Quote:I think you chimed in.
I think saying he's not a starter, a bust, and that the Jaguar media made him out to be something he's not is move of a statement of facts than chiming in with my opinion.
I have many more reasons for thinking he was a god awful pick, but the fact is he's a bottom of the roster player, finally gets paid like one, and doesn't start. I don't care anymore.
I have always wondered if it would have been different if he didn't hurt his knee in the Oklahoma drill against Manuwai, and then try to play through then rest and rehab it for two seasons instead of just getting surgery right away.
He was an all caps FREAK athlete before that. 7.15 3 cone, 35.5" vertical, and 116" broad jump at 295 pounds is all 95%+ percentile. All of those are significantly better than Fowler at 34 pounds heavier. What might have been...
Was he a good pick? No.
Has he been a good Jag. Yes
Imagine Brad Meester was drafted where Alualu was drafted. Good pick?
Quote:As a 10th overall pick, Alualu is pure trash. As a 4th rounder, Alualu was a good pick.
The way some Jag fans desperately put below average players on a pedestal is sickening.
THIS x infitiy. Dude some people have Stockholm Syndrome on this board. It's really sad.
And some people need to cling to his draft status, which he had no control over, rather than examine his 7 seasons and 83 starts at the position he plays. Maybe it's just me, but I don't think a below average player would have lasted this long. Is he Pro Bowl calibre? No, but he's far from trash.
I've always been a alu alu fan it wasn't his fault he was drafted that high but to stick up for him a lil other than geno Atkins Suh n jpp that dline class sucked Lamar Houston was good for a year u can say Brandon graham but that dudes a bum too
Quote:Nobody is saying Alualu is an NFL All Pro, they are simply saying he is a better player than many on this board give him credit for.
Too many people on this board bring up where he was picked when people give him credit for being a good player. You guys can't let that hate go. If Alualu was the 2nd or 3rd round pick that he should have been he would be one of the most loved Jaguars, and well deserved.
Male bovine excrement!
Completely remove his draft position from the equation.
Can you recall any truly dominant performances from him? Can you or anyone recall a time we knew the interior run defense was not a concern because Alualu was there?
I won't even bother with Stroud and Henderson comparisons.
Heck, it's an insult to compare him with Gary Walker and Seth Payne. Neither of them were first round picks and vastly outperformed Alualu
He hasn't reached Malik Jackson or Senderrick Marks level of production. Jackson wasn't a first round pick.
As another poster observed, Abry Johnson has shown more signs of dominance. I'd also put Pot Roast and Roy Miller above him. None of them were first round picks either.
At most, Alualu is the 10th best DT in team history. He's a guy. That's all he ever was, or will be.
Quote:Call me crazy but I would much rather had Earl Thomas, Jason Pierre-Paul, Dez Bryant, Maurkice Pouncy, Devin McCourty.
Any one of the above picks (that were available to us) would have changed the composition of our future draft picks (domino effect) making their impact and the impact of other players that we may have gotten even greater.
I wanted JPP after watching him do those twenty back hand springs in a row or Earl Thomas after Mayock said he was the best defensive back he's ever evaluated. Tyson would have been a solid second round pick.
Quote:Male bovine excrement!
Completely remove his draft position from the equation.
Can you recall any truly dominant performances from him? Can you or anyone recall a time we knew the interior run defense was not a concern because Alualu was there?
I won't even bother with Stroud and Henderson comparisons.
Heck, it's an insult to compare him with Gary Walker and Seth Payne. Neither of them were first round picks and vastly outperformed Alualu
He hasn't reached Malik Jackson or Senderrick Marks level of production. Jackson wasn't a first round pick.
As another poster observed, Abry Johnson has shown more signs of dominance. I'd also put Pot Roast and Roy Miller above him. None of them were first round picks either.
At most, Alualu is the 10th best DT in team history. He's a guy. That's all he ever was, or will be.
Seth Payne?
Alualu has been more productive and a more consistent producer than Payne and that production was accomplished in 3 less seasons than Payne.
If Tyson were paying on the jaguar teams back in their heyday, people wouldn't be having this conversation. everyone would be fondly remembering him too. It's easy to exaggerate someone's weaknesses when their career was spent on bad teams.
A more productive guy is trash and a less productive guy is fondly remembered. Just goes to show you the double standard people set in their mind based solely on draft position.
Quote:Seth Payne?
Alualu has been more productive and a more consistent producer than Payne and that production was accomplished in 3 less seasons than Payne.
If Tyson were paying on the jaguar teams back in their heyday, people wouldn't be having this conversation. everyone would be fondly remembering him too. It's easy to exaggerate someone's weaknesses when their career was spent on bad teams.
A more productive guy is trash and a less productive guy is fondly remembered. Just goes to show you the double standard people set in their mind based solely on draft position.
Yes, Seth Payne.
His first couple of years, Payne struggled mightily.
However, by 2000, he and Walker were a formidable DT duo. His play helped keep Stroud on the bench in Stroud's rookie year in 2001.
I disagree about the whole heyday argument.
I do not view Renaldo Wynn favorably at all, and he was on the Jaguars best ever team. I view him and Alualu about the same.
Both were just guys.
Chris Hudson was also on the team in the heyday. I would take Gipson over him every single time.
Quote:JPP is a defensive end, Alualu is a tackle. Even comparing the two shows your lack of knowledge.
Alualu is not exactly a tackle, In college he was a 3-4 DE, and while he'll occasionally take a snap or two at tackle, with the Jaguars he's typically been a 4-3 LDE. Gene somehow felt that Alualu was a better defensive end than JPP, and we know this because Gene kept talking about how great of a pass rusher he expected Alualu to be.
Granted the guy would have been a great 3rd round pick, and not a horrible 2nd round pick, but as a top 10 pick in his particular draft class, he's stunk.
Quote:Male bovine excrement!
Completely remove his draft position from the equation.
Can you recall any truly dominant performances from him? Can you or anyone recall a time we knew the interior run defense was not a concern because Alualu was there?
I won't even bother with Stroud and Henderson comparisons.
Heck, it's an insult to compare him with Gary Walker and Seth Payne. Neither of them were first round picks and vastly outperformed Alualu
He hasn't reached Malik Jackson or Senderrick Marks level of production. Jackson wasn't a first round pick.
As another poster observed, Abry Johnson has shown more signs of dominance. I'd also put Pot Roast and Roy Miller above him. None of them were first round picks either.
At most, Alualu is the 10th best DT in team history. He's a guy. That's all he ever was, or will be.
He's not going to stack up against the Jaguars better DTs because he's a LDE, although in that light I far preferred Renaldo Wynn. Now I will give Alualu the edge over Joel Smeenge. While Smeenge was a far more dominant pass rusher,he stunk vs the run by comparison. Alualu will at least hold the edge. For that matter, I'll even give Alualu the edge over Marcellus Wiley, although Reggie Hayward was better during his short stint. Odrick is also a better 4-3 LDE when healthy which is why he starts over Alualu when active.
Quote:Alualu is not exactly a tackle, In college he was a 3-4 DE, and while he'll occasionally take a snap or two at tackle, with the Jaguars he's typically been a 4-3 LDE. Gene somehow felt that Alualu was a better defensive end than JPP, and we know this because Gene kept talking about how great of a pass rusher he expected Alualu to be.
Granted the guy would have been a great 3rd round pick, and not a horrible 2nd round pick, but as a top 10 pick in his particular draft class, he's stunk.
Gene didn't expect him to be JPP. He expected Alualu to be Aaron Donald. Alualu just doesn't have that kind of quickness though.
Quote:Gene didn't expect him to be JPP. He expected Alualu to be Aaron Donald. Alualu just doesn't have that kind of quickness though.
Well, Alualu was never defined quite like we'd currently define the "LEO" spot, but he was expected to get after the passer. Gene felt he was the better overall DE where JPP was thought to be one of those OLB/DE hybrids sort of like Dante Fowler was thought to be.
Seth Payne couldn't even keep a starting role with the Jaguars. He was another guy that you could plug in there and hold his ground, but the one year the Jaguars were going to rely on him to be a starter he folded under the pressure.
Again, nobody is saying Alualu is a pro bowler, an elite player, or anything close to that....but we are saying that he's the kind of guy you can put in there and know that things aren't going to completely blow up. He's the guy that makes a few good plays a game and how many defensive end/tackles have been cut from the roster since he's been here?
Quote:Gene didn't expect him to be JPP. He expected Alualu to be Aaron Donald. Alualu just doesn't have that kind of quickness though.
But honestly, he might have had that kind of quickness. In the drills that simulate quick twitch kind of explosion Donald had a 32" vertical and 116" broad jump at 285 lbs. Alualu had a 36" vertical and 116" broad jump at 295 lbs. He also showed some crazy quickness and explosion in his college highlights.
Again, had he not hurt his knee in that Oklahoma drill (and then exacerbate it by refusing surgery for two seasons) we might have a very different story.
Quote:Seth Payne couldn't even keep a starting role with the Jaguars. He was another guy that you could plug in there and hold his ground, but the one year the Jaguars were going to rely on him to be a starter he folded under the pressure.
Again, nobody is saying Alualu is a pro bowler, an elite player, or anything close to that....but we are saying that he's the kind of guy you can put in there and know that things aren't going to completely blow up. He's the guy that makes a few good plays a game and how many defensive end/tackles have been cut from the roster since he's been here?
Seth Payne was a full time starter for the Jaguars for three full seasons between 1999-2001.
<a class="bbc_url" href='http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/P/PaynSe20.htm'>http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/P/PaynSe20.htm</a>
His best year, he recorded 5 sacks. Alualu never got that many sacks in a year.
Quote:He's not going to stack up against the Jaguars better DTs because he's a LDE, although in that light I far preferred Renaldo Wynn. Now I will give Alualu the edge over Joel Smeenge. While Smeenge was a far more dominant pass rusher,he stunk vs the run by comparison. Alualu will at least hold the edge. For that matter, I'll even give Alualu the edge over Marcellus Wiley, although Reggie Hayward was better during his short stint. Odrick is also a better 4-3 LDE when healthy which is why he starts over Alualu when active.
Questions regarding Alualu holding the edge. Recall the long TD run by McCoy in the Buffalo game.
Pre snap, where did Alualu line up? Where did he end up by the time McCoy got through the hole?