Everyone seems to be discussing 3 players. Hutch, Thibs and Neal. All 3 may very well be good players in time.  The way I see it Hutch disappeared when he played against a stout SEC line both times this year. (Alabama and Georgia) Thibs played in the PAC-10 not know this year for its superior offensive lines. It was a shame he did not play against Ohio State, but against Utah he had 8 tackles over the span of 2 games. These guys will face much better competition as rookies so I would set my expectations lower for these guys if we draft them. Will they be good in time? Yea maybe so, but I do not expect they are the silver bullet to cure all our pass rush issues. It is flawed to say drafting one of them will make our offense better.

What I saw last year was a defense that played fairly well after the bye week. They were not the main reason we lost games. They would get a stop and be rewarded by a 3 and out,  then come back on the field with the other team in pretty good field position.  Guys we were 31st in time of possession last year. (20th the last 3 games) As a point of comparison in 2017 we were 5th and that was with Bortles as QB. The offense begins with the line.  Sure Cincinnati had a questionable line. They also had a QB that lead the league in sacks too. In fact the super bowl ended with him being sacked. (you really want that?) 

We have Little and Taylor under contract and can tag Cam.  Taylor has been less than what we would like. So unless you want to be talking next year about tagging Cam again we may want to pick the best available offensive tackle. We would still need to tag Cam this year as just like the edge guys the any o-lineman we draft will need some time to adjust as well. If we wait till the second round it appears the best will be long gone by the 33rd pick but then I guess we could get lucky.

Now free agency and the cap issues  of other teams can change every thing ....

Michigan didn't play Alabama last season. They only played Georgia. 

The Offensive Tackles in this draft aren't even close to being #1 overall picks. That would be reaching. You take the BAP.

Yea, my bad.  I was thinking of the Orange bowl last year and typed Alabama as well as Georgia. What I deserve for not proof reading.  Main point is anyone we pick at #1 will take some time to contribute.  There is no "stud in a box just add water" in this draft. I am hoping free agency and cap issues will allow us to snatch up some solid linemen.

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A new broom always sweeps clean.

Michigan didn't play Alabama last season. They only played Georgia. 

The Offensive Tackles in this draft aren't even close to being #1 overall picks. That would be reaching. You take the BAP.

Yea, my bad.  I was thinking of the Orange bowl last year and typed Alabama as well as Georgia. What I deserve for not proof reading.  Main point is anyone we pick at #1 will take some time to contribute.  There is no "stud in a box just add water" in this draft. I am hoping free agency and cap issues will allow us to snatch up some solid linemen.

I don't know if I completely agree with that.

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More evidence that you don't need to spend elite capital to get a good enough line to win a super bowl. 

Tag Cam and move to RT, re-sign Shatley to be a top shelf backup IOL for when Linder gets hurt, get two more starting IOL between FA and day 2 draft pick (I prefer just paying two IOL). 

There is our good enough oline, especially since we know Trevor will make the line look even better than it already is. 

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More evidence that you don't need to spend elite capital to get a good enough line to win a super bowl. 

Tag Cam and move to RT, re-sign Shatley to be a top shelf backup IOL for when Linder gets hurt, get two more starting IOL between FA and day 2 draft pick (I prefer just paying two IOL). 

There is our good enough oline, especially since we know Trevor will make the line look even better than it already is. 

So, Day 1= 1 round
Day 2 = 2 rounds
Day 3= 4 rounds.  Of course there will be more in those rounds lol

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So, Day 1= 1 round
Day 2 = 2 rounds
Day 3= 4 rounds.  Of course there will be more in those rounds lol

Yet all of the talk is that if we don't take OT at 1 then Trevor is going to be ruined when the stats show that you can get super bowl caliber OL all throughout the draft and through FA or a tradel. That's why I keep giving my outline to fix the OL without having to go overboard using the #1 pick on an OL.

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So, Day 1= 1 round
Day 2 = 2 rounds
Day 3= 4 rounds.  Of course there will be more in those rounds lol

Yet all of the talk is that if we don't take OT at 1 then Trevor is going to be ruined when the stats show that you can get super bowl caliber OL all throughout the draft and through FA or a tradel. That's why I keep giving my outline to fix the OL without having to go overboard using the #1 pick on an OL.

Agreed. Plenty of opportunities with those sixth round picks to package up and land a potential starter or two in RD4 or RD5 if they really like a player.

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"What do I know of cultured ways, the gilt, the craft and the lie? I, who was born in a naked land and bred in the open sky. The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing; Rush in and die, dogs - I was a man before I was a king."

So, Day 1= 1 round
Day 2 = 2 rounds
Day 3= 4 rounds.  Of course there will be more in those rounds lol

Yet all of the talk is that if we don't take OT at 1 then Trevor is going to be ruined when the stats show that you can get super bowl caliber OL all throughout the draft and through FA or a tradel. That's why I keep giving my outline to fix the OL without having to go overboard using the #1 pick on an OL.

Ok, I guess I missed all the talk that if we don't take a tackle at 1 Trevor will be ruined.   There's multiple ways you can go about it and win.  To me, take the BPA gives you the best chance.  If they feel Neal is the best player then take him, If they feel one of the pass rushers is the best then take them. It's not hard, it just depends on which player they have rated higher

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He warrants consideration, but I wouldn't make him my pick.  I start with BAP.  People are entitled to their opinion, but there seems to be a consensus among most that Neal is not BAP at #1.  I saw a 2022 NFL prospect tracker with 8 different sites.  Not one of them had Neal as the BAP.  Not one.  Only two had him second.  Hutch, on the other hand, was #1 in five of those sites.  While Neal is often being mocked to Jacksonville, many of them appear to be doing it largely on perceived need and sometimes ignorance.  I heard one mock drafter on the radio (who projected Neal to the Jaguars) being asked "Why not just franchise Cam Robinson?" and he was a complete deer in the headlights and just stuttered trying to find words to say.  It was obvious he hadn't even considered it.  I doubt he considered the Walker Little factor either.  Many of these professional mock drafters study the draft prospects in detail, but they often don't know the situation in all 32 teams and that's often multiplied by 10 with the Jaguars.  

In regards to needs, your stat about 6 out of our last 9 first round picks being defense sounds nice, but isn't a good argument to justify offense.  3 of those defensive draft picks are no longer on the team and a 4th isn't under contract next year and even if he was hypothetically re-signed, his name is Taven Bryan.  Of the two who are actually under contract for next year, one of them is named K'Lavon Chaisson.  Only 1 of those players is still with team and expected to be a starter for the Jaguars next year.  A single former first rounder being a good defensive player is not great a reason to blindly ignore the entire defensive side of the game.  Besides, when looking at need, I personally don't look at it as "offense" versus "defense", but position versus position.  Just because your defense is better than your offense, it doesn't mean that a defensive position couldn't be your biggest need or vice versa.  While I support taking the edge rusher at #1 this year, it doesn't mean that I'm ignoring offense this off-season.  If I had my way, it would be quite the opposite.  We have the top draft picks in the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th round and another early 3rd rounder.  I would likely use at least 3 out of those 4 picks and possibly all 4 on offense.  We also have a ton of money in free agency and would highly target offensive positions with that money.  The top pick would be a nice bone to defense, but the off-season would otherwise be a feast to the offense.

I've also seen this line about 3 offensive line starters being free agents, but I consider it to be misleading.  Bartch started the majority of the season and clearly outplayed Cann.  I consider Bartch to be last year's starting guard and would be this year's starting guard assuming the same team returned.  That leaves two starters as free agents.  One of them is Cam Robinson.  If we want him back, we got him back because of the franchise tag.  That leaves 1 player.  Norwell is the only starting offensive lineman who could leave without us choosing to let him go.  However, he's a guard.  I'm not using the #1 overall pick on a guard.  As such, he's irrelevant to the #1 overall pick discussion.

I also think versatility is extremely over-rated when talking about the #1 overall pick.  Yes, for later picks, and particularly depth picks, it's nice to have players who can play multiple positions to fill in as needed.  However, with the #1 overall pick, I'm taking him to play ONE position.  You mention Coleman and Boselli.  The versatility was with Coleman.  Did Boselli have previous experience at right tackle and guard?  I really don't know and I really don't care.  We took Boselli to play left tackle and I wouldn't want Boselli to play anything but left tackle.  If we draft an offensive lineman #1 overall, I want him at left tackle.  

This brings me to one of my big issues.  With this pick, we are doing one of two things.  One possibility is that we are drafting Neal to be right tackle.  You don't take right tackles at #1 overall.  The positional value is not there.  Let's find some other way to address it.  The other possibility is that we are putting Neal at left tackle which means we are giving up on Walker Little as a left tackle.  That feels extremely premature.  He was a rookie last year.  He was a highly touted draft pick that only dropped to the early second round because of an injury which appears to be healed.  Although it was a limited opportunity, when given a chance to play, he looked good.  I'm not guaranteeing he's the long term answer, but I reject someone who is guaranteeing he's not.  Why not wait a year and see how it plays out?  With so many needs on a 3-14 team, why are we using the very valuable #1 overall pick on a player that isn't BAP and might turn out to not even be a need?

Let's also not under-estimate the value of a good pass rush.  Put pressure on the opposing quarterback and their offense will fall apart.  I've seen it too often.  i also see what happens when you don't put pressure on the quarterback.  Good teams with good quarterbacks will walk all over you.  If our ultimate goal is to be the best, we need a dominant pass rush.  The AFC is completely loaded with great young quarterbacks.  We need to counter that with a great young pass rush.  Josh Allen isn't enough.  You need two edge rushers.  The benefits will filter through the team.  Get a good pass rush and our entire secondary will look better.  By ending these ridiculously long drives, our defense will be more rested and our run defense will be better.  Get some 3 and outs and put THEIR tired defense back on the field and our offense will look better.  Pass rush is a huge part of the game and has become more and more important with the game being centered around passing.  Last year, we drafted the most important position on offense.  This year, let's draft the most important position on defense.  Oh yeah, and he's BAP too.

Great post, Duke!

In your first paragraph, you reference the 8 or so different sites, none of which had Neal listed as the BAP overall.  While it's persuasive, it's not entirely flawless either.  In 1996, Keyshawn Johnson was viewed by many sites to be the top overall pick and the best player.  Know who else came in that draft?  Jon Ogden and Ray Lewis.  As for the mock drafter you heard on the radio, his Jaguars ignorance comes as no surprise, though Neal shouldn't be penalized because that guy was an idiot.

As for my observation that 6 out of the last 9 first round picks were on the defensive side of the ball, you are right that it's not overly persuasive, with the caveat that I admittedly did not provide sufficient context to make it more persuasive.  I did not offer that statistic to suggest there are no defensive needs.  Because we habitually foolishly are unwilling or unable to retain our good players, most notably from the 2016 draft, our top two players performance wise from that 2016 draft are gone, and neither have been sufficiently replaced.  Yes, we missed on Taven Bryan, CJ Henderson and Chaisson.  But even including all of that, the free agency expenditures of last year were overwhelmingly on the defensive side of the ball.  Rayshawn Jenkins...Griffin, Ford, RRH, Malcolm Brown, Ward...even Tyson Alualu...all on the defensive side of the ball.  The offense investment paled by comparison.  We signed Marvin Jones...a 31 year old possession WR.  We signed a blocking TE nobody heard of who had no positive impact for us last year.  We signed Carlos freaking Hyde, and everyone hated that signing from the start.  He, too, had next to no positive impact.  We screamed for them to use all of that cap room on a T...or a TE like Henry ir Jonnu Smith.  The FO did absolutely nothing.  The results of the offensive neglect in the draft since 2015 and free agency were obvious.  The defense, while not to be mistaken for the great defenses of our time, showed considerable progress in many areas, while offensively, we were the worst in our entire history.  For about half a season, there was improvement in terms of sacks allowed, but most observers would say that was due to Trevor Lawrence's pocket awareness and athletic ability.  It wasn't due to any infusion of talent.  We went with the same guys we grew to universally label a liability in 2018, 2019, and 2020.  Neglecting the OL when we have the chance to get a potentially dominant LT with would not be prudent, especially now that we have TL.  You mentioned that with the picks we have in rounds 2-4 or so might go exclusively towards the offense.  The difference is, guys who could potentially play LT and a high level are rarely found outside of the first round.  every so often, you can find a David Bakhtiari or a Michael Roos ir Matt Light, but those guys are few and far between.  Conversely, NFL history is replete with capable edge rushers like Charles Mann, Yannick Ngakoue, Greg Lloyd, Jason Taylor, Max Crosby, Jared Allen, Jason Gildon, Joey Porter being found in that range.  You may intend to address the offense later on, but the chances of you getting a T of Eveb Beal's (or Ekwonu's) caliber are small under normal circumstances, and it seems particularly small in this year's tackle class.

As for the incumbents vs. FA that are on our line, you seemingly (though perhaps not-I've no desire to misrepresent you) operate under the assumption that those incumbent OL NOT departing via free agency somehow can't or shouldn't be upgraded.  You seem quite pleased with Bartch.  I do not share your confidence in him.  I don't see him getting much movement in the running game, and I've seen him whiff on blocks in pass protection.  Did he induce projectile vomiting?  No.  But he didn't inspire much confidence, either. To me, he'd be a top reserve on a better team. I am hopeful Walker Little can be the long term answer at one of the T spots, but the fact is, he is an unknown.  He wound up starting three games last year, in part because he went two full seasons without playing college ball.  His first start was against Buffalo, and he had a rough go of it.  He performed fairly well in his other two starts at the end of the season.  Though he got practice work at RT, we never saw him there in a game.  Considering the guy starting ahead of him on the right side, either that is a damning indictment of the previous coaching staff, or a testament as to how much work Little had to do to knock off the rust.  Either way, he's still a relative unknown.  Do I really need to get started on Jawaan Taylor?  Bottom line is the current environment provided by the offensive line is not conducive to Trevor Lawrence thriving without a significant infusion of talent, and waiting until the 2nd round or later under the current circumstances.  If I could be convinced that Walker Little can handle LT at a fairly high level, and that we won't have another slew of OL injuries like we had in 2018, I might be willing to change this part of my analysis. After all, I have repeatedly pointed out that as a general rule, the best FOs build their OL in the middle rounds.  But I don't have much faith in our FO, as currently constructed, to do that.  Do you?  The success Baalke had in building the OL came largely from the first round in SF.

You dismiss versatility as being overrated.  I strongly disagree.  Whether it's the QB who can throw on the run as well as from the pocket, the edge rusher who could beat you with speed or power, the DL who could play NT, 4-3 DT or 3-4 DE, versatility is always a plus in the draft.  The Ravens had Tony Jones at LT when they drafted Ogden.  Was he a wasted pick because he played G his rookie year?  Was that Ravens draft somehow less because of that?  Of course not!  It went down as one of the best drafts in recent NFL history because they added him to the roster and found a way to get him on the field.  You never know what can happen in the future.  Aside from the whole slew of injuries thing that could necessitate a move at some point, you could have another J.J. Watt or Reggie White or Neil Smith added to the division and he'll play LDE.  When that happens, we'll want to have two very strong and talented tackles with the ability to provide good pass protection.



As for your edge rusher analysis, I agree with your assessment as a general rule, but I reiterate my previous argument about edge rushers being readily available in the middle rounds.  I don't think your analysis takes that into consideration.

I agree that eight professional sports analysts can be wrong, but so can you and me and everyone else.  If I was GM, I would watch every single snap of Neal, Hutchinson and Thibodeaux (among others).  I admit that I haven't done that.  However, from the snaps I did view, I personally saw nothing to lead me to believe that those eight people are all wrong.  Did you?  Do you consider Neal to be BAP?  If so, do you think he's significantly better than the next best player?

In regards to our current, offensive line, no, I don't think that we shouldn't try to upgrade.  I just think it is misleading to make your opening argument turnover when the reality is that with the franchise tag, 4 out of 5 starting offensive linemen from last year can be forced to return next year.  There's no guarantee the fifth won't either.  We have plenty of salary cap.  We could likely retain Norwell if wanted.  Norwell also plays guard and not tackle.  As such, I don't see a possible departure by left guard Norwell to be a compelling argument to draft a tackle with our #1 overall pick.

As far as Bartch, I am not "quite pleased" with Bartch.  I just acknowledged that he was the Jaguars best right guard last year and that he remains under contract for this year.  I did say that he clearly outplayed Cann, but I consider that a low bar to jump over as I thought Cann played terrible last year.  I just don't think you are making a compelling argument that Neal is a need because a right guard is a free agent when:  1.  Our best right guard from last year is not a free agent.  2.  Neal wouldn't play guard so he would do nothing to improve that position anyways.

You also spend a great deal of time talking about interior offensive line, right tackle, wide receiver, tight end, etc. and how we didn't focus on the right areas in free agency last year.  I agree with most of what you say, but what relevance does any of it have to this conversation?  The need question is edge versus left tackle.  That's it.  If we need an edge more than left tackle, then edge is the bigger need.  If the edge is also BAP, then it's case closed on which position to take.

In regards to versatility, I was specifically speaking about offensive line.  I go back to my Boselli example.  If Boselli had the versatility to be an excellent guard or right tackle, how would that have changed his career?  It wouldn't.  If he was a terrible guard and right tackle, how would that have changed his career?  It wouldn't.  Why would I care about whether a player can play a position when I no plans to use him there?  If I draft an offensive lineman with the first overall pick in the draft, he better be my best offensive lineman.  My best offensive lineman is going to play left tackle.  The position is far more valuable than right tackle or interior offensive lineman.  If we don't think Neal can win the job at left tackle, then he shouldn't be our pick.  Maybe you disagree, but I don't draft right tackle or interior offense line with the #1 overall pick.  The positional value just isn't there.

I've seen you and others mention Ogden and I see very little connection.  Ogden was an elite prospect on a completely different tier than Neal.  If there was a clone of Ogen available in the draft, I would take him and we wouldn't be having this conversation.  In regards to him playing guard, that was one year as a stop gap measure under a set of circumstances that don't currently exist with the Jaguars.  Ogden wasn't the first overall pick.  He was the fourth overall pick.  The Ravens didn't know in advance that he would be available.  Another team could have easily taken him.  As such, it was reasonable for the Ravens to have a starting left tackle on their roster.  I'm sure that they would have loved to have traded Tony Jones immediately following the draft, but player for player trades in the NFL are rare.  They could have traded him for draft picks, but those wouldn't be until the next year.  As such, they decided to keep him for the season and then traded him the following off-season so Ogden could move to tackle and spend the rest of his career there.  It was a one year stop gap that was immediately addressed the first opportunity that they could.  I don't have a problem with that.  It's a completely different situation than using the #1 overall pick to draft Neal to play guard or right tackle for the long term because he isn't good enough to beat a left tackle that we already had on the roster.

In regards to rounds 2 through 4, I agree with you that we are unlikely to find a good starting left tackle there.  Our disagreement appears to be that you seem to feel we must draft a left tackle this year while I don't.  We just drafted Walker Little last year.  We might already have our answer on the roster.  When you are a 3-14 team, a player being a "might" ranks pretty low on the list of needs when you have a bunch "won'ts".  You say he's a question mark, but that's a good reason to have a stop gap and we fortunately have one readily available in Cam Robinson.  While I don't love Cam as our long term answer at left tackle, I don't think he's so incredibly bad that we couldn't use him for one more year while we find out the truth about Little.  I also don't put much into Little not being able to beat out our other tackles last year.  He was a rookie competing against veterans.  He hadn't played a game in two years, so he was likely rusty as well.  In regards specifically to not beating Taylor, my understanding is that Walker Little played exclusively at left tackle in college.  As such, it's understandable that he might initially struggle at a position that he had never played before.  It's also unclear to me whether he was even given a chance to compete at right tackle.  Being a college left tackle, they might have focused his practice time in camp primarily at left tackle to be Cam's backup and assumed Richardson would be the primary backup at right.  Lastly, our coaching was so bad last year, I really don't trust their opinion at all.  They started Wingard over the freshman Cisco even though Cisco clearly looked better.  They gave Hyde a bunch of carries, including goal line situations, over Robinson which made no sense.  We're talking about a coaching staff that had Trevor Lawrence splitting first team snaps with Gardner Minshew.  Their opinion doesn't hold much weight with me.  I want a second opinion.

Lastly, you seem concerned that if we don't use the #1 overall pick on offense, that our offense won't get better.  I disagree.  As I stated before, I would likely use at least 3 and maybe 4 of our picks in the 2-4 rounds on offense.  Good interior offense line players often drop to those rounds.  There appears to be a lot of wide receivers and tight ends mocked in that range as well.  Right tackle is a little more iffy, but it wouldn't be surprising to find one of those either.  We also have a ton of money in free agency which I would focus on offense.  We can make major upgrades on offense without necessarily having to use the #1 overall pick.  I wouldn't oppose using the #1 pick on offense if it made sense, but in this case, I believe the options at edge make more sense.

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Two great posts there ^  Really well thought out and well written.  

My thinking on this issue continues to evolve.  But right now, I am strongly leaning towards retaining Robinson and drafting one of the two edge rushers.  It seems like letting go of Cam and drafting Neal is just churning our roster and not making any great improvement.  We've got plenty of cap space, so tagging Cam or signing him to a contract is not going to kill us.  He's a decent left tackle, but who do we have opposite Josh Allen?  Really not much.  Of course, all this has been said before.  

There's a million ways to skin a cat, so the above plan is of course not the only decent plan.  But it seems like the simplest, safest thing to do.  And it allows us to use the #1 overall pick on a player who will give us the greatest roster upgrade.  

Maybe I'm just gun-shy from a decade of thinking we can let a guy walk because he's easily replaced, and then acquiring a replacement who is worse than the guy we let walk.  We have Trevor Lawrence on his rookie contract for 4 more years.  If we start the rebuilding process by tearing things down first, we add years to the rebuilding process.  We know what we have in Cam Robinson.  Hutchinson and Thibodeaux are there for the taking.  Let's not make a hole in the roster that forces us into picking by position instead of by player.

So what I am saying is, let's keep Cam Robinson.

You, me, and TheDuke.  The AOL message boards live on!  Too bad HaCJax passed on.  Do you know if any other former AOL posters are here?  All we need is a team good enough to where we can run some smack and to smack around some Steelers fans, and we'll be all set.    

As to your closing paragraph, based on your reasoning, would I be correct in assuming you want to retain DJ Chark?

Still on your closing paragraph, I would draw a distinction between most of those incidents of getting rid of players and Robinson.  Just about every player we've regretted getting rid of over the years were at some point pro bowl or better caliber players.  Jalen Ramsey has been All Pro.  Yannick Ngakoue was a Pro Bowler and double digit sack guy.  Calais Campbell was once Defensive player of the year for us.  While we didn't specifically jettison Telvin Smith, we were nonetheless sickened when he retired prematurely because he made a Pro Bwol and won a few defensive player of the week awards.  Allen Robinson made the Pro Bowl for us in 2015,,,,and he was our first pro bowler at the position since Jimmy Smith.  Cam Robinson doesn't have those accolades to his credit.  While I don't think he has been as bad as many has made him out to be, nobody would mistake him for a dominant, pro bowl caliber LT.  Besides, we're in the optimal position to replace him through the draft.  In fact, if Walker Little is who we all hope he is, we already HAVE Cam's replacement on the roster.

It certainly wouldn't be the end of the world if we kept Cam Robinson and took a player at another position at #1, but the dynamic you lament is not present with the Cam Robinson situation.

I did really like the AOL board.  We had a good group of users and had some classic debates.  There are some good people on here, but there are also some that seem to have trouble following a logical argument and others who seem to be more interested in attacking and insulting instead of discussing and debating.

Was OLM on the AOL board under a different name?  His messages have an uncanny resemblance to one of the users.

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You, me, and TheDuke.  The AOL message boards live on!  Too bad HaCJax passed on.  Do you know if any other former AOL posters are here?  All we need is a team good enough to where we can run some smack and to smack around some Steelers fans, and we'll be all set.    

As to your closing paragraph, based on your reasoning, would I be correct in assuming you want to retain DJ Chark?

Still on your closing paragraph, I would draw a distinction between most of those incidents of getting rid of players and Robinson.  Just about every player we've regretted getting rid of over the years were at some point pro bowl or better caliber players.  Jalen Ramsey has been All Pro.  Yannick Ngakoue was a Pro Bowler and double digit sack guy.  Calais Campbell was once Defensive player of the year for us.  While we didn't specifically jettison Telvin Smith, we were nonetheless sickened when he retired prematurely because he made a Pro Bwol and won a few defensive player of the week awards.  Allen Robinson made the Pro Bowl for us in 2015,,,,and he was our first pro bowler at the position since Jimmy Smith.  Cam Robinson doesn't have those accolades to his credit.  While I don't think he has been as bad as many has made him out to be, nobody would mistake him for a dominant, pro bowl caliber LT.  Besides, we're in the optimal position to replace him through the draft.  In fact, if Walker Little is who we all hope he is, we already HAVE Cam's replacement on the roster.

It certainly wouldn't be the end of the world if we kept Cam Robinson and took a player at another position at #1, but the dynamic you lament is not present with the Cam Robinson situation.

I did really like the AOL board.  We had a good group of users and had some classic debates.  There are some good people on here, but there are also some that seem to have trouble following a logical argument and others who seem to be more interested in attacking and insulting instead of discussing and debating.

Was OLM on the AOL board under a different name?  His messages have an uncanny resemblance to one of the users.

No. I live in a very rural area and my AOL was very limited. When I had AOL, I could barely get online. I've been on this board for a long time, but not that long. LOL.

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I think they take him.  Just gut feel.  I don't know if it's the right or wrong move.  I think the problem this year, there is no clear-cut #1.

I think at this point, barring any official athletic testing, that the top 2 would still be Thibs and Hutch if everyone wasn't hellbent on Trevor needs help Trevor needs help Trevor needs help. I think that's driving virtually all of the OT at 1 talk.

I agree.  I read mock drafts and find it frustrating that many go as follows:

1. Jacksonville - Evan Neal - The Jaguars drafted Trevor Lawrence last year and now get him needed protection.

2.  Detroit - [Hutchinson or Thibodeaux] - The Lions get the best player in the draft.......

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I think at this point, barring any official athletic testing, that the top 2 would still be Thibs and Hutch if everyone wasn't hellbent on Trevor needs help Trevor needs help Trevor needs help. I think that's driving virtually all of the OT at 1 talk.

I agree.  I read mock drafts and find it frustrating that many go as follows:

1. Jacksonville - Evan Neal - The Jaguars drafted Trevor Lawrence last year and now get him needed protection.

2.  Detroit - [Hutchinson or Thibodeaux] - The Lions get the best player in the draft.......

Lol, exactly how it goes.

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I think at this point, barring any official athletic testing, that the top 2 would still be Thibs and Hutch if everyone wasn't hellbent on Trevor needs help Trevor needs help Trevor needs help. I think that's driving virtually all of the OT at 1 talk.

I agree.  I read mock drafts and find it frustrating that many go as follows:

1. Jacksonville - Evan Neal - The Jaguars drafted Trevor Lawrence last year and now get him needed protection.

2.  Detroit - [Hutchinson or Thibodeaux] - The Lions get the best player in the draft.......

Protection?  How easy is it to protect your QB when you're 10 points down in the 1st quarter?  How easy would it be for Neal to block a pass rush when the defense knows we're going to pass because our defense can't stop the other team?  

That's why I keep saying over and over, our defense can protect our QB just as well as a new LT can.  It's completely bogus to imply that the only way to protect Trevor is to spend our first overall pick on a LT.  An improved defense would keep us in games, thereby allowing us to use the whole playbook on offense, so we won't be forced into passing on every down.

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https://jaguarswire.usatoday.com/2022/02...er-report/

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https://jaguarswire.usatoday.com/2022/02...er-report/

If we take Neal, we've blown yet another first round pick. He's not even close to being the BAP in the draft.

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https://jaguarswire.usatoday.com/2022/02...er-report/

If we take Neal, we've blown yet another first round pick. He's not even close to being the BAP in the draft.

Yea its a tough 1 ay

I cant really put myself in baalkes or pedersons shoes this year to predict who they will go with at 1

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I don't think Neal is a blown pick. I think he'll be good to very good. In fact he'll probably be overkill for what Trevor needs to succeed with.

I think OT is not as premium of a position as pass rusher is, and I also think we have a good in house candidate to fix our bad OT by tagging Cam. We're creating a hole by letting Cam walk, and then filling it with the most valuable asset we have this offseason. That is not a good way to team build.

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I don't think Neal is a blown pick. I think he'll be good to very good. In fact he'll probably be overkill for what Trevor needs to succeed with.

I think OT is not as premium of a position as pass rusher is, and I also think we have a good in house candidate to fix our bad OT by tagging Cam. We're creating a hole by letting Cam walk, and then filling it with the most valuable asset we have this offseason. That is not a good way to team build.

I see Neal as a slightly above average RT and a slightly below average to average LT.

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Ikem or Bust IMO.

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You, me, and TheDuke.  The AOL message boards live on!  Too bad HaCJax passed on.  Do you know if any other former AOL posters are here?  All we need is a team good enough to where we can run some smack and to smack around some Steelers fans, and we'll be all set.    

As to your closing paragraph, based on your reasoning, would I be correct in assuming you want to retain DJ Chark?

Still on your closing paragraph, I would draw a distinction between most of those incidents of getting rid of players and Robinson.  Just about every player we've regretted getting rid of over the years were at some point pro bowl or better caliber players.  Jalen Ramsey has been All Pro.  Yannick Ngakoue was a Pro Bowler and double digit sack guy.  Calais Campbell was once Defensive player of the year for us.  While we didn't specifically jettison Telvin Smith, we were nonetheless sickened when he retired prematurely because he made a Pro Bwol and won a few defensive player of the week awards.  Allen Robinson made the Pro Bowl for us in 2015,,,,and he was our first pro bowler at the position since Jimmy Smith.  Cam Robinson doesn't have those accolades to his credit.  While I don't think he has been as bad as many has made him out to be, nobody would mistake him for a dominant, pro bowl caliber LT.  Besides, we're in the optimal position to replace him through the draft.  In fact, if Walker Little is who we all hope he is, we already HAVE Cam's replacement on the roster.

It certainly wouldn't be the end of the world if we kept Cam Robinson and took a player at another position at #1, but the dynamic you lament is not present with the Cam Robinson situation.

I did really like the AOL board.  We had a good group of users and had some classic debates.  There are some good people on here, but there are also some that seem to have trouble following a logical argument and others who seem to be more interested in attacking and insulting instead of discussing and debating.

Was OLM on the AOL board under a different name?  His messages have an uncanny resemblance to one of the users.

My memory of the AOL board was that defending TC in 1996 was often a very lonely job.  But I thought that somehow, if I didn't defend TC, the franchise would collapse and the world would end.  27 years later, I no longer have the energy or motivation to write those long posts I used to write.  Kudos to Bullseye and others like him who post some of the best analysis on the internet.

I also remember when AOL charged by the minute.  I was so addicted to those AOL boards that I was running up $200 monthly AOL charges.

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