Quote:When you look at his agility tests, 40 time, jumps and his relative production at the college level there is nothing to suggest that he will be better than above average rushing the passer as a three technique, let alone on the edge. And with every day that passes we as a group of informed fans should point out anyone who compared this guy to jj watt and hold them up for the world to see as frauds. This happens every year. In November they rate guys as all time greats to sell reality as a fall from grace in April.
Its a bit misleading though. Tons of prospects get picked apart leading up to the draft just to turn out to be really good.
I know how many people here are in love with Andrew luck, even he got picked apart leading up to the draft and there was talk about rg3 possibly being better.
Combine stats are nice to know, for Leonard Williams, he proved that as a big man he can move really well.
The game tape is where its at. Watch him play. He destroys blockers and generates more pressure than you would expect from the inside.
It would be up to Gus to put him in whatever position would get the most of his talent. Whether its inside or outside, you have yourself an immensely talented individual.
Quote:not that i've paid attention - but if Fowler for example has only 15 sacks in his entire career, how good could he have been as a 3rd down pass-rusher?
He only played extensively for two seasons, soooooo 15 sacks is pretty good.
Quote:He only played extensively for two seasons, soooooo 15 sacks is pretty good.
And he changes his body type over the course of his college career. Losing a decent amount of weight and getting stronger over time.
You watch him this past season when he was in the best shape and he lived in the backfield.
Quote:And he changes his body type over the course of his college career. Losing a decent amount of weight and getting stronger over time.
You watch him this past season when he was in the best shape and he lived in the backfield.
It depends on how you look at it. You can also say his weight has fluctuated and that may be a concern.
Because he isn't as good as the media will lead you to believe.
Quote:I believe the big reason why so many players get criticized a lot by everyone is because the people ranking them know they can't all be success stories.
A lot of them will fail. They have to point out weaknesses so they can say "see, I told you guys before the draft he may not be worth it"
so you like all prospects and think they will all be stars?
Quote:It depends on how you look at it. You can also say his weight has fluctuated and that may be a concern.
i dont really agree with that. he dropped weight each year and got stronger each year. it wasnt like it went up and down.
Quote:so you like all prospects and think they will all be stars?
Your reading comprehension sucks.
No.
Quote:He only played extensively for two seasons, soooooo 15 sacks is pretty good.
Not really. He has 8.5 last year, and 3.5 the year before then.
If you're not going to count his 1st year, then you can't count his 3.5 sacks his first year as well.
So you can say he had 12 sacks in 2 years if you'd like, but not 15.
I wouldnt hate a Williams pick just hope Dave goes a different route
Quote:I wouldnt hate a Williams pick just hope Dave goes a different route
I think you have to. He looks limited to only the 5 tech if his pass rushing skills are truly lacking. With Odrick on the team I don't think it would be ideal.
Quote:I think you have to. He looks limited to only the 5 tech if his pass rushing skills are truly lacking. With Odrick on the team I don't think it would be ideal.
My top 5 if we dont trade back
1a. Fowler
1b. Beasley
3. Cooper
4. Williams
5. White
Quote:I think you have to. He looks limited to only the 5 tech if his pass rushing skills are truly lacking. With Odrick on the team I don't think it would be ideal.
He looks limited how exactly? You guys are overthinking this.
Senderrick Marks got like 2 sacks/year at Auburn and he turned out just fine as a pass rushing 3T.
You know a 20 year old Williams is allowed to, idk, IMPROVE?
Williams got 20 sacks in his 3 year career, despite lacking the necessary pass rushing moves, according to some people.
Love it or hate it, this stuff happens every year. Guys get propped up and then torn down before draft. There are exceptions, but normally this happens to most players. One minute, sure fire guy, the next, may fall out of top 10. It is fun though.
Quote:Not really. He has 8.5 last year, and 3.5 the year before then.
If you're not going to count his 1st year, then you can't count his 3.5 sacks his first year as well.
So you can say he had 12 sacks in 2 years if you'd like, but not 15.
that's still pretty good (and he improved each year)... Not sure what you're trying to prove here. He was a good pass rusher in college. That cant be disputed especially if you actually watched the games.
Quote:Love it or hate it, this stuff happens every year. Guys get propped up and then torn down before draft. There are exceptions, but normally this happens to most players. One minute, sure fire guy, the next, may fall out of top 10. It is fun though.
And we are now in the home stretch of the draft, where things get the most ridiculous.
This time last year we were in the "Tom Savage might be a first round pick" phase.
Quote:that's still pretty good (and he improved each year)... Not sure what you're trying to prove here. He was a good pass rusher in college. That cant be disputed especially if you actually watched the games.
my point is that you can't say he had 15 in 2 years because he didn't. So if 12 in 2 years is good enough, you should've said that.
Improving from 3.5 sacks when playing the entire year should be expected because that's a very low number for what you call a good pass rusher.
getting 12 in 2 years is OK to pretty good, but it's not anything that wows anyone.
Quote:my point is that you can't say he had 15 in 2 years because he didn't. So if 12 in 2 years is good enough, you should've said that.
Improving from 3.5 sacks when playing the entire year should be expected because that's a very low number for what you call a good pass rusher.
getting 12 in 2 years is OK to pretty good, but it's not anything that wows anyone.
I didn't say he had 15 in two years...
His production is there. You are making up criticism that doesn't exist for him.
Quote:I didn't say he had 15 in two years...
His production is there. You are making up criticism that doesn't exist for him.
"He only played extensively for two years, soooo 15 is pretty good"
Yeah, you totally meant something completely different huh
Edit: no worries, I think I know what you mean - I just disagree that his production has been good. It was good for 1 year only, but nothing spectacular even in 2014