that way.

But that's not what they are looking for.

They are still looking to run the football but they want to be better on 3rd down and have a QB who can make clutch throws later in the game. Blake has so few come from behind victories it's scary. In the Charger game 2 years ago, he TRIED TO LOSE THE GAME by throwing 2 picks but luckily, the defense bailed him out and he got credited for a comeback.

Foles allows the Jags to open up the entire playbook and although I'm very big on Haskins, Foles is an upgrade from Blake.

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I would rather trade for Rosen than sign Foles if I had to choose one or the other.

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I would rather trade for Rosen than sign Foles if I had to choose one or the other.

Rosen still on rookiee Contract let blake and him battle out for starter.

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I would rather trade for Rosen than sign Foles if I had to choose one or the other.

Rosen still on rookiee Contract let blake and him battle out for starter.

Like I said, Rosen was my favorite QB in the draft last year. So I would be stoked if we got him somehow. I also wouldn't be against keeping Bortles because he is by far the cheaper option.

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I would rather trade for Rosen than sign Foles if I had to choose one or the other.

Rosen still on rookiee Contract let blake and him battle out for starter.

Bortles is complete garbage and should be gone regardless of who comes in.

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Lets say Cardinals go QB with the first pick that makes Rosen expendable.   If the price was right that is another option at QB!

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Lets say Cardinals go QB with the first pick that makes Rosen expendable.   If the price was right that is another option at QB!

Give them a 3rd in a heartbeat. Have a feeling Foles is going to be a big expensive disappointment! Use that money on our other needs in FA

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Lets say Cardinals go QB with the first pick that makes Rosen expendable.   If the price was right that is another option at QB!

Give them a 3rd in a heartbeat. Have a feeling Foles is going to be a big expensive disappointment! Use that money on our other needs in FA

Have the same feeling about Foles as well. Can't believe Coughlin/Caldwell would hitch their wagon to a career backup. I would be hedging all bets if my job was on the line. If they want to sign Foles, trade for Rosen and create competition at that position.

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"There are no asterisks in this life, only scoreboards." - Ari Gold

Rosen would actually be the most optimal option. You get a guy on for three years at 6 million with game experience and treat him like the Steelers did Big Ben his rookie year. Give him a strong run game and stout defense. It’s essentially what we tried with Bortles but he couldn’t make the easy throws or throw spirals

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Wasn't this already a thread? If it can be done for a 3rd I am all over it whether the Jags sign NF or not. NF is pushing 30, we'll need a young gun soon.

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