I mean

That defence won us the Cowboys game in overtime
That defence also sent us past the titans to win the divison

The defense put them in the hole in that cowboys game to begin with. 

That titans game probably goes a different way if we aren't facing backup QBs.

I'm not disagreeing with your points. The defense was scrappy good at times in those games.
Just adding some perspective.

---

I mean

That defence won us the Cowboys game in overtime
That defence also sent us past the titans to win the divison

The defense put the in the hole in that cowboys game to begin with. 

That titans game probably goes a different way if we aren't facing backup QBs.

I'm not disagreeing with your points. The defense was scrappy good at times in those games.
Just adding some perspective.

We can say that about the offense too; they played hot and cold even in the same game most weeks. They were scrappy good but far from a complete team at this point.

---

“An empty vessel makes the loudest sound, so they that have the least wit are the greatest babblers.”. - Plato

The defense put the in the hole in that cowboys game to begin with. 

That titans game probably goes a different way if we aren't facing backup QBs.

I'm not disagreeing with your points. The defense was scrappy good at times in those games.
Just adding some perspective.

We can say that about the offense too; they played hot and cold even in the same game most weeks. They were scrappy good but far from a complete team at this point.

That's true. The deficit in talent between the two units is apparent, however. 
When the offense steps on the gas, they have more horsepower to work with currently.

---

This conversation is reminding me of the 2009 saints squad that won the Super Bowl and had a very opportunistic defense who played bend don't break D along side a very potent offense. I know that team is probably a few steps ahead of where we're at, but is that team the model for this one?

And you know you're getting old when now 14 years removed from that season doesn't at all feel like that long ago.

---

I think they're better than their overall rankings show however I believe there are significant improvements to be made. I do think the Front Office seems to believe most of that improvement will come from development of players we already have, which if you look how they improved over the season it's not hard to see that thought. I still think they need some pieces but it's not the disaster it seemed to be at times early last year. They're good enough for a QB like Trevor to win with.

---

IT WAS ALWAYS THE JAGS

I agree that the pass rush has to step up big time here. Lets hope one or more of these young bucks develop.

---

unforttanttly Jags defense left, and went to tittians.  Key was  upset cause he said jags disrepected him when the possbille truth is jags didn't have room in cap space salary to keep Key.

---

snowwolf titans owner in madden.

note titans owner means im undeafted againest them. 

unforttanttly Jags defense left, and went to tittians.  Key was  upset cause he said jags disrepected him when the possbille truth is jags didn't have room in cap space salary to keep Key.

Key had 4.5 sacks all year last year. That kind of production is easily replaced. I think he is over rated.

---

unforttanttly Jags defense left, and went to tittians.  Key was  upset cause he said jags disrepected him when the possbille truth is jags didn't have room in cap space salary to keep Key.

Key had 4.5 sacks all year last year. That kind of production is easily replaced. I think he is over rated.

Key was a lucky FA grab

Miller lloyd can easily replicate those stats

---

Here’s how it went .

Sacks

Allen 7
Smoot 5
Key 4.5
Walker 3.5
Robert Harris 3

---

Here’s how it went .

Sacks

Allen 7
Smoot 5
Key 4.5
Walker 3.5
Robert Harris 3

It is way to early to mess with the thinkmeat....had me boggled over who Robert Harris was...you mean RoyRob!

---

As long as they can stop the run, the other stuff can be worked on and improved

Especially in our division where the run game is the primary focus of the Titans, Colts, and Texans.

---

Here’s how it went .

Sacks

Allen 7
Smoot 5
Key 4.5
Walker 3.5
Robert Harris 3

It is way to early to mess with the thinkmeat....had me boggled over who Robert Harris was...you mean RoyRob!

Yes him lol

---

The defense as a unit, wasn't horrible. The biggest issue they had all season was giving up monster sized passing plays late in the game, and it typically was over the head of shaq griffin or tre herndon. Outside of that, we lacked a significant pass rush.

Which play was over Herndon’s head? I would like to go back and watch it.

---

The defense as a unit, wasn't horrible. The biggest issue they had all season was giving up monster sized passing plays late in the game, and it typically was over the head of shaq griffin or tre herndon. Outside of that, we lacked a significant pass rush.

Which play was over Herndon’s head? I would like to go back and watch it.

First one that cost us a game? Against Denver last year with about 3:30 ish left in the 4th. Deep bomb, he got lost on a straight line go route for 49 yards. Got cooked by one of the most inept passing offenses i've ever witnessed last season.

It was about 10 seconds of game clock from us taking the lead to him giving up that big chunker to Wilson.


If you're wondering why it was week 8, it's because this was his second game replacing Shaq Griffin, who prior to being injured or whatever was doing the same thing.

---

Which play was over Herndon’s head? I would like to go back and watch it.

First one that cost us a game? Against Denver last year with about 3:30 ish left in the 4th. Deep bomb, he got lost on a straight line go route for 49 yards. Got cooked by one of the most inept passing offenses i've ever witnessed last season.

It was about 10 seconds of game clock from us taking the lead to him giving up that big chunker to Wilson.


If you're wondering why it was week 8, it's because this was his second game replacing Shaq Griffin, who prior to being injured or whatever was doing the same thing.

CAP!

Herndon was in man press coverage and the WR get an outside release and it was a perfect pass that was caught by the WR and Herndon quickly tackled him.

What you didn’t mention was Campbell got shook out of his cleats on a reverse play that could have stopped them from scoring a TD.

And you didn’t mention how Williams wiffed at air when he tried to tackle Latvius Murray when he went in for the TD. Which was about 5 or 6 plays after Herndon’s right coverage.

What’s up with that ?

---

I don't understand the bickering over Herndon. (especially the few games he played outside)
What's the point of hashing out which bad coverage was worse than another.

We had bad coverage last year everywhere outside of Campbell and the period that Williams finally moved outside.

Griffin was terrible outside.
Everyone who tried to replace him outside was also really bad until Williams got there. (they tried a few - all sucked)

Williams struggled in the slot and then Herndon took over and played well in the box as a nickel but when he had to cover.

We are good with Campbell, and we should be good short-term with Williams opposite him.

The ONLY thing we need to fret for this particular season is whether or not a street free agent or late round rookie can beat Herndon out to start in the slot.
Unfortunately - Everything points to us getting beaten like a drum by the better slot receivers we face in 2023 unless we unearth talent from a heap of nobodies.

---

Griffin was horrible

---

Griffin was horrible

He went from a very decent player to a way below average cb. I’m still surprised. Did he get signed yet by any team?

I think I remember Herndon getting burnt in the giants game too.

---

I don't understand the bickering over Herndon. (especially the few games he played outside)
What's the point of hashing out which bad coverage was worse than another.

We had bad coverage last year everywhere outside of Campbell and the period that Williams finally moved outside.

Griffin was terrible outside.
Everyone who tried to replace him outside was also really bad until Williams got there. (they tried a few - all sucked)

Williams struggled in the slot and then Herndon took over and played well in the box as a nickel but when he had to cover.

We are good with Campbell, and we should be good short-term with Williams opposite him.

The ONLY thing we need to fret for this particular season is whether or not a street free agent or late round rookie can beat Herndon out to start in the slot.
Unfortunately - Everything points to us getting beaten like a drum by the better slot receivers we face in 2023 unless we unearth talent from a heap of nobodies.

You answered your own question, but go on girl.

---

Griffin was horrible

He went from a very decent player to a way below average cb. I’m still surprised. Did he get signed yet by any team?

I think I remember Herndon getting burnt in the giants game too.

You'd be right, he got cooked in pretty much every game he played.

---