Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Draft Hooker.

Hooker and Gibson as safeties,Jalen and Prince as Corners

I just scouted Booker. He won't be that good. He's the next Reggie Nelson.

It's not coincidence that Ramsey's 2 picks (first pick six) came post Gus. Wash unleashed the kid. I like the fact they will give him a chance to completely install his scheme.

 

edit; wrong info. Doh.

In this thread I discovered that not only is Yo Boy a better and more experienced NFL coach than Gus Bradley, he's better and more experienced than Doug Marrone and Tom Coughlin too. Why they don't just give him the top job I have no idea.

Quote:This x 1000...especially now that we have Ramsey.

Here's a fun little hypothetical nickel package with some possible draft picks involved:

 

Quote:I dunno, seems like we saw more of Jack after the Bradley dismissal.  I think we'll see Jack in a more defined role next year....stupid to leave that much speed on the bench.

He started and had 0 tackles in the last 2 games.

 

I'm not sure why people are so fixated on Jack. So far his skill set has not translated over to the NFL.

Quote:He started and had 0 tackles in the last 2 games.

 

I'm not sure why people are so fixated on Jack. So far his skill set has not translated over to the NFL.

 

Do you think we've seen enough to really know that?  

 

I mean playing base Sam/Otto in Bradley's scheme isn't an ideal showcase for a guy touted as a great fit at 4/3 Will with off-the-charts coverage skills. 

 

Do you think he should get a shot at Mike with the ones in preseason?  How would you try to use him if not at Mike? 

 

Asking out of genuine curiosity because I don't have a clear answer or strong opinion on the matter.

 Posluszny's play in 2016 didn't exactly open the door for him to take over, so his "assumed role" is very uncertain now. 

Quote:Do you think we've seen enough to really know that?  

 

I mean playing base Sam/Otto in Bradley's scheme isn't an ideal showcase for a guy touted as a great fit at 4/3 Will with off-the-charts coverage skills. 

 

Do you think he should get a shot at Mike with the ones in preseason?  How would you try to use him if not at Mike? 

 

Asking out of genuine curiosity because I don't have a clear answer or strong opinion on the matter.

 Posluszny's play in 2016 didn't exactly open the door for him to take over, so his "assumed role" is very uncertain now. 

So far he hasn't been impressive. That doesn't necessarily mean he will never turn the corner and be a great player.

 

I'm not buying the scheme factor. Good players make the most out of their opportunities regardless of scheme. Lets face it, Jack has been pretty underwhelming for a player that some had projected as a top 5 pick. Heck, he has been pretty underwhelming for a 2nd rd pick.

 

I was critical of Jack coming out of college due to his production not matching his hype. So far, he hasn't proven me wrong.

 

Don't get me wrong, I do realize he has a great skill set and I want him to succeed, but after his first year, you have to still color me as skeptical.

Quote:So far he hasn't been impressive. That doesn't necessarily mean he will never turn the corner and be a great player.

 

I'm not buying the scheme factor. Good players make the most out of their opportunities regardless of scheme. Lets face it, Jack has been pretty underwhelming for a player that some had projected as a top 5 pick. Heck, he has been pretty underwhelming for a 2nd rd pick.

 

I was critical of Jack coming out of college due to his production not matching his hype. So far, he hasn't proven me wrong.

 

Don't get me wrong, I do realize he has a great skill set and I want him to succeed, but after his first year, you have to still color me as skeptical.

 

That's a fair take. 

 

Outside of a half dozen of flashes of speed and a couple of well timed hits, he has been pretty average. Perhaps the scheme didn't necessarily mask his ability but it definitely limited his time on the field/ number of opportunities. 

 

Would you be inclined to try to use him in a position other than SAM if you were in Wash's shoes? 

I can go the rest of my life without hearing the words otto or leo..


Gus killed me on that crap. I've associated otto and leo to not getting sacks and losing the game..

Quote:So far he hasn't been impressive. That doesn't necessarily mean he will never turn the corner and be a great player.

 

I'm not buying the scheme factor. Good players make the most out of their opportunities regardless of scheme. Lets face it, Jack has been pretty underwhelming for a player that some had projected as a top 5 pick. Heck, he has been pretty underwhelming for a 2nd rd pick.

 

I was critical of Jack coming out of college due to his production not matching his hype. So far, he hasn't proven me wrong.

 

Don't get me wrong, I do realize he has a great skill set and I want him to succeed, but after his first year, you have to still color me as skeptical.

 

 

He barely saw the field and the small percentage of the time he did see the field he was not put in the best position for his skills. 

 

clearly we need to see more of him before making any judgments, but a lot of coaches and players talked about how he would flash in practice.

 

lets not forget that he did just come back from a very serious injury as well.

 

the guy has tons of talent and upside. good production in college. he is the least of my worries. 

Quote:That's a fair take. 

 

Outside of a half dozen of flashes of speed and a couple of well timed hits, he has been pretty average. Perhaps the scheme didn't necessarily mask his ability but it definitely limited his time on the field/ number of opportunities. 

 

Would you be inclined to try to use him in a position other than SAM if you were in Wash's shoes? 

That's a tough question because who do you bump? Poz? Telvin? These are two extremely productive players that you would have to move to try out a guy that hasn't been that productive with the opportunities given.

 

People often talk about moving him to safety, but he would be more of a tweener player and tweeners typically don't work out that well in the NFL. He may have had the speed and quickness to play safety in college, but I don't think he could do that in the NFL.

 

I think LB is his best fit, but like I said, who do you bump to try him out at a different position without possibly shooting yourself in the foot?

Quote:He barely saw the field and the small percentage of the time he did see the field he was not put in the best position for his skills.


clearly we need to see more of him before making any judgments, but a lot of coaches and players talked about how he would flash in practice.


lets not forget that he did just come back from a very serious injury as well.


the guy has tons of talent and upside. good production in college. he is the least of my worries.

So maybe just maybe, he saw so little time because the position best suited for his skill set was being manned by a player who was playing to well to put on the bench.

Quote:He barely saw the field and the small percentage of the time he did see the field he was not put in the best position for his skills. 

 

clearly we need to see more of him before making any judgments, but a lot of coaches and players talked about how he would flash in practice.

 

lets not forget that he did just come back from a very serious injury as well.

 

the guy has tons of talent and upside. good production in college. he is the least of my worries. 

I understand your argument, I was just hoping for a little bit more from the opportunities he had.

 

I'm not rushing to judgement here, I'm just evaluating what we have had the opportunity to see. So far I'm just finding it a bit underwhelming.

Quote:So far he hasn't been impressive. That doesn't necessarily mean he will never turn the corner and be a great player.

 

I'm not buying the scheme factor. Good players make the most out of their opportunities regardless of scheme. Lets face it, Jack has been pretty underwhelming for a player that some had projected as a top 5 pick. Heck, he has been pretty underwhelming for a 2nd rd pick.

 

I was critical of Jack coming out of college due to his production not matching his hype. So far, he hasn't proven me wrong.

 

Don't get me wrong, I do realize he has a great skill set and I want him to succeed, but after his first year, you have to still color me as skeptical.

Do you think scheme is not a factor at all, or just in Jack's case?

 

How do you explain Jerry Hughes?

 

He was drafted in the first round by the Colts and was a complete bust.  Goes to Buffalo and becomes a double digit sack guy.  Or for that matter...the entire Buffalo defense, that was a top unit under Marrone, but the same guys in a different scheme (Rex Ryan's) couldn't stop a runny nose.

 

Yes, good players make the most of their opportunities, but they have to get opportunities, and they have to be in a position to use their skills effectively.

 

Senderrick Marks proved to be a good DT for us.  Somehow, I suspect he would not be considered a good player if lined up at CB.  Same player. but unquestionably less desirable outcome.

 

Jack's example isn't as dramatic as the Marks hypothetical, of course.  But the point is clear.

Quote:I just scouted Booker. He won't be that good. He's the next Reggie Nelson.

Reggie Nelson has had a good career...

Quote:Do you think scheme is not a factor at all, or just in Jack's case?


How do you explain Jerry Hughes?


He was drafted in the first round by the Colts and was a complete bust. Goes to Buffalo and becomes a double digit sack guy. Or for that matter...the entire Buffalo defense, that was a top unit under Marrone, but the same guys in a different scheme (Rex Ryan's) couldn't stop a runny nose.


Yes, good players make the most of their opportunities, but they have to get opportunities, and they have to be in a position to use their skills effectively.


Senderrick Marks proved to be a good DT for us. Somehow, I suspect he would not be considered a good player if lined up at CB. Same player. but unquestionably less desirable outcome.


Jack's example isn't as dramatic as the Marks hypothetical, of course. But the point is clear.

Even if this were a static 4-3, we would have the same problem. I thought we all went into this thinking he was the MLB of the future? Poz delayed the future for a year, he'll be tasked with trying to do it again this year.

Quote:So maybe just maybe, he saw so little time because the position best suited for his skill set was being manned by a player who was playing to well to put on the bench.

I heard this discussion on 1010xl one morning.

 

Is it the coaching staff that is mistakenly keeping him off the field or is it the fact he hasn't shown enough to deserve more playing time?

 

As critical as people have been about the coaching decisions, it's hard to fathom that even an inept staff would keep the best option off the field.

Quote:Reggie Nelson has had a good career...

 

I was about to say the same... took far too long for him to grasp the NFL, or at least our scheme in Jax.

 

But once he matured and/or found the right fit (whichever came first or both) he became pretty good.

Quote:I heard this discussion on 1010xl one morning.


Is it the coaching staff that is mistakenly keeping him off the field or is it the fact he hasn't shown enough to deserve more playing time?


As critical as people have been about the coaching decisions, it's hard to fathom that even an inept staff would keep the best option off the field.

That's presuming that an inept coaching staff can correctly identity the best option.