Jacksonville Jaguars Fan Forums

Quote:Watt is a helluva player...period.


I don't knock Watt when I say this, but I am not sure he is at LT's level.


I know the one back offense was created by Joe Gibbs specifically in response to LT. They wanted a bigger body (a TE) to counter him.


As it stands now, I do not know of any offensive innovations spurred out of necessity to block Watt.


But Watt is a dominant player with the ability to impact any game at any time.


Though I hate the plays he makes against the Jaguars, he's one of those players I can say I had the honor to watch.

At this point, you can't reinvent the wheel, there's nothing nobody can invent that already hasn't been done before. So to say that Watt isn't playing on a LT level, just because he hasn't created a new scheme never seen before is a bad argument. Outside of just taking a bat to his knees, what else do you expect offenses to do? They're already triple teaming him.

Quote:This. Watt is special player no doubt but LT was more than special he was unstoppable in 86.

Last night was proof that Watt cannot and will not win an NFL MVP. His stellar game still resulted in a loss. There is good reason QB's win more often than not.

Same reason a pitcher should never be named MVP in MLB.

Lame and lazy. So your only argument is that LT won a MVP..like he would've been able to do that on this Texans team in this pass happy league. Watt has already had a season that far exceeded LT's 86 season. If Watt can't even be in discussion for NFL MVP after the performance of 2012 (which might be the greatest defensive season ever) I doubt he'll ever win it, but that's not a knock on him. Let's face it, that's a offensive award now.


Watt is on his way to winning his second defensive MVP trophy in only his 4th year in the league.

Monster.

7 tackles 3 tackle for loss 2 sacks and 2 forced fumbles.


He has more tfl in one game than Tyson Alualu has in last three years combined.

Quote:At this point, you can't reinvent the wheel, there's nothing nobody can invent that already hasn't been done before. So to say that Watt isn't playing on a LT level, just because he hasn't created a new scheme never seen before is a bad argument. Outside of just taking a bat to his knees, what else do you expect offenses to do? They're already triple teaming him.

Perhaps it is a bad argument.

 

I just think that if there is a player that has spurred innovation in an attempt to stop him, that deserves special consideration.  Again, it wasn't so much a knock against Watt as much as it was a measure of LT's impact.  Even with that, I said I wasn't sure if he was at LT's level.  Not a definitive statement.

 

I've already stated it's an honor to watch him play...as a Jaguars fan.

 

I've already stated that if he continues on his current track, he'll be amongst the top three DEs I've ever seen, and I've been watching football now for 37 years.

 

At this point, he's being discussed amongst the likes of LT, Reggie White and Bruce Smith.  It's not as if I am putting him in Alualu's class.

 

Not sure what else you want.

Quote:Monster.

 

cyookie?

Quote:Perhaps it is a bad argument.

 

I just think that if there is a player that has spurred innovation in an attempt to stop him, that deserves special consideration.  Again, it wasn't so much a knock against Watt as much as it was a measure of LT's impact.  Even with that, I said I wasn't sure if he was at LT's level.  Not a definitive statement.

 

I've already stated it's an honor to watch him play...as a Jaguars fan.

 

I've already stated that if he continues on his current track, he'll be amongst the top three DEs I've ever seen, and I've been watching football now for 37 years.

 

At this point, he's being discussed amongst the likes of LT, Reggie White and Bruce Smith.  It's not as if I am putting him in Alualu's class.

 

Not sure what else you want.

I'm just trying to understand your "LT created a new scheme" argument. Watt's now facing those same scheme's. At some point you run out of scheme's and just start recycling them, which the league has been doing for years.

 

Quote:7 tackles 3 tackle for loss 2 sacks and 2 forced fumbles.

He has more tfl in one game than Tyson Alualu has in last three years combined.

J.J. Watt, a Defensive End, has more TDs than all of our RBs combined.

Quote: 


J.J. Watt, a Defensive End, has more TDs than all of our RBs combined.

He also has more than more TDs than Calvin Johnson, Marshawn Lynch, LeSean McCoy, and Frank Gore.  Watt is one of the best to ever play the game!

<div><a class="" href='https://twitter.com/SportsCenter'> <b>SportsCenter</b> <span> <span>@SportsCenter </span> </span> </a>  ·  <a class="" href='https://twitter.com/SportsCenter/status/520575536020860929' title="7:04 AM - 10 Oct 2014"> <span> 58m 58 minutes ago </a> </span>
</div>
<p class="">Crazy Stat of Day: J.J. Watt has as many touchdowns (3) as Calvin Johnson, LeSean McCoy and Larry Fitzgerald combined.

Quote:I'm just trying to understand your "LT created a new scheme" argument. Watt's now facing those same scheme's. At some point you run out of scheme's and just start recycling them, which the league has been doing for years.

Despite all of his play, a team still hung 30+ points on his team, and 20+ of those in the first quarter.


Watt is definitely elite right now, but there are better players throughout history. That's what Bullseye is trying to say.


Even though he doesn't need my clarification.

Quote:Despite all of his play, a team still hung 30+ points on his team, and 20+ of those in the first quarter.


Watt is definitely elite right now, but there are better players throughout history. That's what Bullseye is trying to say.


Even though he doesn't need my clarification.

 

It also shows you why in NFL importance it is 

 

Elite QB

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Everything else

Quote:Despite all of his play, a team still hung 30+ points on his team, and 20+ of those in the first quarter.

Watt is definitely elite right now, but there are better players throughout history. That's what Bullseye is trying to say.

Even though he doesn't need my clarification.

At the end of the day it's still a team game (secondary played like crap, couldn't even line up correctly pre-snap). And it's not like the Texans have been getting manhandled every game, that was the first time they allowed a first quarter touchdown, but yeah.. The QB position is the most important position, nobody is arguing that.


LT wouldn't of won a SB without Phil Simms either. So to judge if a player is or isn't in another player's class strictly based on the other players that play around him makes zero sense. That's what I'm trying to say. It's funny we're discussing this though , because even though the Texans lost (again team game) when Watt's name came up so did LT's in the national sports news cycle today.. but I guess since his team sucks it can't be discussed huh?

Quote:Despite all of his play, a team still hung 30+ points on his team, and 20+ of those in the first quarter.


Watt is definitely elite right now, but there are better players throughout history. That's what Bullseye is trying to say.


Even though he doesn't need my clarification.

 

NFL is different today then it was back in the day.  Offense is just going to score points even if LT was playing in these days and times.  That shouldn't definitely not be a knock on Watt whatsoever.  He takes over games, period.  Scary to think how good he will be once Clowney comes back.

To put it in perspective:

 

LT's stats first 3 years:

Sacks - 16.5

INT's - 4

Fumble Recovery - 0

Passes Defended - 0

 

JJ Watt:

Sacks - 36.5

INT's - 0

Fumble Recovery - 6

Passes Defended - 27

 

I mean you can certainly make the argument that Watt is on his way to surpass LT.  Whether you agree or not is one thing, but the argument can be made.  Also did not include this years stats.  And yes, very simplistic way to look at it.  Stats aren't everything.

Quote:To put it in perspective:

 

LT's stats first 3 years:

Sacks - 16.5

INT's - 4

Fumble Recovery - 0

Passes Defended - 0

 

JJ Watt:

Sacks - 36.5

INT's - 0

Fumble Recovery - 6

Passes Defended - 27

 

I mean you can certainly make the argument that Watt is on his way to surpass LT.  Whether you agree or not is one thing, but the argument can be made.  Also did not include this years stats.  And yes, very simplistic way to look at it.  Stats aren't everything.

The problem with this analysis is that LT's 2nd season, 1982, was a strike shortened season. The regular season was 8-9 games that year instead of the normal 16.

JJ Watt is as special as you can get in terms of NFL players right now.  He's as good as it gets.  

 

He's a good guy off the field too.  

Quote:The problem with this analysis is that LT's 2nd season, 1982, was a strike shortened season. The regular season was 8-9 games that year instead of the normal 16.

 

Unless he was going to get a sack or two a game, and defend 3-4 passes a game, and recover a fumble a game then he wasn't going to be close to Watt in any of those stats.

 

LT gets the notoriety because of his position and a few other factors that include the time he played and where the game was at in terms of x's and o's at the time.  Sure he may have changed the way offenses played, but that was 30 years ago.  If Watt had played in that time period, he would have done the same and likely more to opposing offenses.  

 

Teams are having to key on Watt specifically and they still can't stop him.  He is that defense and that team.  LT was a good pass rusher but I'd take Watt > LT when looking at their first few years in the league.  It wasn't even that close.

 

Both are special talents but Watt is on a whole different level with his size, speed and athleticism.  The guy looks like he could be an All-Pro TE too.  He's a freak.

Because of the team He plays on and the position he plays, Watt most likely will not win MVP honors, but he's every bit as destructive as LT and all of the other greats before him, he sits at the table with them.


With his 20.5 sacks Watt becomes the only player in NFL History to record multiple 20 sack seasons. In only his 4th season he already has two of the most prolific seasons ever posted by a defensive player and will already be a two time DPOY award winner.