Russell Wilson is only 62% African. Does that mean he should pay reparations to himself?

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I think if you had actually experienced slavery your view on that matter may change.
It's an extremely silly comparison.

I said a form of, not actually picking cotton under a whip.  If u had actually taken the time to...

Nevermind

There are lots of forms of slavery that have nothing to do with cotton or with whips.

None of them are comparable to how you feel when a judge interprets a 200+ year old document differently than you would.

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I think if you had actually experienced slavery your view on that matter may change.
It's an extremely silly comparison.

There's not a single person alive who has actually experienced slavery as an institution in the US so you have made a pretty silly qualification.

But there were people who experienced slavery, then got freed, and then experienced the federal government exceeding a strict construction of its Article I Section 8 powers, in their lifetime. 

I don't think any of them saw a valid comparison between the two.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

This is just a question, I truly don't know the answer. Has Germany ever paid reparations to the descendants of the Jewish families that were exterminated by the Nazis? That was a whole lot more recent than American slavery.

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This is just a question, I truly don't know the answer. Has Germany ever paid reparations to the descendants of the Jewish families that were exterminated by the Nazis? That was a whole lot more recent than American slavery.

Yes, Germany paid heavily for a long time. You can read about it here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_...st_victims

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

This is just a question, I truly don't know the answer. Has Germany ever paid reparations to the descendants of the Jewish families that were exterminated by the Nazis? That was a whole lot more recent than American slavery.

The Dutch railway company announced last week that they will pay reparations for their role in all of that.
The West German government did their part in the early 50s.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

This is just a question, I truly don't know the answer. Has Germany ever paid reparations to the descendants of the Jewish families that were exterminated by the Nazis? That was a whole lot more recent than American slavery.

Yes, Germany paid heavily for a long time. You can read about it here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_...st_victims

Yeah, people don't realize the ethnic cleansing that took places as the allies crammed the remaining Germans into a much smaller country.  At least there were no gas chambers in that episode, but it was still horrible.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

Yes, Germany paid heavily for a long time. You can read about it here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_...st_victims

Yeah, people don't realize the ethnic cleansing that took places as the allies crammed the remaining Germans into a much smaller country.  At least there were no gas chambers in that episode, but it was still horrible.

And getting back to the original topic, the military reconstruction of the southern United States between 1865 and 1876 was not particularly friendly either. I'm not aware of civilians being brought in as forced labor, but the property taxes were punitive. They were trying to break up the huge plantations. Many of the big owners were not able to pay, and many lands were condemned and redistributed to people who previously did not own any land, both black and white, both northerners and Southerners. So while it was pretty indirect, I do think you could argue that the slave owners in particular paid some reparations.  
I think the bigger problem is what happened after 1876 when discrimination became legal again.  It's great that we're no longer officially discriminating but I do think more attention needs to be paid to eliminating the inequalities associated with that century of de-jure discrimination.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

I said a form of, not actually picking cotton under a whip.  If u had actually taken the time to...

Nevermind

There are lots of forms of slavery that have nothing to do with cotton or with whips.

None of them are comparable to how you feel when a judge interprets a 200+ year old document differently than you would.

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It does if that interpretation leads to the state stealing my labor for purposes not spelled out in the constitution.

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Yeah, people don't realize the ethnic cleansing that took places as the allies crammed the remaining Germans into a much smaller country.  At least there were no gas chambers in that episode, but it was still horrible.

And getting back to the original topic, the military reconstruction of the southern United States between 1865 and 1876 was not particularly friendly either. I'm not aware of civilians being brought in as forced labor, but the property taxes were punitive. They were trying to break up the huge plantations. Many of the big owners were not able to pay, and many lands were condemned and redistributed to people who previously did not own any land, both black and white, both northerners and Southerners. So while it was pretty indirect, I do think you could argue that the slave owners in particular paid some reparations.  
I think the bigger problem is what happened after 1876 when discrimination became legal again.  It's great that we're no longer officially discriminating but I do think more attention needs to be paid to eliminating the inequalities associated with that century of de-jure discrimination.

There you go again....

How many times does it have to be pointed out?  State intervention does not lead to massive uplifting of society!  Most of the pathologies that affect the black community can be traced back to government policies (all intended to help blacks) not slavery or even segregation.

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There are lots of forms of slavery that have nothing to do with cotton or with whips.

None of them are comparable to how you feel when a judge interprets a 200+ year old document differently than you would.

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It does if that interpretation leads to the state stealing my labor for purposes not spelled out in the constitution.

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And getting back to the original topic, the military reconstruction of the southern United States between 1865 and 1876 was not particularly friendly either. I'm not aware of civilians being brought in as forced labor, but the property taxes were punitive. They were trying to break up the huge plantations. Many of the big owners were not able to pay, and many lands were condemned and redistributed to people who previously did not own any land, both black and white, both northerners and Southerners. So while it was pretty indirect, I do think you could argue that the slave owners in particular paid some reparations.  
I think the bigger problem is what happened after 1876 when discrimination became legal again.  It's great that we're no longer officially discriminating but I do think more attention needs to be paid to eliminating the inequalities associated with that century of de-jure discrimination.

There you go again....

How many times does it have to be pointed out?  State intervention does not lead to massive uplifting of society!  Most of the pathologies that affect the black community can be traced back to government policies (all intended to help blacks) not slavery or even segregation.

Liberals are the only people on Earth for whom good intentions are more important than tangible results. That's why Mikesez and O-line are struggling so much with these Boom Times.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

I was reading where if reparations were handed out as anticipated by its proponents, it would cost us $17 trillion. Now to some this is just another big number and they just say, "so?" However, you really have to factor in just how big this number is. Trump's wall projected to cost like $8 billion when it's all said and done. The Katrina disaster cost our government around $50 billlion. Star Wars under Reagan was scrapped because they said it would cost a full $1 trillion, which is 1000 x $1 billion, and we're looking at $17 trillion. This would bankrupt our nation, and the next thing you know the Indians will want theirs for being booted out. The Mormons would surely complain after that for being kicked out to Utah.

It's not a viable plan, and really it doesn't make any rational sense.

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'02

I have a few of questions.

1.  How do we determine if a black person today is a direct descendant of a slave vs. a slave owner?

2.  What about people that immigrated to the U.S. after say 1863?  Should their descendants have to pay?

3.  What about those of us that are descendants of people that never owned slaves?  In my case my family were indigenous (Mexican Heritage born and raised in the southwest).

4.  What about the non-black people who were slaves?

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There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.

I have a few of questions.

1.  How do we determine if a black person today is a direct descendant of a slave vs. a slave owner?

2.  What about people that immigrated to the U.S. after say 1863?  Should their descendants have to pay?

3.  What about those of us that are descendants of people that never owned slaves?  In my case my family were indigenous (Mexican Heritage born and raised in the southwest).

4.  What about the non-black people who were slaves?

For #1, all black people get reparations without any kind of investigation, skin color is sufficient.

The rest are irrelevant, the government owes the debt, not the people of the population.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

But there were people who experienced slavery, then got freed, and then experienced the federal government exceeding a strict construction of its Article I Section 8 powers, in their lifetime. 

I don't think any of them saw a valid comparison between the two.

Slavery was abolished in the US over 150 years ago. No one alive has experienced what you just described, and as far as the federal government exceeding it's powers, everyone has experienced that. Forcing citizens to pay tax money for reparations would just be another example of the government exceeding that power.

If you want to talk about slavery in the US in modern times, it is most often perpetrated by illegal immigrants against other illegal immigrants.

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But there were people who experienced slavery, then got freed, and then experienced the federal government exceeding a strict construction of its Article I Section 8 powers, in their lifetime. 

I don't think any of them saw a valid comparison between the two.

Slavery was abolished in the US over 150 years ago. No one alive has experienced what you just described, and as far as the federal government exceeding it's powers, everyone has experienced that. Forcing citizens to pay tax money for reparations would just be another example of the government exceeding that power.

If you want to talk about slavery in the US in modern times, it is most often perpetrated by illegal immigrants against other illegal immigrants.

The generation of black people born around 1840 spent the prime years of their lives as slaves, and then experienced freedom, and with that experienced the federal government vastly exceeding a strict construction of its Article 1 section 8 powers.

The federal government built them schools.
the federal government decided the times and places of their state-level elections.
the federal government commandeered some of their homes and put troops inside.

They experienced these things and slavery in one lifetime.

Many of them left behind commentaries on this. Even the ones who couldn't read and write. scholars and mid-level government clerks from all over interviewed them, and compiled the results. If you can find one that thinks slavery, which they experienced, is comparable to federal government overreach, which they also experienced, let me know.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

Slavery was abolished in the US over 150 years ago. No one alive has experienced what you just described, and as far as the federal government exceeding it's powers, everyone has experienced that. Forcing citizens to pay tax money for reparations would just be another example of the government exceeding that power.

If you want to talk about slavery in the US in modern times, it is most often perpetrated by illegal immigrants against other illegal immigrants.

The generation of black people born around 1840 spent the prime years of their lives as slaves, and then experienced freedom, and with that experienced the federal government vastly exceeding a strict construction of its Article 1 section 8 powers.

The federal government built them schools.
the federal government decided the times and places of their state-level elections.
the federal government commandeered some of their homes and put troops inside.

They experienced these things and slavery in one lifetime.

Many of them left behind commentaries on this. Even the ones who couldn't read and write. scholars and mid-level government clerks from all over interviewed them, and compiled the results. If you can find one that thinks slavery, which they experienced, is comparable to federal government overreach, which they also experienced, let me know.

If you can talk to any of them you need a shrink or a 900 number.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

I think at this point a dead horse has been sufficiently beaten.

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I think if you had actually experienced slavery your view on that matter may change.
It's an extremely silly comparison.

There's not a single person alive who has actually experienced slavery as an institution in the US so you have made a pretty silly qualification.

To equate the burden of paying taxes to what slaves endured is preposterous. One doesn't have to experience slavery personally to understand the vast difference between the two.

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If something can corrupt you, you're corrupted already.
- Bob Marley


 

There's not a single person alive who has actually experienced slavery as an institution in the US so you have made a pretty silly qualification.

To equate the burden of paying taxes to what slaves endured is preposterous. One doesn't have to experience slavery personally to understand the vast difference between the two.

To fail to recognize the similarities between the two is also disingenuous.

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“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

There's not a single person alive who has actually experienced slavery as an institution in the US so you have made a pretty silly qualification.

To equate the burden of paying taxes to what slaves endured is preposterous. One doesn't have to experience slavery personally to understand the vast difference between the two.

Your reading comprehension is what is preposterous. 

I'd be glad to pay slaves reparations, unfortunately the last person to claim to be a slave died in 1971. He also claimed to be the preposterous age of 124. 

No one alive even had parents who were slaves and only a handful of extremely elderly people could even possibly make the claim their grandparents were born under slavery.

The truth is most African Americans are 5-6 generations or more removed from slavery, and if you want to mention Jim Crow laws, most of the people who experienced that are also dead.

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This is just a question, I truly don't know the answer. Has Germany ever paid reparations to the descendants of the Jewish families that were exterminated by the Nazis? That was a whole lot more recent than American slavery.

Yes, Germany paid heavily for a long time. You can read about it here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_...st_victims

The difference being the reparations were set fairly shortly after the Holocaust... as opposed to generations later.

Also... the gov't of Germany paid the gov't of Israel over 14 years or something.

Not exactly apples to apples.

No one alive today was even remotely affected by slavery. And tax payers today shouldn't be on the hook for something some people's ancestors were responsible for over 100 years ago.

Reparations is just more of "give me what you have because I feel I deserve it"
Which is an asinine thought process of so many Americans.

Long gone are the days of "give me what I'm due because I've earned it"
Just being born gives so many people this idea that they deserve or are owed something.

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To equate the burden of paying taxes to what slaves endured is preposterous. One doesn't have to experience slavery personally to understand the vast difference between the two.

Your reading comprehension is what is preposterous. 

I'd be glad to pay slaves reparations, unfortunately the last person to claim to be a slave died in 1971. He also claimed to be the preposterous age of 124. 

No one alive even had parents who were slaves and only a handful of extremely elderly people could even possibly make the claim their grandparents were born under slavery.

The truth is most African Americans are 5-6 generations or more removed from slavery, and if you want to mention Jim Crow laws, most of the people who experienced that are also dead.

Ain't nobody trying to hear that.

And you only need to look to the African Americans that think reparations are idiotic and not needed to know it's just a political talking point from the left and another tool they use to claim anyone who disagrees with them is racist.

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