"Bottom of the barrel" is going too far, but you are also completely failing to mention the fact that the 2019 Bucs were DEAD LAST in giveaways.  Not below average, not bottom third, not ranked 31st.  Their offense was 32 out of 32 teams in giveaways.  Winston had his career high in interceptions and it isn't even remotely close.   Any team could inflate their yardage totals if they were willing to risk a ton of interceptions.  If you don't think interceptions matter, then you must think Blake Bortles was a good quarterback.

Lol, leaves out the most important.  Not only was it dead last, it was the most Ints thrown in a season all time.  I remember when Olsen got a lot of heat here the year Blake threw 18 picks and we had 2 thousand yard WRs, people were calling for his head and he did get fired that year.  Byron can thank God that Brady returned, he might get a HC gig now, Brady will always have his offenses top of the league regardless of the OC or HC.  Most first time GMs don't get to come in and bark orders on who their GM is going to be.  I think Byron might be able to be a good HC but its really an unknown being Brady is his QB and is he a leader of 53 men?  Not sure but no other teams fans wanted Byron outside of this fan base, if he didn't play here before everyone wouldn't of wanted him like they did.  When you bring in a OC to be a HC it's much more than is he just a good offensive play caller.

The fact that he played here is the stupidest 'logic' and it's ridiculous to misrepresent it.  He was NOT popular when he was hear so how the hell does that factor into people wanting him here?  Good grief.

---

Sideways hat.

Talks funny.

Probably wears his pants low.

Something about these memories is familiar. What could it be? Whatever could it be?

---

“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Lol, leaves out the most important.  Not only was it dead last, it was the most Ints thrown in a season all time.  I remember when Olsen got a lot of heat here the year Blake threw 18 picks and we had 2 thousand yard WRs, people were calling for his head and he did get fired that year.  Byron can thank God that Brady returned, he might get a HC gig now, Brady will always have his offenses top of the league regardless of the OC or HC.  Most first time GMs don't get to come in and bark orders on who their GM is going to be.  I think Byron might be able to be a good HC but its really an unknown being Brady is his QB and is he a leader of 53 men?  Not sure but no other teams fans wanted Byron outside of this fan base, if he didn't play here before everyone wouldn't of wanted him like they did.  When you bring in a OC to be a HC it's much more than is he just a good offensive play caller.

The fact that he played here is the stupidest 'logic' and it's ridiculous to misrepresent it.  He was NOT popular when he was hear so how the hell does that factor into people wanting him here?  Good grief.

Then why did none of the other fan bases want him?  I went to a bunch of other message boards that had HC openings to see if all the other teams boards wanted him like this one did and none of them did. This was the only fan base that wanted him as HC

---

Lol, leaves out the most important.  Not only was it dead last, it was the most Ints thrown in a season all time.  I remember when Olsen got a lot of heat here the year Blake threw 18 picks and we had 2 thousand yard WRs, people were calling for his head and he did get fired that year.  Byron can thank God that Brady returned, he might get a HC gig now, Brady will always have his offenses top of the league regardless of the OC or HC.  Most first time GMs don't get to come in and bark orders on who their GM is going to be.  I think Byron might be able to be a good HC but its really an unknown being Brady is his QB and is he a leader of 53 men?  Not sure but no other teams fans wanted Byron outside of this fan base, if he didn't play here before everyone wouldn't of wanted him like they did.  When you bring in a OC to be a HC it's much more than is he just a good offensive play caller.

The fact that he played here is the stupidest 'logic' and it's ridiculous to misrepresent it.  He was NOT popular when he was hear so how the hell does that factor into people wanting him here?  Good grief.

When Bryron was rumored to come here you would of thought that we were getting BB or Sean Payton, people were saying it was Byron or bust lol.  There isn't another fan base that felt that way or even really wanted him.  It would of been a great "feel good story" many even said

---

Sideways hat.

Talks funny.

Probably wears his pants low.

Something about these memories is familiar. What could it be? Whatever could it be?

Don't forget lazy...

---

Blaming Leftwich for Winston and hyperbolizing what portion of the fanbase wanted Leftwich to be the next HC seems like a fun way to spend a weekend.

LOL

Between the board, twitter, and local radio, the sense I got on fans wanting Leftwich was as follows:


----------------------------------------------

Primary Initial reaction from fans over 40: He ain't ready. Give him a few years.

Primary Initial reaction from most younger fans: Former Jag + I like throwback unis + Arians endorsement + Brady factor must be a good thing , right?   = I LIKE IT - HIRE BYRON

-----------------------------------------------

Secondary Reaction from about 50% of fans over 40 as coaching search drags on: Well, Bruce had good things to say, he gels well with Brady, and he'll be boatloads better than Meyer. Maybe this is worth a flyer. Still kinda' wanted Pederson or another guy with more experience, but...

Secondary reaction from most younger fans: NOOOOO!! - Khan and Baalke are gonna' ruin this and let Byron get away!  We HAVE to have him! Leftwich is EVERYTHING! 

---

Blaming Leftwich for Winston and hyperbolizing what portion of the fanbase wanted Leftwich to be the next HC seems like a fun way to spend a weekend.

LOL

Between the board, twitter, and local radio, the sense I got on fans wanting Leftwich was as follows:


----------------------------------------------

Primary Initial reaction from fans over 40: He ain't ready. Give him a few years.

Primary Initial reaction from most younger fans: Former Jag + I like throwback unis + Arians endorsement + Brady factor must be a good thing , right?   = I LIKE IT - HIRE BYRON

-----------------------------------------------

Secondary Reaction from about 50% of fans over 40 as coaching search drags on: Well, Bruce had good things to say, he gels well with Brady, and he'll be boatloads better than Meyer. Maybe this is worth a flyer. Still kinda' wanted Pederson or another guy with more experience, but...

Secondary reaction from most younger fans: NOOOOO!! - Khan and Baalke are gonna' ruin this and let Byron get away!  We HAVE to have him! Leftwich is EVERYTHING! 

You left out the "We don't want his kind 'round here" contingent. That's about 3% of the fan base.

---

“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

Blaming Leftwich for Winston and hyperbolizing what portion of the fanbase wanted Leftwich to be the next HC seems like a fun way to spend a weekend.

LOL

Between the board, twitter, and local radio, the sense I got on fans wanting Leftwich was as follows:


----------------------------------------------

Primary Initial reaction from fans over 40: He ain't ready. Give him a few years.

Primary Initial reaction from most younger fans: Former Jag + I like throwback unis + Arians endorsement + Brady factor must be a good thing , right?   = I LIKE IT - HIRE BYRON

-----------------------------------------------

Secondary Reaction from about 50% of fans over 40 as coaching search drags on: Well, Bruce had good things to say, he gels well with Brady, and he'll be boatloads better than Meyer. Maybe this is worth a flyer. Still kinda' wanted Pederson or another guy with more experience, but...

Secondary reaction from most younger fans: NOOOOO!! - Khan and Baalke are gonna' ruin this and let Byron get away!  We HAVE to have him! Leftwich is EVERYTHING! 

---

Blaming Leftwich for Winston and hyperbolizing what portion of the fanbase wanted Leftwich to be the next HC seems like a fun way to spend a weekend.

LOL

Between the board, twitter, and local radio, the sense I got on fans wanting Leftwich was as follows:


----------------------------------------------

Primary Initial reaction from fans over 40: He ain't ready. Give him a few years.

Primary Initial reaction from most younger fans: Former Jag + I like throwback unis + Arians endorsement + Brady factor must be a good thing , right?   = I LIKE IT - HIRE BYRON

-----------------------------------------------

Secondary Reaction from about 50% of fans over 40 as coaching search drags on: Well, Bruce had good things to say, he gels well with Brady, and he'll be boatloads better than Meyer. Maybe this is worth a flyer. Still kinda' wanted Pederson or another guy with more experience, but...

Secondary reaction from most younger fans: NOOOOO!! - Khan and Baalke are gonna' ruin this and let Byron get away!  We HAVE to have him! Leftwich is EVERYTHING! 

Lmao as a fan who is under 40 I can confirm this tracks with most fans I know in that age range. I wasn’t beating he drum for him prior to the dilla leak but I got on board after a few days.

Same with Pederson. That’s just me though. A lot of  people I know in that age range went bat [BLEEP] from the rip and thought it was a great thing.

---

Personally, I liked the idea of an up and coming coordinator.  That's been the trend with many of the successful, young, head-coaching hires WITHOUT lengthy resumes.  The fact that it was Leftwich had very little to do with it.  I'm not going to list the names AGAIN of 'inexperienced' coordinators that have become successful head coaches as they have been mentioned several times. 

I wasn't 'beating the drum' for anybody but would have liked the hire.  Pederson was my second choice so I'm not going to complain and never have.

---

"Bottom of the barrel" is going too far, but you are also completely failing to mention the fact that the 2019 Bucs were DEAD LAST in giveaways.  Not below average, not bottom third, not ranked 31st.  Their offense was 32 out of 32 teams in giveaways.  Winston had his career high in interceptions and it isn't even remotely close.   Any team could inflate their yardage totals if they were willing to risk a ton of interceptions.  If you don't think interceptions matter, then you must think Blake Bortles was a good quarterback.

Lol, leaves out the most important.  Not only was it dead last, it was the most Ints thrown in a season all time.  I remember when Olsen got a lot of heat here the year Blake threw 18 picks and we had 2 thousand yard WRs, people were calling for his head and he did get fired that year.  Byron can thank God that Brady returned, he might get a HC gig now, Brady will always have his offenses top of the league regardless of the OC or HC.  Most first time HCs don't get to come in and bark orders on who their GM is going to be.  I think Byron might be able to be a good HC but its really an unknown being Brady is his QB and is he a leader of 53 men?  Not sure but no other teams fans wanted Byron outside of this fan base, if he didn't play here before everyone wouldn't of wanted him like they did.  When you bring in a OC to be a HC it's much more than is he just a good offensive play caller.

(Emphasis added)

The first bold underlined portion is demonstrably and spectacularly false.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/t...m/1988.htm

Hell, it's not even the most INTs thrown in a season in Tampa history, much less all time.

https://www.footballdb.com/leaders/seaso...erceptions

---

Sideways hat.

Talks funny.

Probably wears his pants low.

Something about these memories is familiar. What could it be? Whatever could it be?

Throw in "he is wholly unqualified" to boot.

Funny how that works/

---

 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

Lol, leaves out the most important.  Not only was it dead last, it was the most Ints thrown in a season all time.  I remember when Olsen got a lot of heat here the year Blake threw 18 picks and we had 2 thousand yard WRs, people were calling for his head and he did get fired that year.  Byron can thank God that Brady returned, he might get a HC gig now, Brady will always have his offenses top of the league regardless of the OC or HC.  Most first time HCs don't get to come in and bark orders on who their GM is going to be.  I think Byron might be able to be a good HC but its really an unknown being Brady is his QB and is he a leader of 53 men?  Not sure but no other teams fans wanted Byron outside of this fan base, if he didn't play here before everyone wouldn't of wanted him like they did.  When you bring in a OC to be a HC it's much more than is he just a good offensive play caller.

(Emphasis added)

The first bold underlined portion is demonstrably and spectacularly false.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/t...m/1988.htm

Hell, it's not even the most INTs thrown in a season in Tampa history, much less all time.

https://www.footballdb.com/leaders/seaso...erceptions

---

Sideways hat.

Talks funny.

Probably wears his pants low.

Something about these memories is familiar. What could it be? Whatever could it be?

Throw in "he is wholly unqualified" to boot.

Funny how that works/

Hahahaha

Mic. Drop.

---

Lol, leaves out the most important.  Not only was it dead last, it was the most Ints thrown in a season all time.  I remember when Olsen got a lot of heat here the year Blake threw 18 picks and we had 2 thousand yard WRs, people were calling for his head and he did get fired that year.  Byron can thank God that Brady returned, he might get a HC gig now, Brady will always have his offenses top of the league regardless of the OC or HC.  Most first time HCs don't get to come in and bark orders on who their GM is going to be.  I think Byron might be able to be a good HC but its really an unknown being Brady is his QB and is he a leader of 53 men?  Not sure but no other teams fans wanted Byron outside of this fan base, if he didn't play here before everyone wouldn't of wanted him like they did.  When you bring in a OC to be a HC it's much more than is he just a good offensive play caller.

(Emphasis added)

The first bold underlined portion is demonstrably and spectacularly false.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/t...m/1988.htm

Hell, it's not even the most INTs thrown in a season in Tampa history, much less all time.

https://www.footballdb.com/leaders/seaso...erceptions

---

Sideways hat.

Talks funny.

Probably wears his pants low.

Something about these memories is familiar. What could it be? Whatever could it be?

Throw in "he is wholly unqualified" to boot.

Funny how that works/

Ok my bad, I didn't look at stats I just remember someone saying it.  Maybe they said the most in 30 years.  Still 12 more than Bortles and was a huge reason in the firing of Olsen.

---

(Emphasis added)

The first bold underlined portion is demonstrably and spectacularly false.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/t...m/1988.htm

Hell, it's not even the most INTs thrown in a season in Tampa history, much less all time.

https://www.footballdb.com/leaders/seaso...erceptions

---

Throw in "he is wholly unqualified" to boot.

Funny how that works/

Hahahaha

Mic. Drop.

Mic drop because I had the ever wrong?  Lmao, most in 30 years, is that a lot better for you? lol.

---

"Bottom of the barrel" is going too far, but you are also completely failing to mention the fact that the 2019 Bucs were DEAD LAST in giveaways.  Not below average, not bottom third, not ranked 31st.  Their offense was 32 out of 32 teams in giveaways.  Winston had his career high in interceptions and it isn't even remotely close.   Any team could inflate their yardage totals if they were willing to risk a ton of interceptions.  If you don't think interceptions matter, then you must think Blake Bortles was a good quarterback.

INTs DO matter, but that isn't necessarily the result of poor playcalling or poor offensive design...things that would indicate a faulty offensive coordinator.  The same offensive coordinator running many of the similar plays finished 3rd in scoring the very next year and won the Super Bowl, and the QB did not throw 30 INTs.  Brady threw 12 INTs. In 2021, Brady threw 12 INTs again.  The positive offensive output was consistent over those three years, but the turnovers decreased.  If BLs presence had nothing to do with the positive offense output and causes QBs to throw higher INTs , explain that. 

My mandate in this debate was not to show it's impossible for BLs offense to perform poorly in some areas, but to show there is some basis to think he may be a good head coach.  Considering the Bucs offense finished 3rd or higher in scoring for three straight seasons, only two of which were with Brady, there is ample reason to think he may have something to offer as a head coach, especially in light of the other successful head coaches I listed who had less experience and success as offensive coordinators than BL has had.

Tom Brady didn't have a lot of interceptions because he's Tom Brady.  As many have said, he doesn't need a coach.  He can coach himself.  I think that's the point.

The question becomes has Leftwich shown himself to be an effective offensive coordinator when he doesn't have Tom Brady as his quarterback?  He took over as offensive coordinator mid-season with the Arizona Cardinals.  They finished dead last (32 out of 32) in both points and yards.  No one can credibly call that season a success.  It leaves his one year with the Bucs with Jameis Winston as quarterback.  Leftwich supporters, as you did, will point to the large number of yards and touchdowns.  However, just as you did, they will conveniently leave out the part about the 30 interceptions and the team finishing dead last in the NFL in giveaways.  

As far as interceptions not being Leftwich's fault, I find it hard to believe that it is a coincidence that Winston's number of interceptions under Leftwich were over double the amount he averaged in prior seasons and then the interceptions dramatically decreased once again when he switched teams.  He only had 3 interceptions in 7 starts last year.  I don't think it is hard to connect the dots.  His high passing yards and touchdowns in 2019 were clearly the result of him taking chances and making risky throws.  Yes, it leads to more yards, but it also leads to more interceptions.  You can't fairly judge the 2019 Bucs offense without mentioning giveaways.  At best, it was mixed results and even that seems overly generous.  Was Blake Bortles a mixed quarterback or a bad quarterback?  I think most would overwhelmingly say a bad quarterback.

I want to make it clear that I'm not hating on Leftwich.  He has done well with Brady.  Having Brady doesn't prove you are a bad offensive coordinator.  The problem is that it also doesn't prove that you are a good one.  Teams with head coach openings won't have the GOAT and most of them won't have someone even remotely close.  Leftwich's lack of success outside of Brady is the main factor holding him back from getting one of the head coaching jobs.  It has nothing to with race or how he wore his hat in the past.  Ironically, I think Brady un-retiring is a huge blow to Leftwich.  If Leftwich could have taken some inferior quarterback this year and still delivered high results, his chances of getting a head coaching job would have increased significantly.

---

INTs DO matter, but that isn't necessarily the result of poor playcalling or poor offensive design...things that would indicate a faulty offensive coordinator.  The same offensive coordinator running many of the similar plays finished 3rd in scoring the very next year and won the Super Bowl, and the QB did not throw 30 INTs.  Brady threw 12 INTs. In 2021, Brady threw 12 INTs again.  The positive offensive output was consistent over those three years, but the turnovers decreased.  If BLs presence had nothing to do with the positive offense output and causes QBs to throw higher INTs , explain that. 

My mandate in this debate was not to show it's impossible for BLs offense to perform poorly in some areas, but to show there is some basis to think he may be a good head coach.  Considering the Bucs offense finished 3rd or higher in scoring for three straight seasons, only two of which were with Brady, there is ample reason to think he may have something to offer as a head coach, especially in light of the other successful head coaches I listed who had less experience and success as offensive coordinators than BL has had.

Tom Brady didn't have a lot of interceptions because he's Tom Brady.  As many have said, he doesn't need a coach.  He can coach himself.  I think that's the point.

The question becomes has Leftwich shown himself to be an effective offensive coordinator when he doesn't have Tom Brady as his quarterback?  He took over as offensive coordinator mid-season with the Arizona Cardinals.  They finished dead last (32 out of 32) in both points and yards.  No one can credibly call that season a success.  It leaves his one year with the Bucs with Jameis Winston as quarterback.  Leftwich supporters, as you did, will point to the large number of yards and touchdowns.  However, just as you did, they will conveniently leave out the part about the 30 interceptions and the team finishing dead last in the NFL in giveaways.  

As far as interceptions not being Leftwich's fault, I find it hard to believe that it is a coincidence that Winston's number of interceptions under Leftwich were over double the amount he averaged in prior seasons and then the interceptions dramatically decreased once again when he switched teams.  He only had 3 interceptions in 7 starts last year.  I don't think it is hard to connect the dots.  His high passing yards and touchdowns in 2019 were clearly the result of him taking chances and making risky throws.  Yes, it leads to more yards, but it also leads to more interceptions.  You can't fairly judge the 2019 Bucs offense without mentioning giveaways.  At best, it was mixed results and even that seems overly generous.  Was Blake Bortles a mixed quarterback or a bad quarterback?  I think most would overwhelmingly say a bad quarterback.

I want to make it clear that I'm not hating on Leftwich.  He has done well with Brady.  Having Brady doesn't prove you are a bad offensive coordinator.  The problem is that it also doesn't prove that you are a good one.  Teams with head coach openings won't have the GOAT and most of them won't have someone even remotely close.  Leftwich's lack of success outside of Brady is the main factor holding him back from getting one of the head coaching jobs.  It has nothing to with race or how he wore his hat in the past.  Ironically, I think Brady un-retiring is a huge blow to Leftwich.  If Leftwich could have taken some inferior quarterback this year and still delivered high results, his chances of getting a head coaching job would have increased significantly.

Interesting reply on any number of levels.

In your first paragraph, you discuss the greatness of Tom Brady and how at this stage of his career he doesn't  need coaching.  It's not a point wholly without merit.  However, it also doesn't come without inconsistency.  For instance, if a player can be so great he doesn't need coaching, isn't it possible...even probable that a player could be so bad that no amount of coaching can help him be a productive NFL QB?  In your second paragraph, you noted that BL coached Rosen (then a rookie) for half a season, and the season was statistically horrible offensively.  But since he left Arizona, Rosen left the Cardinals too.  Rosen went to Miami via trade after the one year, then he went to SF only to be cut in preseason, and is currently with Atlanta.  But none of the other offensive minds who coached him got anything good out of him, either.  But you and the other guy still hold all of that against BL.  Why?  If you are going to completely disregard BL's experience with Tom Brady, an all time great, why not disregard the half season he was saddled with a complete bust in Josh Rosen?

For that matter, why hold Brady's greatness against Leftwich at all?

Let's look at a guy who most consider to be the gold standard of coaches...Bill Belichick.  This is what he had to work with as a defensive coordinator with the Giants, before he got his first NFL head coaching job.

Lawrence Taylor, Hall of Famer, member of NFL's 75th and 100th anniversary All time teams.
Harry Caron, Hall of Famer
Carl Banks, Pro Bowler
Pepper Johnson, Pro Bowler
Leonard Marshall, Pro Bowler
Jim Burt, Pro bowler
Terry Kinard, Pro Bowler
Everson Walls, Pro Bowler

Was that abundance of talent on that side of the ball held against him negatively?!?  Of course not.

The embarrassment of riches he's had to work with has been even more shocking when you look at what he had to work with as a head coach.


  Over the course of his coaching career as an coordinator and a head coach, Bill Belicheck coached SIX (6) guys on the NFL's all time 1005h anniversary list:

Junior Seau
Tom Brady
Adam Vinatieri
Rob Gronkowski
Randy Moss

To say nothing of other Hall of Famers who didn't make the All time 100th Anniversary team like

Richard Seymour,
Ty Law

to say nothing of guys who have yet to make the Hall of Fame but are strong candidates to do so:

Darelle Revis
Vince Wilfork
Logan Mankins
Aqib Talib

or to say nothing of Pro bowlers who may not be Hall of Famers

Matt Light
Rodney Harrison
Willie McGinest
Lawyer Milloy
Tedy Bruschi
Jerod Mayo
Wes Welker
Dan Koppen
Damien Woody

Were there any times during his career when he didn't have the overwhelming abundance of talent?

Yes.

When he got his first head coaching gig in Cleveland he had one (1) winning season in five (5) years.

So why isn't that abundance of talent used against him the way it is with BL?

There are similar analysis to be made with other coaches

Chuck Noll coaches the Steelers to be the team of the 1970s, winning four Super Bowls.

He coached numerous Hall of Famers, including

QB Terry Bradshaw
RB Franco Harris
WR Lynn Swann
WR John Stallworth
C Mike Webster (member of 75h & 100th anniversary all time teams)
DL Joe Greene (member of 75th & 100th anniversary all time teams
LB Jack Ham (member 75th and 100th anniversary all time team)
LB Jack Lambert (member 75th & 100th anniversary all time team)
CB Mel Blount (member 75th and 100th anniversary all time team
S Donnie Shell
and this doesn't factor in L.C. Greenwood who SHOULD be in the Hall of Fame, but isn't, having made 6 Pro bowls, been on the All decade team, and with 4 Super Bowl rings.

When those players began to retire, the Steelers fell off dramatically, and never went to another Super Bowl until Noll was replaced in the 1990s by Bill Cowher.  So if Noll didn't achieve anything of substance as a coach until he got hall of famers on his roster, why doesn't his accomplishments get discredited like BLs?

There is a similar dynamic with the current coaches.  The guy coaching the Chargers coached a guy who is headed for the Hall of Fame in Aaron Donald.  In fact, he (Donald)might be headed for one of those anniversary type teams. Furthermore, as much as it will sicken many here, Ramsey may be joining him at least in Canton Yet nobody holds that against him as a coach, even though last year,he had one of the Bosa brothers, a great player in his own right, and they couldn't stop anyone.  But his success as a coordinator wasn't held against him because he has two likely Hall of Famers.

The fact is, coaches need talent to be successful.  It's spectaculrly disingenuous to hold BL responsible for not producing with a documented bust like Josh Rosen, yet disregard his accomplishments with a great QB and not do the same to other coaches, nor have any of you expressed anything approaching a compelling reason why such a double standard would be utilized.

As for the interceptions I "conveniently" omitted, I provided MULTIPLE links to the very information you complained I omitted, all in plain view for anyone choosing to avail themselves of the facts. I even gave the poster tips on how to be more compelling.  Though I try to be generous, I clearly exceeded that standard here and have zero obligation to make his argument for him, particularly when he expressly rejected the idea of supporting his assertions with anything of substance.

---

 

Worst to 1st.  Curse Reversed!

Tom Brady didn't have a lot of interceptions because he's Tom Brady.  As many have said, he doesn't need a coach.  He can coach himself.  I think that's the point.

The question becomes has Leftwich shown himself to be an effective offensive coordinator when he doesn't have Tom Brady as his quarterback?  He took over as offensive coordinator mid-season with the Arizona Cardinals.  They finished dead last (32 out of 32) in both points and yards.  No one can credibly call that season a success.  It leaves his one year with the Bucs with Jameis Winston as quarterback.  Leftwich supporters, as you did, will point to the large number of yards and touchdowns.  However, just as you did, they will conveniently leave out the part about the 30 interceptions and the team finishing dead last in the NFL in giveaways.  

As far as interceptions not being Leftwich's fault, I find it hard to believe that it is a coincidence that Winston's number of interceptions under Leftwich were over double the amount he averaged in prior seasons and then the interceptions dramatically decreased once again when he switched teams.  He only had 3 interceptions in 7 starts last year.  I don't think it is hard to connect the dots.  His high passing yards and touchdowns in 2019 were clearly the result of him taking chances and making risky throws.  Yes, it leads to more yards, but it also leads to more interceptions.  You can't fairly judge the 2019 Bucs offense without mentioning giveaways.  At best, it was mixed results and even that seems overly generous.  Was Blake Bortles a mixed quarterback or a bad quarterback?  I think most would overwhelmingly say a bad quarterback.

I want to make it clear that I'm not hating on Leftwich.  He has done well with Brady.  Having Brady doesn't prove you are a bad offensive coordinator.  The problem is that it also doesn't prove that you are a good one.  Teams with head coach openings won't have the GOAT and most of them won't have someone even remotely close.  Leftwich's lack of success outside of Brady is the main factor holding him back from getting one of the head coaching jobs.  It has nothing to with race or how he wore his hat in the past.  Ironically, I think Brady un-retiring is a huge blow to Leftwich.  If Leftwich could have taken some inferior quarterback this year and still delivered high results, his chances of getting a head coaching job would have increased significantly.

Interesting reply on any number of levels.

In your first paragraph, you discuss the greatness of Tom Brady and how at this stage of his career he doesn't  need coaching.  It's not a point wholly without merit.  However, it also doesn't come without inconsistency.  For instance, if a player can be so great he doesn't need coaching, isn't it possible...even probable that a player could be so bad that no amount of coaching can help him be a productive NFL QB?  In your second paragraph, you noted that BL coached Rosen (then a rookie) for half a season, and the season was statistically horrible offensively.  But since he left Arizona, Rosen left the Cardinals too.  Rosen went to Miami via trade after the one year, then he went to SF only to be cut in preseason, and is currently with Atlanta.  But none of the other offensive minds who coached him got anything good out of him, either.  But you and the other guy still hold all of that against BL.  Why?  If you are going to completely disregard BL's experience with Tom Brady, an all time great, why not disregard the half season he was saddled with a complete bust in Josh Rosen?

For that matter, why hold Brady's greatness against Leftwich at all?

Let's look at a guy who most consider to be the gold standard of coaches...Bill Belichick.  This is what he had to work with as a defensive coordinator with the Giants, before he got his first NFL head coach.

Lawrence Taylor, Hall of Famer, member of NFL's 75th and 100th anniversary All time teams.
Harry Caron, Hall of Famer
Carl Banks, Pro Bowler
Pepper Johnson, Pro Bowler
Leonard Marshall, Pro Bowler
Jim Burt, Pro bowler
Terry Kinard, Pro Bowler
Everson Walls, Pro Bowler

Was that abundance of talent on that side of the ball held against him negatively?!?  Of course not.

The embarrassment of riches he's had to work with has been even more shocking when you look at what he had to work with as a head coach.


  Over the course of his coaching career as an coordinator and a head coach, Bill Belicheck coached SIX (6) guys on the NFL's all time 1005h anniversary list:

Junior Seau
Tom Brady
Adam Vinatieri
Rob Gronkowski
Randy Moss

To say nothing of other Hall of Famers who didn't make the All time 100th Anniversary team like

Richard Seymour,
Ty Law

to say nothing of guys who have yet to make the Hall of Fame but are strong candidates to do so:

Darelle Revis
Vince Wilfork
Logan Mankins
Aqib Talib

or to say nothing of Pro bowlers who may not be Hall of Famers

Matt Light
Rodney Harrison
Willie McGinest
Lawyer Milloy
Tedy Bruschi
Jerod Mayo
Wes Welker
Dan Koppen
Damien Woody

Were there any times during his career when he didn't have the overwhelming abundance of talent?

Yes.

When he got his first head coaching gig in Cleveland he had one (1) winning season in five (5) years.

So why isn't that abundance of talent used against him the way it is with BL?

There are similar analysis not only to be made with other coaches

Chuck Noll coaches the Steelers to be the team of the 1970s, winning four Super Bowls.

He coached numerous Hall of Famers, including

QB Terry Bradshaw
RB Franco Harris
WR Lynn Swann
WR John Stallworth
C Mike Webster (member of 75h & 100th anniversary all time teams)
DL Joe Greene (member of 75th & 100th anniversary all time teams
LB Jack Ham (member 75th and 100th anniversary all time team)
LB Jack Lambert (member 75th & 100th anniversary all time team)
CB Mel Blount (member 75th and 100th anniversary all time team
S Donnie Shell
and this doesn't factor in L.C. Greenwood who SHOULD be in the Hall of Fame, but isn't, having made 6 Pro bowls, been on the All decade team, and with 4 Super Bowl rings.

When those players began to retire, the Steelers fell off dramatically, and never went to another Super Bowl until Noll was replaced in the 1990s by Bill Cowher.  So if Noll didn't achieve anything of substance as a coach until he got hall of famers on his roster, why doesn't his accomplishments get discredited like BLs?

There is a similar dynamic with the current coaches.  The guy coaching the Chargers coached a guy who is headed for the Hall of Fame in Aaron Donald.  In fact, he might be headed for one of those anniversary type teams.  Yet nobody holds that against him as a coach, even though last year,he had one of the Bosa brothers, a great player in his own right, and they couldn't stop anyone.  But his success as a coordinator wasn't held against him.

The fact is, coaches need talent to be successful.  It's spectaculrly disingenuous to hold BL responsible for not producing with a documented bust like Josh Rosen, yet disregard his accomplishments with a great QB and not do the same to other coaches, nor have any of you expressed anything approaching a compelling reason why such a double standard would be utilized.

As for the interceptions I "conveniently" omitted, I provided MULTIPLE links to the very information you complained I omitted, all in plain view for anyone choosing to avail themselves of the facts.  I even gave the poster tips on how to be more compelling.  Though I try to be generous, I clearly exceeded that standard hare and have zero obligation to make his argument for him, particularly when he expressly rejected the idea of supporting his assertions with anything of substance.

Officer, that murder has just become a double homicide!

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