Quote:Of course they wouldn't admit it, but the Cowboys should absolutely wish they took Ramsey. Their YPC was a leading 4.8 yards last year, up a whopping .2 from an already top 5 in 2015. Their ascent was due waaaaaaay more from the QB leap to Prescott from Cassel/Moore/Weeden than it was from the RB leap to Elliott from McFadden. Not to mention Ramsey is more likely to play for many years longer than Elliott, at an elite level for more years before dropping off, and having fewer injuries throughout his career.
I would also high question the short area quickness of Fournette. He is fast, not quick. His poor Stuff % and Elusive Rating would suggest that he is not making people miss. Once he gets past the LOS and gets his momentum going then he is very fast and terrifying, however.
Defenses were also stacking the box because of Elliott and he still ran over them. It opened also up the passing game for Prescott which gave him a lot of simple reads and one on one coverages to move the ball much easier. That's exactly what Bortles needs right now and this has gotta be the "all in" on Bortles year or bust.
Elliott faced 8+ in the box a 9th most 27.6% of plays, down from McFadden's 30.6% last year. It doesn't matter how terrifying the running game is or how bad the passing game situation is, team's just don't put 8 in the box very often any more. Fournette wouldn't change that much.
Quote:Elliott faced 8+ in the box a 9th most 27.6% of plays, down from McFadden's 30.6% last year. It doesn't matter how terrifying the running game is or how bad the passing game situation is, team's just don't put 8 in the box very often any more. Fournette wouldn't change that much.
McFadden last year = 13th
Rk Player
Att Att/G Yds Avg
13
Darren McFadden DAL RB 239 14.9 1,089 4.6
Elliott this year = 1st
Rk Player
Att Att/G Yds Avg
1
Ezekiel Elliott DAL RB 322 21.5 1,631 5.1
There is no comparison.
Quote:And the opportunity cost is Ramsey. Worth that? Heck no.
It depends on how you evaluate players. Elliott is on his way to being an all pro RB and Ramsey can be an all pro corner himself. They have the talent to be the best at their respective positions.
Right now where we are as a team today, though? With a struggling QB and an offense that was downright embarrassing at times? There's only two ways to move the football on offense and you're making it a hell of a lot easier on a lot of people if we draft a great running back. Fournette or Cook even.
Quote:Right now where we are as a team today, though? With a struggling QB and an offense that was downright embarrassing at times? There's only two ways to move the football on offense and you're making it a hell of a lot easier on a lot of people with a great running back.
Well, I think Ivory is a better RB than Fowler is a DE or Cyprien is an SS, so I think where we are as a team is that DE and SS are bigger needs, more important positions, harder to find in FA/later in draft, have longer careers with llonger peaks, and are injured less often.
If we were making a pro/con list of RB (Fournette/Cook) vs DE (Allen/Thomas) or S (Adams/Hooker) every single pro is on the DE/S side to me. The only one toward RB is trying to salvage the QB you already missed on at 3, which is convoluted logic to me to begin with as I've explained before. Two wrongs don't make a right.
Quote:Well, I think Ivory is a better RB than Fowler is a DE or Cyprien is an SS, so I think where we are as a team is that DE and SS are bigger needs, more important positions, harder to find in FA/later in draft, have longer careers with llonger peaks, and are injured less often.
If we were making a pro/con list of RB (Fournette/Cook) vs DE (Allen/Thomas) or S (Adams/Hooker) every single pro is on the DE/S side to me. The only one toward RB is trying to salvage the QB you already missed on at 3, which is convoluted logic to me to begin with as I've explained before. Two wrongs don't make a right.
Most pass rushers take time to develop so who says we draft Thomas or Allen and they aren't duds all year? If not longer to develop? I mean you just spent a top 3 pick on Fowler and you've got Ngakoue who went balls to the wall last season and you don't even know what you've got there, really. You are statistically in the top 10 with your defense and at the very least it's a serviceable defense. I'd take the Atlanta route that they did and sign a vet like Freeney (JPP?) and use that as insurance for your young guys.
But you flip the stats over on offense and it's just awful. The rushing, the interceptions, the lack of establishing anything. You can't win games like that. It's not even serviceable in college. A guy like Fournette or Cook gives you momentum and establishes tempo.
I think the one thing we can all agree on is that there is a lot of elite potential at the top of this draft and no matter who it is they are most likely going to be a game changer.
I feel like if a safety is regarded as a top ten pick he always turns out to be a great player. Pass rushers are so hit or miss. Take adams and don't look back, he's much safer than Thomas and just as good if not better of a talent
Quote:I feel like if a safety is regarded as a top ten pick he always turns out to be a great player. Pass rushers are so hit or miss. Take adams and don't look back, he's much safer than Thomas and just as good if not better of a talent
As far as safeties go Adams is like Landon Collins x 10. I'd take that. The most underrated thing about him is what a leader he is. Guy rallies the troops every single game.
Quote:I feel like if a safety is regarded as a top ten pick he always turns out to be a great player. Pass rushers are so hit or miss. Take adams and don't look back, he's much safer than Thomas and just as good if not better of a talent
Safeties do have an incredible hit rate. The worst top 10 safeties taken in the last 15 years I think it is were Roy Williams and Laron Landy, and they made like 6 pro bowls together.
I wonder why that is and why people don't grab them earlier. Landon Collins was considered a top prospect and was a 2nd rounder if I recall correctly. I mean people can hate Cyp but he was a top prospect and even he finished #1 this year in tackles for a safety.
Quote:Safeties do have an incredible hit rate. The worst top 10 safeties taken in the last 15 years I think it is were Roy Williams and Laron Landy, and they made like 6 pro bowls together.
Michael Huff was drafted top 10. Not that bad but probably the worst drafted top 10.
But yeah they have the lowest bust rate.
Cowboys would have had a worse record and been a worse team over the first 10 games with Ramsey.
Quote:Defenses were also stacking the box because of Elliott and he still ran over them. It opened also up the passing game for Prescott which gave him a lot of simple reads and one on one coverages to move the ball much easier. That's exactly what Bortles needs right now and this has gotta be the "all in" on Bortles year or bust.
I agree with you completely. Dak played well and showed good poise, but it was Zeke who was the catalyst of the cowboys offense.
Fournette isn't the same back as Zeke but he's clearly extremely talented. If he had a similar effect on Blake, who is way more experienced than dak, we could see a huge leap out of bortles and our offense.
Leonard fournette would also likely be considered the sexy pick, so I could imagine a lot of the more casual fans will get excited.
In terms of just being prospects though, Garrett, Thomas, Fournette, Allen, and Adams are all very close. It could come down to what's the more premium position, or who the front office thinks helps the team more.
Quote:Michael Huff was drafted top 10. Not that bad but probably the worst drafted top 10.
But yeah they have the lowest bust rate.
Mark Barron isn't really that good either.
Oh yeah you all are right. Barron and Huff were the worst examples.
Best case, hall of fame trajectories with Sean Taylor and Eric Berry.
Average, multiple pro bowlers Williams and Landry.
Worst case, long time solid starters Huff and Barron (even if Barron did have to switch to LB).
No other position comes close to that type of hit rate early in the draft. Combine that positional track record with Adams being one of the two elite prospects without injury and/or character flags (along with Solomon) and my belief that Cyprien is the worst non OL starter on the team and you see why Adams is my top choice at 4. Solomon is a close 2nd who is admittedly stealing more of my heart by the day.
Pass on Thomas. I'm tired of having guys on the team that get to the QB here and there and never ever finish with a sack. Jared Odrick is the king of that. We need speed and can find someone like Thomas in FA. DT is deep in free agency this season.
Quote:Pass on Thomas. I'm tired of having guys on the team that get to the QB here and there and never ever finish with a sack. Jared Odrick is the king of that. We need speed and can find someone like Thomas in FA. DT is deep in free agency this season.
Thomas will be a double digit sack artist in the NFL.
Thomas' combine will probably look something like this:
6'2''
273lbs
40 yard: 4.84
10 yard: 1.64
Vert: 37''
Broad: 10'06''
20 yard SS: 4.15
3 cone: 7.05
That's Watt level athleticism for his size.
Yeah, that 20 yard SS and 3 cone is ridiculous for a guy that size. As long as he gets a sub 5 40, his combine is going to be absurd.