Watching the SB one of the things that I took away from it was the amount of time that the pats and 'hawks give their quarterback to set up and make good throws. That was also true watching the 'hawks and packers play. Those quarterbacks have time to sit back there and read a book! Now think of what it's been like for the jags quarterbacks for around the last twelve years or so.
The contrast is startling! Even my wife, who isn't that much of a fan, noticed the amount of time the Aaron Rogers, Russell Wilson and Tom Brady have (usually) to set up and throw the ball. No wonder those quarterbacks seem really good... they have exceptional offensive linesmen in front of them!
In my opinion... our focus needs to be on our o-line. I'm sorry, but a first round draft pick linesman shouldn't need years of experience to just become average. Not all first rounders are gonna work out and right now I'm concerned that Joelckel might be a bust. If he was a later round pick I'd be a little more forgiving, but for a first rounder he's been pretty disappointing.
Watching good teams with a good o-line just makes what we've got here seem so much worse.
Now don't take away from them. A lot of them are also very good at figuring out what a defense is doing, but when you have that much time it is definitely easier.
Russell has awful pass protection
Russell Wilson was running around to by himself time & the Pats offense was designed to get the ball out of Brady's hands as quick as possible.
Brady only threw 2 passes longer then 20 yards he threw mostly 5 yd dump offs and Wilson had time sometimes because the Pats only rushed 3 and kept 8 in coverage it seemed he had all day to throw was two fold noone rushing noone to throw the ball to.
Quote:Watching the SB one of the things that I took away from it was the amount of time that the pats and 'hawks give their quarterback to set up and make good throws. That was also true watching the 'hawks and packers play. Those quarterbacks have time to sit back there and read a book! Now think of what it's been like for the jags quarterbacks for around the last twelve years or so.
Watching good teams with a good o-line just makes what we've got here seem so much worse.
Guys like Brady, Peyton, Rivers... they get a lot of time to throw the ball because teams generally don't want to blitz them too much. Bad things happen when you send too many people after them, so they generally have more people in coverage, than rushing the passer. you'll see four man rushes, three man rushes...... sometime even two man rushes.
Russell Wilson, they don't want to send to many guys after him, because he'll tuck it & run. They'd rather he throw the ball than run with it & since he's not killing them with the zone read, as he hands it off the majority of the time, they sit back & wait. They actually took one of their pass rushers & had him spy Wilson for most of the game.
Tom Brady was usually getting the ball out within 2.5 - 3 seconds, and still barely avoiding sacks.
Quote:Watching the SB one of the things that I took away from it was the amount of time that the pats and 'hawks give their quarterback to set up and make good throws. That was also true watching the 'hawks and packers play. Those quarterbacks have time to sit back there and read a book! Now think of what it's been like for the jags quarterbacks for around the last twelve years or so.
The contrast is startling! Even my wife, who isn't that much of a fan, noticed the amount of time the Aaron Rogers, Russell Wilson and Tom Brady have (usually) to set up and throw the ball. No wonder those quarterbacks seem really good... they have exceptional offensive linesmen in front of them!
In my opinion... our focus needs to be on our o-line. I'm sorry, but a first round draft pick linesman shouldn't need years of experience to just become average. Not all first rounders are gonna work out and right now I'm concerned that Joelckel might be a bust. If he was a later round pick I'd be a little more forgiving, but for a first rounder he's been pretty disappointing.
Watching good teams with a good o-line just makes what we've got here seem so much worse.
Brady also got rid of the ball quickly, and were throwing short passes to WRs and RBs.
Quote:Watching the SB one of the things that I took away from it was the amount of time that the pats and 'hawks give their quarterback to set up and make good throws. That was also true watching the 'hawks and packers play. Those quarterbacks have time to sit back there and read a book! Now think of what it's been like for the jags quarterbacks for around the last twelve years or so.
The contrast is startling! Even my wife, who isn't that much of a fan, noticed the amount of time the Aaron Rogers, Russell Wilson and Tom Brady have (usually) to set up and throw the ball. No wonder those quarterbacks seem really good... they have exceptional offensive linesmen in front of them!
In my opinion... our focus needs to be on our o-line. I'm sorry, but a first round draft pick linesman shouldn't need years of experience to just become average. Not all first rounders are gonna work out and right now I'm concerned that Joelckel might be a bust. If he was a later round pick I'd be a little more forgiving, but for a first rounder he's been pretty disappointing.
Watching good teams with a good o-line just makes what we've got here seem so much worse.
I got to agree. In today's NFL, if your oline is bad that makes your whole team bad.
Their lines aren't elite at all. They are elite and they give themselves the time with subtle moves in the pockets and getting the ball out quickly.
Quote:Their lines aren't elite at all. They are elite and they give themselves the time with subtle moves in the pockets and getting the ball out quickly.
I agree with this. Brady was having crazy pressure put on him but he moved around and got it done with great pocket awareness. He was the reason the Pats won, because the o-line and the running game were not getting it done. I thought Seattle did the right thing going after Brady nonstop, but he is too good to make bad decisions regularly (i.e. hes not Manning, he is clutch). I was very impressed. I thought the better team won, but Seatle had the game after that fluke catch by Kearse. I thought they had it in the bag and then they got cute with the pass play. Yeah it surprised everyone, except the guys on the field. Wasn't worth it with Marshawn on the team and running the way he had all day.
Quote:Guys like Brady, Peyton, Rivers... they get a lot of time to throw the ball because teams generally don't want to blitz them too much. Bad things happen when you send too many people after them, so they generally have more people in coverage, than rushing the passer. you'll see four man rushes, three man rushes...... sometime even two man rushes.
Russell Wilson, they don't want to send to many guys after him, because he'll tuck it & run. They'd rather he throw the ball than run with it & since he's not killing them with the zone read, as he hands it off the majority of the time, they sit back & wait. They actually took one of their pass rushers & had him spy Wilson for most of the game.
^^ Bingo
Remember when we had a serious down field threat with Jimmy Smith? Yeah Brunell could make a sandwich back behind our line.
Brady didnt really have much time he just got rid of the ball fast, and Pats were only rushing 4 so Wilson had plenty of time
Quote:Their lines aren't elite at all. They are elite and they give themselves the time with subtle moves in the pockets and getting the ball out quickly.
Exactly. Their lines are solid, but I wouldn't categorize them as being elite. It's about having a guy back there who can make quick decisions and get the ball out of there.
Our OLine is just fine.
Signed,
Boselli
It helps when your receivers know how to get open too. Edelman and Gronk were able to get good spacing on those short routes, something our rookie receivers didn't know how to do this year. Hopefully they figure it out next year.
Quote:It helps when your receivers know how to get open too. Edelman and Gronk were able to get good spacing on those short routes, something our rookie receivers didn't know how to do this year. Hopefully they figure it out next year.
A lot of that is coaching. Gronk is the exception because he's a physical freak but the plays they are calling and when they are calling them are huge.
They crushed the Seahawks on short outs all game. Why? Because they game planned for it and executed.
It's quite true that most of the time Brady was getting rid of the ball within 2-3 seconds. but he didn't seem to be scrambling for his life most of the time the way that we've observed Bortles to do. I suppose he is good enough of a quarterback to know how to effectively use the pocket protection... even with one of the best defenses in the league coming after him the whole game. I didn't observe Wilson to so much spend his time scrambling except when he had to, and then he tucked and ran down field, not backwards.
It was really educational to watch these too quarterbacks and how they moved (or didn't). By the way, I don't recall that I referred to either of those offensive lines as being 'elite', but I did say they are exceptional, and they are; and hey, they just played in the SB, so doesn't that kind'a mean that they are 'elite'?
That then brings us to what we saw with Aaron Rogers in the 'hawks/packers play off. Aaron Rogers was playing injured and not all that mobile. The 'hawks surely realized this and was trying to get to the man, yet, time after time, he had what seemed like ages to set up, look around and then throw. I agree that having receivers who get open are a part of it, as well as how hard the defense is actually coming after the quarterback, yet still... gads; it really appeared that he had a whole lot of time to stand back there and look around before throwing.
I'm just saying this because watching these teams play just makes it so much more poignantly obvious just how bad our o-line really is, and how far Blake has to go to learn to use the pocket. In college he was able to get away with scrambling and making 'desperation' passes, but it ain't gonna fly in the pro's. It would also help if he would just take note of what Wilson did and learn to just throw the ball away instead of trying to make plays where there isn't one and end up on his tail with lost yardage.
A bright future for this team really seems distant at the moment... or maybe I just need some coffee.
muddylips, I agree and disagree with you.
This teams problem is clearly the raw talent at the skill positions. The defensive game plans are so successful against this team because no one is winning their one on one challenges. The offensive line would look better if anyone was a play maker for our team.
Honestly, I think this was the most no name player team the Patriots have had in a superbowl. Gronk is the one spot where you can say top 5 for his position. Of course Brady is the reason.
The receivers on both teams seemed to get a lot more separation than our receivers are able to get. Also, my observation was that the officials were allowing a lot more contact between defenders and receivers than they allow in the regular season. I liked that.......let them battle for the ball a little more. It took the refs out of the game. It was well-officiated.