I dislike the limited window narrative. 
Such windows can be widened/expanded by simply drafting well to replace the overpriced players on a team's roster.
Easier said than done, granted, but far from impossible. 

Harrison and Bryan's performance in 2019 will go a long way to showing if this front office is capable of extending this window that so many fans think is very finite.

Limited window is how we traded away nearly an entire draft and ended up with Derrick harvey and Quentin Groves.

I don't think 2008 was based on a limited window. I think that was just bad decision making in the front office at that time compounded by desperation. James Harris watched Tom Brady and the perfect Patriots (17-0 going into that game) pick his team apart in that AFC Championship game when he went 26 out of 28 and was barely flustered in the pocket. I think we managed one paltry sack in that game. 

That season in 2008 also had the team reeling very early with a depleted offensive line devoid of any talent where they were left scrambling for street free agents at more than one position I believe throughout the year. It's hard to fault Harris for swinging for the fences with Harvey and Groves during that draft. We were going into 2008 with Paul Spicer being the team's sack leader with 7.5 just previously in 2007. We were absolutely horrible at getting after the QB. 

Had Harris relaxed on his decision making and not traded up he could have very well landed Calais Campbell towards the bottom of RD1 and Cliff Avril in RD2 by, again, relaxing and letting the value fall into his lap. Getting that close and only being able to circle back to a clear cut lack of pass rush all year was the only short window the front office was guilty of having going into 2008. They weren't able to predict the offensive line falling apart at the seams.

---

"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

I dislike the limited window narrative. 
Such windows can be widened/expanded by simply drafting well to replace the overpriced players on a team's roster.
Easier said than done, granted, but far from impossible. 

Harrison and Bryan's performance in 2019 will go a long way to showing if this front office is capable of extending this window that so many fans think is very finite.

I too dislike the window of opportunity scenario but it exists w/most teams. 

The Saints and Rams geared up last year for that push because of said windows. Teams like the CHEATERS, Steelers and Packers do an good job of releasing players w/high cap #s but they don't make splashes in the playoff drive to the SB. Except for the CHEATERS. 

We the Jaguars has an window of opportunity before the front office will have to jettison players like Myles Jack, Bouye and Campbell just to name a few. At this point, in my opinion, we do not have their replacements on the roster via the NFL draft. We did an good job of drafting Bryan early but we need to do Much Better in this category of drafting for the future instead of the present. Success does cure this BUT.

NH3...

I wish people would stop including Bouye on lists like this. Bouye and Ramsey being out there together give the Jaguars an elite secondary. Without Bouye we go from one fo the few best to being practically crash. Ramsey can over cover half the field, and you can't just find another guy who can cover as well. Keep in mind that Bouye can basically cover just as well as Ramsey. The only reason you list him behind Ramsey is he's not as great at getting those INTs, but that doesn't mean we're ok parting with him.  The day Ramsey or Bouye depart you can pretty much say the Jags window is closed.

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'02

I too dislike the window of opportunity scenario but it exists w/most teams. 

The Saints and Rams geared up last year for that push because of said windows. Teams like the CHEATERS, Steelers and Packers do an good job of releasing players w/high cap #s but they don't make splashes in the playoff drive to the SB. Except for the CHEATERS. 

We the Jaguars has an window of opportunity before the front office will have to jettison players like Myles Jack, Bouye and Campbell just to name a few. At this point, in my opinion, we do not have their replacements on the roster via the NFL draft. We did an good job of drafting Bryan early but we need to do Much Better in this category of drafting for the future instead of the present. Success does cure this BUT.

NH3...

I wish people would stop including Bouye on lists like this. Bouye and Ramsey being out there together give the Jaguars an elite secondary. Without Bouye we go from one fo the few best to being practically crash. Ramsey can over cover half the field, and you can't just find another guy who can cover as well. Keep in mind that Bouye can basically cover just as well as Ramsey. The only reason you list him behind Ramsey is he's not as great at getting those INTs, but that doesn't mean we're ok parting with him.  The day Ramsey or Bouye depart you can pretty much say the Jags window is closed.

I honestly liked Bouye's season over Ramsey's back in 2017. I think he had a lot more pressure to succeed on his plate because he knew they would pick less and less on Ramsey. He had a lot of standout moments too. I circle back to his pick against Seattle where he allowed Graham to sneak by him and then he baited Wilson into a throw thinking it was there and he just turned on the jets and stole it. He's a very, very sound technician at his position.

He's still young. He'll be 28 by the time the regular season starts. I would rather see this team part ways with Linder and/or Norwell before Bouye is considered a cap casualty. Linder cannot physically hold up for the life of him. And Norwell was a letdown considering the signing during the off season of last year.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

I too dislike the window of opportunity scenario but it exists w/most teams. 

The Saints and Rams geared up last year for that push because of said windows. Teams like the CHEATERS, Steelers and Packers do an good job of releasing players w/high cap #s but they don't make splashes in the playoff drive to the SB. Except for the CHEATERS. 

We the Jaguars has an window of opportunity before the front office will have to jettison players like Myles Jack, Bouye and Campbell just to name a few. At this point, in my opinion, we do not have their replacements on the roster via the NFL draft. We did an good job of drafting Bryan early but we need to do Much Better in this category of drafting for the future instead of the present. Success does cure this BUT.

NH3...

I wish people would stop including Bouye on lists like this.
...

The day Ramsey or Bouye depart you can pretty much say the Jags window is closed.

The "list" is about salary.  So he'll continue to be on it. Bouye is one of the highest paid players on the team. 
There are at least 4 players that are more likely to be cut to make room, so there's not much concern there really -- unless he plays poorly this season. 

Every player is replaceable.  A team's window doesn't immediately close because you lose one starting CB. That's just a wild exaggeration.

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Limited window is how we traded away nearly an entire draft and ended up with Derrick harvey and Quentin Groves.

I don't think 2008 was based on a limited window. I think that was just bad decision making in the front office at that time compounded by desperation. James Harris watched Tom Brady and the perfect Patriots (17-0 going into that game) pick his team apart in that AFC Championship game when he went 26 out of 28 and was barely flustered in the pocket. I think we managed one paltry sack in that game. 

That season in 2008 also had the team reeling very early with a depleted offensive line devoid of any talent where they were left scrambling for street free agents at more than one position I believe throughout the year. It's hard to fault Harris for swinging for the fences with Harvey and Groves during that draft. We were going into 2008 with Paul Spicer being the team's sack leader with 7.5 just previously in 2007. We were absolutely horrible at getting after the QB. 

Had Harris relaxed on his decision making and not traded up he could have very well landed Calais Campbell towards the bottom of RD1 and Cliff Avril in RD2 by, again, relaxing and letting the value fall into his lap. Getting that close and only being able to circle back to a clear cut lack of pass rush all year was the only short window the front office was guilty of having going into 2008. They weren't able to predict the offensive line falling apart at the seams.

I don't blame Shack for going after pass rushers, but I do blame him for a lack of talent evaluation. Those guys sucked.

With hindsight, what we should have done is stayed put in round one and drafted Duante Brown to take over for Khalif Barnes, or else Antoine Cason because we only had one decent CB and he was old. Then in round two trade up just a few spots and take Calais Campbell. 

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'02

I too dislike the window of opportunity scenario but it exists w/most teams. 

The Saints and Rams geared up last year for that push because of said windows. Teams like the CHEATERS, Steelers and Packers do an good job of releasing players w/high cap #s but they don't make splashes in the playoff drive to the SB. Except for the CHEATERS. 

We the Jaguars has an window of opportunity before the front office will have to jettison players like Myles Jack, Bouye and Campbell just to name a few. At this point, in my opinion, we do not have their replacements on the roster via the NFL draft. We did an good job of drafting Bryan early but we need to do Much Better in this category of drafting for the future instead of the present. Success does cure this BUT.

NH3...

I wish people would stop including Bouye on lists like this. Bouye and Ramsey being out there together give the Jaguars an elite secondary. Without Bouye we go from one fo the few best to being practically crash. Ramsey can over cover half the field, and you can't just find another guy who can cover as well. Keep in mind that Bouye can basically cover just as well as Ramsey. The only reason you list him behind Ramsey is he's not as great at getting those INTs, but that doesn't mean we're ok parting with him.  The day Ramsey or Bouye depart you can pretty much say the Jags window is closed.

Actually in 2017 he had more interceptions (6) than Ramsey (4) though it was pretty much expected.  Teams were throwing away from Ramsey more.  The 2018 season saw fewer INT's overall as a team though Ramsey did have three and Bouye didn't get any.

I just don't think one is better than the other in that specific category.

---

There are 10 kinds of people in this world.  Those who understand binary and those who don't.

I wish people would stop including Bouye on lists like this. Bouye and Ramsey being out there together give the Jaguars an elite secondary. Without Bouye we go from one fo the few best to being practically crash. Ramsey can over cover half the field, and you can't just find another guy who can cover as well. Keep in mind that Bouye can basically cover just as well as Ramsey. The only reason you list him behind Ramsey is he's not as great at getting those INTs, but that doesn't mean we're ok parting with him.  The day Ramsey or Bouye depart you can pretty much say the Jags window is closed.

Actually in 2017 he had more interceptions (6) than Ramsey (4) though it was pretty much expected.  Teams were throwing away from Ramsey more.  The 2018 season saw fewer INT's overall as a team though Ramsey did have three and Bouye didn't get any.

I just don't think one is better than the other in that specific category.

I thought ramsey was better and it was evident by QBs picking on the lesser of the two cornerbacks.  If we want to play the stat game, does anyone have the targets for ramsey and the targets for bouye?  I want to at least see who was targeted more to see if these 2 int for bouye makes him better than jalen.

EDIT: Put question mark for those that need perfect english, to understand words or statements, that make a sentence.

---

Season Tix, Section 409

2023 and still counting.....SB will finally be ours soon enough.
TLaw aka 'the prince that was promised' supporter.

Actually in 2017 he had more interceptions (6) than Ramsey (4) though it was pretty much expected.  Teams were throwing away from Ramsey more.  The 2018 season saw fewer INT's overall as a team though Ramsey did have three and Bouye didn't get any.

I just don't think one is better than the other in that specific category.

I thought ramsey was better and it was evident by QBs picking on the lesser of the two cornerbacks.  If we want to play the stat game, does anyone have the targets for ramsey and the targets for bouye?  I want to at least see who was targeted more to see if these 2 int for bouye makes him better than jalen.

EDIT:  Put question mark for those that need perfect english, to understand words or statements, that make a sentence.

If we're talking two years ago? You're really splitting hairs between Bouye and Ramsey. I think PFF (And depending on who you are, you either take it as Gospel or with a grain of Salt) had Bouye showing with the lowest allowed completion percentage when passes were thrown his way. He gave up a crazy low percentage. I think it was in the low 30's. He was essentially a no fly zone most of the time for QB's. 

They BOTH made it exceptionally difficult for QB's in 2017. Didn't matter if you threw it to the left or right. You had a low chance of completing that pass or you had a high chance of it being tipped or picked. But I do believe Bouye edged him out slightly with the completion percentage.

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Here's the article(s) regarding 2017. He allowed the lowest passer rating in his direction. Also gave up ZERO TD's.

https://jaguarswire.usatoday.com/2018/02...n-at-no-5/

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000...-the-roost

---

"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

I thought ramsey was better and it was evident by QBs picking on the lesser of the two cornerbacks.  If we want to play the stat game, does anyone have the targets for ramsey and the targets for bouye?  I want to at least see who was targeted more to see if these 2 int for bouye makes him better than jalen.

EDIT:  Put question mark for those that need perfect english, to understand words or statements, that make a sentence.

If we're talking two years ago? You're really splitting hairs between Bouye and Ramsey. I think PFF (And depending on who you are, you either take it as Gospel or with a grain of Salt) had Bouye showing with the lowest allowed completion percentage when passes were thrown his way. He gave up a crazy low percentage. I think it was in the low 30's. He was essentially a no fly zone most of the time for QB's. 

They BOTH made it exceptionally difficult for QB's in 2017. Didn't matter if you threw it to the left or right. You had a low chance of completing that pass or you had a high chance of it being tipped or picked. But I do believe Bouye edged him out slightly with the completion percentage.

---

Here's the article(s) regarding 2017. He allowed the lowest passer rating in his direction. Also gave up ZERO TD's.

https://jaguarswire.usatoday.com/2018/02...n-at-no-5/

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000...-the-roost

I've seen way to many arguments over pff stats.  I just need raw numbers of targest and completion % against both.  If ramsey gave up a 2 yrd pass on 3rd and 3, thats not what i'm looking for.  The eye test showed QBs scared to throw to ramsey's side and throwing to bouye more.  Now AJ did a spectacular job when in coverage against pass attempts but....I learned in math, if a player has less attempts, he should have a worse percentage, just due to not having more attempts to skew the numbers a little unless playing a perfect game.  

Don't want to make it sound complicated.  If both CBs allowed a pass completion on 2 attempts, but one finished with 7 thrown his way that game and the other with 3, wouldnt the CB with 7 attempts have better percentages?  ijs

---

Season Tix, Section 409

2023 and still counting.....SB will finally be ours soon enough.
TLaw aka 'the prince that was promised' supporter.

There's a reason you hear national pundits talk about Ramsey being potentially the best corner in the league and you never hear Bouye's name in those conversations.

Bouye is very good and when he stays technically sound and focused he can be great. But he's not the athlete that Ramsey is and can't recover from a brief lapse in technique, or being slightly out of position the way that Ramsey can.
Ramsey can make a play on the ball from a significantly wider radius.

Regardless -- It's amazing to have the Ramsey, Bouye, Hayden trio intact with a good slot back-up in Herndon and a promising ballhawk in Meeks to bolster the outside. If it's not the best cornerback room in the league, it's damn close.

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If we're talking two years ago? You're really splitting hairs between Bouye and Ramsey. I think PFF (And depending on who you are, you either take it as Gospel or with a grain of Salt) had Bouye showing with the lowest allowed completion percentage when passes were thrown his way. He gave up a crazy low percentage. I think it was in the low 30's. He was essentially a no fly zone most of the time for QB's. 

They BOTH made it exceptionally difficult for QB's in 2017. Didn't matter if you threw it to the left or right. You had a low chance of completing that pass or you had a high chance of it being tipped or picked. But I do believe Bouye edged him out slightly with the completion percentage.

---

Here's the article(s) regarding 2017. He allowed the lowest passer rating in his direction. Also gave up ZERO TD's.

https://jaguarswire.usatoday.com/2018/02...n-at-no-5/

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000...-the-roost

I've seen way to many arguments over pff stats.  I just need raw numbers of targest and completion % against both.  If ramsey gave up a 2 yrd pass on 3rd and 3, thats not what i'm looking for.  The eye test showed QBs scared to throw to ramsey's side and throwing to bouye more.  Now AJ did a spectacular job when in coverage against pass attempts but....I learned in math, if a player has less attempts, he should have a worse percentage, just due to not having more attempts to skew the numbers a little unless playing a perfect game.  

Don't want to make it sound complicated.  If both CBs allowed a pass completion on 2 attempts, but one finished with 7 thrown his way that game and the other with 3, wouldnt the CB with 7 attempts have better percentages?  ijs

I go with the eye test myself. I think Ramsey is the better player from a pure athletic stand point. But if I had to go back to 2017 there were some pretty crazy plays those guys were both making. Bouye had some nice plays on the ball in that Seattle home game and that other game against the Chargers. 

Ramsey also made some acrobatic plays that he's becoming routinely known for. Like the one against Buffalo at home that year in the play-off's and that other crazy one against Pittsburgh that NYC has in his signature. He's a freak athlete for sure. It's a shame this front office couldn't figure out a way to move up to snatch Derwin James back in 2018. I really think he's the next big name SS in everyone's household. 

He would have made this secondary extremely scary to deal with. Ronnie Harrison may prove to be a steal though in due time.

---

"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

I've seen way to many arguments over pff stats.  I just need raw numbers of targest and completion % against both.  If ramsey gave up a 2 yrd pass on 3rd and 3, thats not what i'm looking for.  The eye test showed QBs scared to throw to ramsey's side and throwing to bouye more.  Now AJ did a spectacular job when in coverage against pass attempts but....I learned in math, if a player has less attempts, he should have a worse percentage, just due to not having more attempts to skew the numbers a little unless playing a perfect game.  

Don't want to make it sound complicated.  If both CBs allowed a pass completion on 2 attempts, but one finished with 7 thrown his way that game and the other with 3, wouldnt the CB with 7 attempts have better percentages?  ijs

I go with the eye test myself. I think Ramsey is the better player from a pure athletic stand point. But if I had to go back to 2017 there were some pretty crazy plays those guys were both making. Bouye had some nice plays on the ball in that Seattle home game and that other game against the Chargers. 

Ramsey also made some acrobatic plays that he's becoming routinely known for. Like the one against Buffalo at home that year in the play-off's and that other crazy one against Pittsburgh that NYC has in his signature. He's a freak athlete for sure. It's a shame this front office couldn't figure out a way to move up to snatch Derwin James back in 2018. I really think he's the next big name SS in everyone's household. 

He would have made this secondary extremely scary to deal with. Ronnie Harrison may prove to be a steal though in due time.

True.  I'm still nervous about DJ, even though he's been here a year already.  I was so use to colvin as the 3rd CB, i don't really trust DJ 100% yet.  We had a down year but at full strength offensively and defensively, i hope he doesnt cost us any games.  

Now that i think about it, I'm more concerned at LB than 3rd CB, so idk.  We are built to stay in games and potentially dominate, on the defensive side when holding a lead.

---

Season Tix, Section 409

2023 and still counting.....SB will finally be ours soon enough.
TLaw aka 'the prince that was promised' supporter.

I too dislike the window of opportunity scenario but it exists w/most teams. 

The Saints and Rams geared up last year for that push because of said windows. Teams like the CHEATERS, Steelers and Packers do an good job of releasing players w/high cap #s but they don't make splashes in the playoff drive to the SB. Except for the CHEATERS. 

We the Jaguars has an window of opportunity before the front office will have to jettison players like Myles Jack, Bouye and Campbell just to name a few. At this point, in my opinion, we do not have their replacements on the roster via the NFL draft. We did an good job of drafting Bryan early but we need to do Much Better in this category of drafting for the future instead of the present. Success does cure this BUT.

NH3...

I wish people would stop including Bouye on lists like this. Bouye and Ramsey being out there together give the Jaguars an elite secondary. Without Bouye we go from one fo the few best to being practically crash. Ramsey can over cover half the field, and you can't just find another guy who can cover as well. Keep in mind that Bouye can basically cover just as well as Ramsey. The only reason you list him behind Ramsey is he's not as great at getting those INTs, but that doesn't mean we're ok parting with him.  The day Ramsey or Bouye depart you can pretty much say the Jags window is closed.

In disagreeing with you, I do not, in any way, impugn Bouye as a player.

Bouye has been, without question, the best RCB/#2 CB in team history and enables us to match up favorable against most receiver groups.  As an underdog, UDFA who made it big, he seems to embody what it means to be a Jaguar.  But there are reasons he is included on lists of players to potentially jettison.

He is older.  He will be 28 next month.  While he is still in his prime, he will soon be an age where his skills are at risk of decline. 

He is expensive.  He signed a big money deal a couple of offseasons ago, and has a substantial cap hit-some $15 million each of the next few seasons according to https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/jacksonville...uye-12795/  Between signing Ngakoue, Jack, and Ramsey, we will likely need that cap space to sign these guys.

He is "expendable."  While he is undoubtedly invaluable to our defense now, and his cover skills help make the defense special, don't forget, we are still at a defensive advantage with Ramsey, who can take away half the field.  There have been plenty of good-great defenses with just one cover CB, including the Seattle Super Bowl teams, the Dungy era Tampa teams, the Dallas Super bowl winning teams of the 1990s, and others.  If we can get competent S play/coordinating, and can keep a bevy of young pass rushers like Ngakoue and Allen, we can adjust for having "just Ramsey."  Furthermore, history has shown you can find CBs late in the first round and beyond.  The Bills just drafted Tredavious White late in the first round a few years back.  There have been guys like Patrick Surtain and Sam Madison found in the second round.  Greedy Williams, considered by most to be the best CB in this most recent draft, was obtained in the middle of the second round. 

I have enjoyed the level of play and consistency that Bouye has provided the Jaguars since his arrival.  I have long believed that when a team has two excellent players at a position, it provides excellent match up advantages.  Looking at our own history, in the 1990s, the Jaguars had two dominant tackles in Boselli and Searcy and two excellent WRs in Smith and McCardell.  They contributed to one of the most lethal passing attacks in the latter half of that decade.  Later, the team added two dominant DTs in Stroud and Henderson, and our run defense in the JDR era was stifling during that time.  The strongest running game we had in our history featured two great RBs in Fred taylor and MJD.  Our defense the last few years has given us two dominant pass rushers in Ngakoue and Campbell, two outstanding LBs in Poz and Telvin Smith and later Jack and Smith, and two stud CBs in Ramsey and Bouye.  However, cap realities probably mandate we can't sustain all of this talent on the roster.  The best we can do is minimize the damage and cultivate younger cheaper talent.  I love Bouye, but I don't think he should cost us Ramsey or Ngakoue (though I don't think Bouye will cost us Ngakoue-I think if we alienate Ngakoue, the Bortles deal is what did it).

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Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

I dont see Bouye going anywhere unless he has a bad year but you can say that for almost anyone on the team. 2021 maybe when he is 30 and only 2 mil in dead money

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I go with the eye test myself. I think Ramsey is the better player from a pure athletic stand point. But if I had to go back to 2017 there were some pretty crazy plays those guys were both making. Bouye had some nice plays on the ball in that Seattle home game and that other game against the Chargers. 

Ramsey also made some acrobatic plays that he's becoming routinely known for. Like the one against Buffalo at home that year in the play-off's and that other crazy one against Pittsburgh that NYC has in his signature. He's a freak athlete for sure. It's a shame this front office couldn't figure out a way to move up to snatch Derwin James back in 2018. I really think he's the next big name SS in everyone's household. 

He would have made this secondary extremely scary to deal with. Ronnie Harrison may prove to be a steal though in due time.

True.  I'm still nervous about DJ, even though he's been here a year already.  I was so use to colvin as the 3rd CB, i don't really trust DJ 100% yet.  We had a down year but at full strength offensively and defensively, i hope he doesnt cost us any games.  

Now that i think about it, I'm more concerned at LB than 3rd CB, so idk.  We are built to stay in games and potentially dominate, on the defensive side when holding a lead.

Hayden outperformed Colvin last year by a good margin. 

Your fear is baseless.

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