Quote:I agree SuperJville. They may get rid of Fisch at the end of the year, which is the right thing to do, but when the disaster continues into next season, Khan is really going to see the light then. He is taking into account that BB is a rookie, that's almost certain. Also, I bet Gus doesn't play cheerleader as much next year, and does his damndist to coach and win. At least I would if I was in his situation, and in fear of losing my job. Maybe Bradley is oblivious to what's going on around him, who knows?
I don't know that he has been a "cheerleader" recently. He has the look of a man who has been beaten to his core. Watch his postgame news conference from last week.
I think Gus and Dave expected a rough couple years to begin their tenure here....
I think starting 0-8 last year was a bit of a surprise, but they ended 4-12, roughly where the expectations were IMO..
Starting 1-10 this year though is a complete surprise though.
They expected the 2013 draft class to make significant strides forward - yet they haven't.
The only position group playing well is the defensive line - which is made up of veterans that already knew how to play.
Yes, there is a "process" and yes, we knew the first 2 years will be rough. Nobody expected this rough, this bad, and with such a stagnant 2013 draft class. That is what's concerning to me.
I say get rid of this coaching staff and finally dig deep into Khan's pockets and get a world class coaching staff. People that have proven track records (at least in parts of their careers) and with the ability to develop young players. Otherwise, I'm afraid the 2014 draft class will be stagnant in 2015 and we'll have the same conversations again.
Quote:I don't know that he has been a "cheerleader" recently. He has the look of a man who has been beaten to his core. Watch his postgame news conference from last week.
I think Gus just doesn't know any different. He's frustrated because his message isn't working. Yes, the players may be positive and they be playing hard for him - but there hasn't been any significant development or improvement.
I watched ESPN stating that Gus Bradley felt more time needed to be spent on offense focusing on the core plays (the plays that they do well each week) instead of new formations or new plays being added in against the Giants.
I think they need to revamp the playbook entirely and then focus on those core plays.
Quote:I watched ESPN stating that Gus Bradley felt more time needed to be spent on offense focusing on the core plays (the plays that they do well each week) instead of new formations or new plays being added in against the Giants.
I think they need to revamp the playbook entirely and then focus on those core plays.
he's been saying that for weeks now, nothing new.
2 weeks ago he talked about having core plays that Blake is comfortable with and just getting really good at those.
2 weeks of preparing like that and we scored 3 points against the Colts.
Quote:I think Gus just doesn't know any different. He's frustrated because his message isn't working. Yes, the players may be positive and they be playing hard for him - but there hasn't been any significant development or improvement.
You can only hype up a slug to move so fast, eventually a snake will eat it.
All of the credit or blame tends to rest on the Head Coach with most football teams. I dont think Gus is solely to blame for only 5 wins in over 22 games but he certaintly hasnt been the solution either.
At this point the Jaguars are out of the playoffs, and the wins are only a matter of pride. The team more important than winning has to develop. The young rookies and 2nd year players have to improve from their mistakes and gel together.
Instead of a win against the Giants I would much rather seen Aaron Colvin learn from mistakes and continue to improve in his 2nd game in the NFL. I want to see Telvin Smith became the permanent starter at the weak side, and Geno Hayes really own strong side. I want to see Arby Jones get another sack. I want to see CB McCray improve, and lets see Jeremy Harris start instead of bubble gum paying Gratz.
Quote:You can only hype up a slug to move so fast, eventually a snake will eat it.
All of the credit or blame tends to rest on the Head Coach with most football teams. I dont think Gus is solely to blame for only 5 wins in over 22 games but he certaintly hasnt been the solution either.
At this point the Jaguars are out of the playoffs, and the wins are only a matter of pride. The team more important than winning has to develop. The young rookies and 2nd year players have to improve from their mistakes and gel together.
Instead of a win against the Giants I would much rather seen Aaron Colvin learn from mistakes and continue to improve in his 2nd game in the NFL. I want to see Telvin Smith became the permanent starter at the weak side, and Geno Hayes really own strong side. I want to see Arby Jones get another sack. I want to see CB McCray improve, and lets see Jeremy Harris start instead of bubble gum paying Gratz.
We're not going to win UNLESS those things that you describe happen. We can't win without significant improvement, so winning is one way to objectively see that we're getting better.
The "get better" without looking at the final score stuff is BeeS.
Quote:he's been saying that for weeks now, nothing new.
2 weeks ago he talked about having core plays that Blake is comfortable with and just getting really good at those.
2 weeks of preparing like that and we scored 3 points against the Colts.
I think more of a west coast quick slant passes over the middle approach, or attacking the flat, screen passes. The occasional deep pass (at least once every drive) has to be done successful or not for Blake's development and our WRs plus keeps the opppsoing teams Safetys honest (i would love it if the first Offensive play of the game was a deep throw), even if they entire rest of the team blocks with only Hurns going deep.....
to give time for seperation.
On offense the Jaguars have to establish the throw first & then run (opposite I know but teams dont respect the Jaguars passing ability).
On defense the Giants Oline is suspect.. our Dline should get a few sacks this game as the Giants will tend to throw more with our weak CBs.
Quote:That was a defeatist game plan last Sunday. Whether that is from Fisch or higher, it was giving up.
They forced the run too much last week for sure, but who could blame them for trying after what the Patriots and Jonas Gray did to the clots the week before? The difference is the clots had to respect the passing game of the Patriots. They didn't have to do that against us. That's not on Fisch, that's on Blake. Fisch's blame extends to the fact that he was unwilling to deviate from the game plan when it proved to not be working. The clots defense was basically daring us to have our young QB beat them. He's not capable of doing that at this time. Our defense forcing turnovers early gave Fisch more time to be patient with the running game. If we started busted long runs at some point in the game, he'd be hailed as a genius for sticking with it. That didn't happen and he's getting deserved criticism. Hind sight is 20/20, but I think most people in Fisch's shoes given the information he had at the time might have done the same thing. Calling the game plan defeatist and stating that the coaching staff "gave up" is a bit much. Let's just hope we see some growth specifically in Blake between now and the end of the season.
"I can't believe they're not double teaming dez"
Quote:I think Gus and Dave expected a rough couple years to begin their tenure here....
I think starting 0-8 last year was a bit of a surprise, but they ended 4-12, roughly where the expectations were IMO..
Starting 1-10 this year though is a complete surprise though.
They expected the 2013 draft class to make significant strides forward - yet they haven't.
The only position group playing well is the defensive line - which is made up of veterans that already knew how to play.
Yes, there is a "process" and yes, we knew the first 2 years will be rough. Nobody expected this rough, this bad, and with such a stagnant 2013 draft class. That is what's concerning to me.
I say get rid of this coaching staff and finally dig deep into Khan's pockets and get a world class coaching staff. People that have proven track records (at least in parts of their careers) and with the ability to develop young players. Otherwise, I'm afraid the 2014 draft class will be stagnant in 2015 and we'll have the same conversations again.
Easy to say. Who you have in mind? Someone currently under contract or someone about to be fired?
One thing to remember regarding the OC:
Those of you wanting a new OC are saying you want a young QB who is having trouble learning this offense to have to learn a completely new playbook next year.
That definitely will impede his development. A little continuity for Bortles may be a good reason to keep Fisch in Caldwell's eyes.
Quote:If he isn't, we can all write letters to Shad Khan and Dave Caldwell telling them how angry we are...
Too direct. Let's just start multiple threads they won't read on message boards they don't read.
Quote:One thing to remember regarding the OC:
Those of you wanting a new OC are saying you want a young QB who is having trouble learning this offense to have to learn a completely new playbook next year.
Yeah but that shouldn't be the main reason for keeping Jedd.
Quote:Yeah but that shouldn't be the main reason for keeping Jedd.
I'm merely speculating what may be a reason that Caldwell/Bradley would keep him. Whether it's the main reason or the fourth one on a list of reasons, I think it's definitely present in the minds of Caldwell and Bradley.
A young QB that was very raw in his rookie year is going to take steps backwards for a while in year two if he has to learn a new offense. Given that mental errors from Bortles are a significant part of the Jags' offensive struggles - I think it's a big reason to at least consider keeping the coordinator.
Yeah I thought about it as well, I just don't think that should enter into the conversation.
If you think his scheme or play calling is keeping you back, you pull the trigger and fire him.
There is always negative side effects to any change, but that doesn't mean the change isn't for the overall good of the team
Quote:Yeah I thought about it as well, I just don't think that should enter into the conversation.
If you think his scheme or play calling is keeping you back, you pull the trigger and fire him.
Understood. I think it
definitely will enter the conversation because it's a legitimate factor. They have a lot riding on Bortles and his development.
As far as play calling keeping you back: I think it's about 35% O-line play/30% Bortles errors/ 25% young and or injured WR/ and maybe Fisch gets the remaining 10% of the blame. If that.
I realize you and others place more blame at Jedd's feet, but I still think he's severely handicapped by lack of execution and dumb mistakes on the field.
Quote:Yeah I thought about it as well, I just don't think that should enter into the conversation.
If you think his scheme or play calling is keeping you back, you pull the trigger and fire him.
There is always negative side effects to any change, but that doesn't mean the change isn't for the overall good of the team
Then you better be darn sure it's his scheme or play calling is keeping you back. Because you are going to set your own self back learning a new system.
When Fisch calls a rb screen to side of the blitz for an easy third down conversion and Bortles guns it over Toby's head is it really the play calling? When Bortles first pass of the game is a pick? Don't get me wrong, I love me some Bortles and can't wait for him to develop, but the execution has been so bad lately, I don't know if you can blame Fisch or any of the coaches with any certainty.
Quote:Then you better be darn sure it's his scheme or play calling is keeping you back. Because you are going to set your own self back learning a new system.
When Fisch calls a rb screen to side of the blitz for an easy third down conversion and Bortles guns it over Toby's head is it really the play calling? When Bortles first pass of the game is a pick? Don't get me wrong, I love me some Bortles and can't wait for him to develop, but the execution has been so bad lately, I don't know if you can blame Fisch or any of the coaches with any certainty.
Guns it over toby's head? looked to me like it hit him dead in the hands.
What about the loss of 5 yrds on the screen pass to lewis?
What about running it on 2nd and 13?
etc...
Quote:I think Gus and Dave expected a rough couple years to begin their tenure here....
I think starting 0-8 last year was a bit of a surprise, but they ended 4-12, roughly where the expectations were IMO..
Starting 1-10 this year though is a complete surprise though.
They expected the 2013 draft class to make significant strides forward - yet they haven't.
The only position group playing well is the defensive line - which is made up of veterans that already knew how to play.
Yes, there is a "process" and yes, we knew the first 2 years will be rough. Nobody expected this rough, this bad, and with such a stagnant 2013 draft class. That is what's concerning to me.
I say get rid of this coaching staff and finally dig deep into Khan's pockets and get a world class coaching staff. People that have proven track records (at least in parts of their careers) and with the ability to develop young players. Otherwise, I'm afraid the 2014 draft class will be stagnant in 2015 and we'll have the same conversations again.
I agree with this.
I doubt it will happen. Khan had two chances to hire a proven former NFL head coach and accepted 1) mediocrity and then 2) inexperience.
I will be very surprised if Gus or any coordinator other than Mallory is fired. At this point I'm pessimistic enough to believe that Mallory will also be retained.