Thanks Bullseye. This may seem out there but NFL has a big looming problem. Millennial generation isn't as die hard for the NFL as the previous generations.  Gen Z is not as interested.  There are outliers but the current model is COVID damaged but is going to see revenue issues covered up by it. Dallas is vacuum cleaning up relocating people here but I dont think they can keep up their revenue growth. The Star in Frisco TX is ridiculously over priced.  Jacksonville is a bargain overall. Honeatly if the team moves, it isn't going to play out like the league hopes.

100% agree with your sentiments.

I believe the NFL and it's model is slowly eroding due to a variety of reasons from both internal and external factors.

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Couple issues discussed here, first attendance. The Jags do not have an attendance issue. Even with a bad team they rank around #21 in attendance.

Last year (2019) numbers showed us #22 at 504k this is ahead of the Steelers, Bears, Cardinal Colts, Raiders, Buccaneers, Bengals and Chargers.

The previous year 2018 (with the bump from a playoff run in 2017) #15 at 552k putting us ahead of Seattle, Minnesota, New England, Cleveland, Miami, Bills, Titans. Steelers, Lions, Cardinals, Bears Redskins, Colts, Raiders, Buccaneers, Bengals and Chargers.

before that 2017 was about the same as 2019, it shows you a winning team is worth about a 10% increase in attendance. So if our esteemed President of the Jags wants more people he should know he needs to look into a mirror to see who to blame.

Second issue is Lot J, 400k "investment" in improvements. It is only an investment if there is a return for not just the Jaguars, but the city as well. We have heard nothing about those figures. I AGREE there needs to be more around the stadium for people to do. I AGREE we need to give the stadium and the area around it facelift. There is 5-10 years left on the lease I suspect this is why we have not heard any return numbers as it is too short a period to amortize these costs and make it an investment. . The goal of our town should be to build a plan to accomplish the facelift and Lot J properly to avoid wasted money and tie it to a lease extension. I really would hate to have the need to explain to people Lot J needed to be redone after a few years to accommodate these stadium facelift items. The Jaguars know what needs to be done, why are they afraid to tell us. Makes me feel uneasy....

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A new broom always sweeps clean.

I'm going to guess that, like the Shipyards, Lot J has massive environmental issues under the soil that will inhibit heavy construction from ever taking place.

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My fellow southpaw Mark Brunell will probably always be my favorite Jaguar.

Couple issues discussed here, first attendance. The Jags do not have an attendance issue. Even with a bad team they rank around #21 in attendance.

Last year (2019) numbers showed us #22 at 504k this is ahead of the Steelers, Bears, Cardinal Colts, Raiders, Buccaneers, Bengals and Chargers.

The previous year 2018 (with the bump from a playoff run in 2017) #15 at 552k putting us ahead of Seattle, Minnesota, New England, Cleveland, Miami, Bills, Titans. Steelers, Lions, Cardinals, Bears Redskins, Colts, Raiders, Buccaneers, Bengals and Chargers.

before that 2017 was about the same as 2019, it shows you a winning team is worth about a 10% increase in attendance. So if our esteemed President of the Jags wants more people he should know he needs to look into a mirror to see who to blame.

Second issue is Lot J, 400k "investment" in improvements. It is only an investment if there is a return for not just the Jaguars, but the city as well. We have heard nothing about those figures. I AGREE there needs to be more around the stadium for people to do. I AGREE we need to give the stadium and the area around it facelift. There is 5-10 years left on the lease I suspect this is why we have not heard any return numbers as it is too short a period to amortize these costs and make it an investment. . The goal of our town should be to build a plan to accomplish the facelift and Lot J properly to avoid wasted money and tie it to a lease extension. I really would hate to have the need to explain to people Lot J needed to be redone after a few years to accommodate these stadium facelift items. The Jaguars know what needs to be done, why are they afraid to tell us. Makes me feel uneasy....

If we are forced to a new stadium by Khan and the league, then don't waste your time at the current location. Build it where they can piggyback off of current economic activity. This will be especially important in the 8 months of off season. Off Butler close to the intercoastal makes the most sense to attract the high end consumer. And would make for great game day arieal footage of the intercoastal all the way to the ocean, instead of that joke of a skyline we currently see.

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"Remember Red, Hope is a good thing. Maybe the best of things. And no good thing ever dies."  - Andy Dufresne, The Shawshank Redemption

But we have big screens, pools, and doggy daycare...

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Let's Get Em!!!! Go Jags!

The team needs the Lot J project to help them compete revenue wise with the rest of the league and to ensure we can continue to attract and keep major events like the FL/GA game.

Downtown Jacksonville is just depressing. The Landing was a dump bordering on unsafe the last while. What remains of Downtown is no better. Going to a restaurant or bar and grabbing a few beers and food before a game or a concert or just to enjoy a night downtown appeals to me. If they get the right mix of tenants i.e. a grocery store, coffee, gym in addition to the bars and restaurants I think it'll appeal to many also wanting to live in the apartments and definitely add much needed density to the area. One of the big problems I feel the Jags have always had in building a fanbase outside of Jacksonville is that for those visiting for a game from out of town there is absolutely nowhere near enough for people to do in the area and it creates a terrible impression of the city for visitors.

The Southside and the Beaches are nice but our Downtown is capable of so much more. Hopefully they get things done and stop the bureaucratic squabbling.

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Couple issues discussed here, first attendance.   The Jags do not have an attendance issue.  Even with a bad team they rank around #21 in attendance.  

Last year (2019)  numbers showed us #22 at 504k this is ahead of the Steelers, Bears, Cardinal Colts, Raiders, Buccaneers, Bengals and Chargers.

The previous year 2018 (with the bump from a playoff run in 2017) #15 at 552k putting us ahead of Seattle, Minnesota, New England, Cleveland, Miami, Bills, Titans. Steelers, Lions, Cardinals, Bears Redskins, Colts, Raiders, Buccaneers, Bengals and Chargers.

The only thing wrong with our attendance is the fact that there is a large portion of the opposing teams fans that help our attendance.  That said, even if we had a very average team (8-8) our fans would really support this team.  It's really hard to sell this team year after year when they only win 5 games per year on average over the past decade.  I compare us to the Pittsburgh Pirates.  Fans are eager to support but when you constantly suck, fans become disheartened and find more satisfying ways to spend their disposable income.

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I like in the Town Center and I WANT to live downtown but it just doesn't offer much at all and sadly you dont feel safe in a lot of areas. Such a beautiful city on the river and it SHOULD be the place to be.

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I like in the Town Center and I WANT to live downtown but it just doesn't offer much at all and sadly you dont feel safe in a lot of areas.  Such a beautiful city on the river and it SHOULD be the place to be.

Which is why the city should develop downtown.

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Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

We need volleyball nets

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I like in the Town Center and I WANT to live downtown but it just doesn't offer much at all and sadly you dont feel safe in a lot of areas.  Such a beautiful city on the river and it SHOULD be the place to be.

Which is why the city should develop downtown.

I'm speaking anecdotally here, but I really believe many people here in Jax want our downtown to develop and be a center piece of this city and it's future.

I just think it's a select few who are holding back the progression of our city unfortunately. It's time to get with it folks, we have a beautiful city so lets take advantage of that.

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Which is why the city should develop downtown.

I'm speaking anecdotally here, but I really believe many people here in Jax want our downtown to develop and be a center piece of this city and it's future.

I just think it's a select few who are holding back the progression of our city unfortunately. It's time to get with it folks, we have a beautiful city so lets take advantage of that.

I don't believe it is a select few.  I think there is a sizeable portion of the populace that is against progress.

But taking your assessment at face value for the moment, it would seem the select few to whom you refer always seem to be in positions of power in this town.

The quote in my signature speaks volumes.  It was what a former Jacksonville mayor said to Walt freaking Disney when he wanted to build here.

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Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

Let the bickering begin. 

Khan should have made his GM move last year in order to show the team is turning the corner before negotiating for Lot J and stadium upgrades. Now it's all hitting the fan at the same time. This was not handled well.

Jacksonville Mayor: If Lot J deal doesn’t go through, NFL could drop affiliation

JACKSONVILLE, Fla. – Monday night Jacksonville Mayor Lenny Curry sent a Twitter storm of messages calling on city council to make a decision on the development of Lot J.

https://twitter.com/lennycurry/status/13...66048?s=20

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After visiting downtown for the first time in years last week, put me in the downtown camp for the new stadium. I was in Springfield, along 8th Street. There are lots of bars, microbrews, niche shops, and in fill of old homes being restored. It reminds me of Virginia Highlands here in ATL.

Downtown is coming back, maybe not as fast as we'd like. You don't need a bunch of tall shiny skyscrapers to lead that comeback. I think the hard work - building/renovating homes, more small businesses, is being done right now. The new stadium should be a part of that.

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Let the bickering begin. 

Khan should have made his GM move last year in order to show the team is turning the corner before negotiating for Lot J and stadium upgrades. Now it's all hitting the fan at the same time. This was not handled well.

Jacksonville Mayor: If Lot J deal doesn’t go through, NFL could drop affiliation

JACKSONVILLE, Fla. – Monday night Jacksonville Mayor Lenny Curry sent a Twitter storm of messages calling on city council to make a decision on the development of Lot J.

https://twitter.com/lennycurry/status/13...66048?s=20

This is weird Typically the NFL holds leverage over new stadiums. Is it typical to do this for entertainment zones surrounding a stadium?

I really wish they would stop trying to force downtown on people. Just build a more reasonable sized stadium in a different area of town where developers WANT to develop. Create a supply/demand situation.

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Kind of bad timing trying to convince Jax that Lot J is critical to staying an NFL City

The Jags as a team has consistently failed to hold up their end of the bargain

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I don't think that many people are against using significant taxpayer money to develop lot J or other surrounding downtown areas, or even doing a major reno/new stadium. The city has just done a terrible job proving that it will be a +EV move and the descriptions/renderings do not show anything close to being worth 400M.

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After visiting downtown for the first time in years last week, put me in the downtown camp for the new stadium.  I was in Springfield, along 8th Street. There are lots of bars, microbrews, niche shops, and in fill of old homes being restored. It reminds me of Virginia Highlands here in ATL.

Downtown is coming back, maybe not as fast as we'd like. You don't need a bunch of tall shiny skyscrapers to lead that comeback.  I think the hard work - building/renovating homes, more small businesses, is being done right now. The new stadium should be a part of that.

This. I try to educate people from time to time but there is a local perception of downtown as an abandoned, crime-infested hell hole that's hard to shake. There is a foundation there that needs to be built on but it's there. It needs some TLC (and some money of course) to bloom.

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I'm condescending. That means I talk down to you.

Thanks Bullseye. This may seem out there but NFL has a big looming problem. Millennial generation isn't as die hard for the NFL as the previous generations.  Gen Z is not as interested.  There are outliers but the current model is COVID damaged but is going to see revenue issues covered up by it. Dallas is vacuum cleaning up relocating people here but I dont think they can keep up their revenue growth. The Star in Frisco TX is ridiculously over priced.  Jacksonville is a bargain overall. Honeatly if the team moves, it isn't going to play out like the league hopes.

100% agree with your sentiments.

I believe the NFL and it's model is slowly eroding due to a variety of reasons from both internal and external factors.

It's an unsustainable business model, as are most redistribution of wealth programs. I remember reading an article years ago that it would catch up to the NFL when growth slows or stops. Nothing can go on infinitely and continue to grow.

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After visiting downtown for the first time in years last week, put me in the downtown camp for the new stadium.  I was in Springfield, along 8th Street. There are lots of bars, microbrews, niche shops, and in fill of old homes being restored. It reminds me of Virginia Highlands here in ATL.

Downtown is coming back, maybe not as fast as we'd like. You don't need a bunch of tall shiny skyscrapers to lead that comeback.  I think the hard work - building/renovating homes, more small businesses, is being done right now. The new stadium should be a part of that.

This. I try to educate people from time to time but there is a local perception of downtown as an abandoned, crime-infested hell hole that's hard to shake. There is a foundation there that needs to be built on but it's there. It needs some TLC (and some money of course) to bloom.

Much of it rides on the political will to make some unpopular decisions. Mainly what to do with the homeless population. I know Springfield and other gentrified areas were struggling to get support from city hall and the police to curb the problem. I don't know if it's still that way, but it was clear for a while that local authorities didn't want to address it. 

Regardless, Jacksonville is a backwater that has huge potential. If we don't take advantage of the exposure an NFL franchise and its extremely wealthy owner offer, we'll be stuck in the dark ages for the next 40 years. The opportunity is here now.

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